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Thread: Shooting mess

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Buckeye, Az.
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    7,989

    Re: Shooting mess

    There is no reason you can't go talk to them, in a polite way. I've done it many times. The problem you face is that anger is the emotion you're filled with once a ricochet gets close, or you've been picking up people's trash all day. What is needed is education and you just missed the opportunity to give some. All you have to do is say that areas are being closed down all over the state because of dangerous shooting, accidents and trash and ask them to do their part. But if you roll up on them with the same tone you're displaying here, you'll only make it worse. That tone certainly wouldn't work with me.

    There used to be a website called RidingArizona dot Com. I used to talk to people then ask them to join that site. It really seemed to help. Maybe you could invite them to join this website?


    That being said, complaining about it on a forum has never helped in any way unless it's followed with an offer to lead a clean up of the area!

    Posting pictures on a public forum so that the greenies and the land managers can use them in their meetings to show why the deserts should be closed to all users is also not very helpful.

    As the land managers shut down popular shooting places, because of the trash left behind and the complaints being filed, the shooters go elsewhere. If nobody had ever complained about it in the first place, we would have a select number of shooting areas that could be cleaned by good citizens doing clean ups. Now, they are everywhere.

    Also, this seems to be a drama thread, so let's wait till it's too hot to wheel before we take this to 10 pages long!!
    Non-College Educated Working Class White Deplorable....

  2. #17
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    North phoenix,
    Posts
    3,856

    Re: Shooting mess

    LOL, its inherent to the beast, its uneducated folks buying shooters cause they saw'm on xbox or tv, can't tell you how many times i've had ugly discussions with stupid casual shooters, generally if a real serious shooter is near he/she will attempt to educate them sometimes its a positive reaction and sometimes not so positive. I shoot alot as do most of my associates, and its nothing for us to come home with bags of others trash,
    all agree it irresponsible adults, or wanna be adults who are probably accustomed to their mommy picking up after them.

    And sometimes it is necessary to educate them on gun safety, now that in itself is quite a chore. most beginners will take it well , but again there is the out of normal a hole. just need to know how to deal with it.
    we have been trying for years to educate many, seems like a never ending line of stupid to deal with.
    nice rant though, and the pics, well just fodder for the anti in shooting and wheeling
    just saying
    rj

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    over the hill and through the cactus
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    8,305

    Re: Shooting mess

    Quote Originally Posted by weekend warrior View Post
    This is all of this spot picked up. I just barely fit in the space in the Jeep behind the seat.
    Thank you for helping to keep our public lands clean and open!

    Rep points sent...

    "Lophat is not going anywhere, it's a reference. This forum would fold up and die if he left. LOL!" -- OTR-93YJ

    "if they are like LoPhat, then their heads are stuck so far up their rear they have re-emerged as a head." -- From_Catherine

    "Lo-Phat.. Don't wash the XJ. You don't want someone to confuse it as a mall crawler.." -- Will E


  4. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Location
    Mesa
    Posts
    212

    Re: Shooting mess

    Quote Originally Posted by LO PHAT View Post
    Thank you for helping to keep our public lands clean and open!

    Rep points sent...
    Thanks for being able to weed through the b.s.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Location
    Mesa
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    212

    Re: Shooting mess

    so me posting the pics of what we cleaned up is gonna help "them" close the trails. We cleaned up the mess instead of leaving it there. Leaving it there is what will close everything . well I took down all the pics just in case.





    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
    Last edited by weekend warrior; 10-11-2018 at 12:51 AM.

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
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    Buckeye, Az.
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    Re: Shooting mess

    Quote Originally Posted by weekend warrior View Post
    so me posting the pics of what we cleaned up is gonna help "them" close the trails. We cleaned up the mess instead of leaving it there. Leaving it there is what will close everything . well I took down all the pics just in case.





    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

    Yes, it will. I've been in meetings with the land managers and have seen first hand they use pictures such as the ones you posted to show people in the room the damage being done. Of course they leave out the part about the trash being picked up by responsible people later. When you walk into a room and the tripods are displaying those kinds of images, there is no rebuttal that will sway the environmental nazis in the room.

    Thank you for removing them. Thank you for doing your part to help keep the areas clean and open.

    Rep points sent!
    Non-College Educated Working Class White Deplorable....

  7. #22

    Shooting mess

    Quote Originally Posted by OTR-93YJ View Post
    Yes, it will. I've been in meetings with the land managers and have seen first hand they use pictures such as the ones you posted to show people in the room the damage being done. Of course they leave out the part about the trash being picked up by responsible people later. When you walk into a room and the tripods are displaying those kinds of images, there is no rebuttal that will sway the environmental nazis in the room.

    Thank you for removing them. Thank you for doing your part to help keep the areas clean and open.

    Rep points sent!
    ^^^^This. Sadly Doug is correct. Ammo is ammo. They both can and will use it to benefit their objectives, even if it bites you in the process. Also, area clean ups, especially of shooting sites have been cut back dramatically. We used to have them regularly, a decade ago. This isnít due to lack of funding as much as it has to do with Ďusí being a litigious society. Shooting sites are, by nature of the lead and things they shoot up (hard drives, Mercury thermostats, asbestos, etc) are considered toxic sites. They need to be cleaned up properly and the government agencies overseeing the lands are 100% afraid of harming the volunteers/public.

    I thank you for being a responsible individual. Keep up the strong work. Also, take a minute to realize what and who you are asking to things. I was out hiking with my dogs in the NF, when I was put in the hospital by some drunks who I asked to pick up their empties. Ended up getting in a knife fight and having my head split open, by an empty fifth of Popov vodka. I think twice about asking folks, nowadays. I will just go and pick it up myself, avoiding the conflict. Rather get Ďem with their conscience/guilt, if they have any, these days.
    Last edited by Huck; 10-11-2018 at 09:26 AM.
    yah, Huck you newbie, Rubicon drivin', mall Cruisin', bling-bling, bolt-on, got no drivin skillz, drove thru a AutoZone with a crap magnet attached, H2 wannabe, poseur! Pay attention!
    If you would pry your sorry arse out the Scottsdale Fashion Square once in a while you would know more about the BLM and the USFS (you do know those acronyms, right?).

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Location
    Mesa
    Posts
    212

    Re: Shooting mess

    Well isn't that just messed up. man this world has gone to hell .I understand about approaching the wrong kind of people and putting yourself in danger once again that's why I didn't confront those other people cuz I was still upset with the chance of me and my wife getting shot for something stupid.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

  9. #24
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    South Mountain
    Posts
    10,047

    Re: Shooting mess

    Quote Originally Posted by Huck View Post
    ^^^^This. Sadly Doug is correct. Ammo is ammo. They both can and will use it to benefit their objectives, even if it bites you in the process. Also, area clean ups, especially of shooting sites have been cut back dramatically. We used to have them regularly, a decade ago. This isn’t due to lack of funding as much as it has to do with ‘us’ being a litigious society. Shooting sites are, by nature of the lead and things they shoot up (hard drives, Mercury thermostats, asbestos, etc) are considered toxic sites. They need to be cleaned up properly and the government agencies overseeing the lands are 100% afraid of harming the volunteers/public.

    I thank you for being a responsible individual. Keep up the strong work. Also, take a minute to realize what and who you are asking to things. I was out hiking with my dogs in the NF, when I was put in the hospital by some drunks who I asked to pick up their empties. Ended up getting in a knife fight and having my head split open, by an empty fifth of Popov vodka. I think twice about asking folks, nowadays. I will just go and pick it up myself, avoiding the conflict. Rather get ‘em with their conscience/guilt, if they have any, these days.
    Damn Huck, had no idea you got put in the hospital over trying to get some pieces of **** to pick up their trash.

    I remember the first time I ever ran LT. Had no idea how to even get to the trail, had just heard about it. Matrix and I and DC093 went out to TM looking for it in the middle of the night, and had not yet crossed the river when a large group of XJs came up on us from the direction of BTG campground, said they were headed to LT. We followed behind them watching many of the people in the group toss out can after can, bottle after bottle, then the empty cases started getting tossed. We cleaned up what we saw as we drove behind them. We parked and walked up to the traffic jam that later formed at White Line (didn't know it had a name yet lol), where the group played for an hour or so. By the time the last of their group had taken the bypass, there were empty cases with literal piles of cans and bottles around them. We were far outnumbered, so we cleaned most of it up and decided not to say anything. I've never understood why it's so hard for people to simply not throw their trash on the ground. It's just never made sense to me.

    That said, I recall a few years ago when all the photos of the landfill that many of the shooting areas at TM had become started to make the rounds and we figured we'd put another cleanup together. Somebody in the club, I think it was Gabe, even lined up a vendor to bring out a couple of dumptruck sized trash containers for us to load everything in....

    And then suddenly it got cancelled because of the gov't claiming there was too much liability in having volunteers come out there to clean things up.

    Sad.
    '93 YJ, 4.0, NV4500, Atlas, 35s
    '17 WK2, 5.7, ZF8HP70, NV245, 31s

  10. #25

    Re: Shooting mess

    Quote Originally Posted by TreeKiller View Post
    Damn Huck, had no idea you got put in the hospital over trying to get some pieces of **** to pick up their trash.
    I donít talk about it much, but itís a true story and it serves as a good reminder to keep my Ďgood Samaritaní in check. I was just going for a quick evening hike in Pump House Wash with my pooches, when it occurred. The county Sheriff was called to the hospital and I received a bunch of staples in my head. I held my own, disarmed the knife guy, broke a nose of another guy and dotted a couple of eyes. But, the bottle splitting my head open was no fun and something that I never saw coming (canít fight everyone at once. ). Long story short, these ****s went on a little vandalism spree around Kachina Village. I was able to ID them and the damage they were wearing from me, kind of gave some of them away. They were prosecuted, but not much came of it all.

    I always think twice, nowadays. I caught a group on the wrong side of a 12íer of Budweiser and a fifth of Popov. They were buzzed, angry, and full of bravado. The fact they were feeling their booze helped me, when I turned to defend myself.

    Little ditties from the closet of skeletons.... must be October.
    yah, Huck you newbie, Rubicon drivin', mall Cruisin', bling-bling, bolt-on, got no drivin skillz, drove thru a AutoZone with a crap magnet attached, H2 wannabe, poseur! Pay attention!
    If you would pry your sorry arse out the Scottsdale Fashion Square once in a while you would know more about the BLM and the USFS (you do know those acronyms, right?).

  11. #26
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Location
    Mesa
    Posts
    212

    Re: Shooting mess

    Quote Originally Posted by Huck View Post
    I don’t talk about it much, but it’s a true story and it serves as a good reminder to keep my ‘good Samaritan’ in check. I was just going for a quick evening hike in Pump House Wash with my pooches, when it occurred. The county Sheriff was called to the hospital and I received a bunch of staples in my head. I held my own, disarmed the knife guy, broke a nose of another guy and dotted a couple of eyes. But, the bottle splitting my head open was no fun and something that I never saw coming (can’t fight everyone at once. ). Long story short, these ****s went on a little vandalism spree around Kachina Village. I was able to ID them and the damage they were wearing from me, kind of gave some of them away. They were prosecuted, but not much came of it all.

    I always think twice, nowadays. I caught a group on the wrong side of a 12’er of Budweiser and a fifth of Popov. They were buzzed, angry, and full of bravado. The fact they were feeling their booze helped me, when I turned to defend myself.

    Little ditties from the closet of skeletons.... must be October.
    Thank you for sharing this story, really makes me think about when to keep my mouth shut. I really need to practice this, better to be safe than sorry. Especially since me and my wife are planing on have kids soon. so thanks for letting me vent and keeping me grounded, now I feel foolish for letting them get to me

  12. #27
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
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    Buckeye, Az.
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    Re: Shooting mess

    Great stories! Thanks for sharing.

    I'll make mine short.
    I once followed a group of quad riders on a night run. I was always the last quad to the next rest spot. Once we were back to the starting point one of the guys make a remark about me being "so slow". I showed them all the bag full of the beer cans/bottles that they had been throwing out as they rode. I was nice about it and just said "It's what I do, I pick up after people in the desert". Most of them apologized and said they would do better in the future.

    Probably didn't. LOL.

    There a meeting with the BLM where myself and some others thought we would turn the tide on them and bring in our own pictures of the trash and damage being done by the illegals crossing the border. I spent almost 100.00 taking pictures I found on the web and having them blown up as big as the quality would allow. When we showed up with the pictures and started asking why they don't take of the real problems, like these pictured, they simply said "That is a Federal Law Enforcement issue being dealt with by the CBP, it's out of scope for this meeting, but thank you for your concern".

    We wiped the egg off our faces, took our seats and prepared ourselves for the kick in the teeth....
    Non-College Educated Working Class White Deplorable....

  13. #28
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee Foothills)
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    380

    Re: Shooting mess

    Making laws and enforcement is not a deterrent to much of anything these days. What we have to do is change attitudes, which is much easier said than done. Not that it would help much, but it would be nice to see some signage at the beginning of well used shooting areas instructing people to clean up their messes. For those of a certain age, back in the 60s/70s, there was a huge "Keep America Beautiful" ad campaign, much which was aimed at littering. It'd be nice to see some attempt at evolving the attitudes of "the entitled" that want to use public lands, but not lift a finger to take care of them. While we're at it, lets bring back Smokey the Bear, because it seems like a lot of people do not know how to correctly put out campfires these days. Sigh.

  14. #29
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Location
    Mesa
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    Re: Shooting mess

    I agree more people should do their part including the Forest service seems all they care about is closing everything down so they don't have nothing to do. They need to promote Smokey the Bear and putting out these damn fires.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

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