Buckeye Hills East

[OTR-93YJ]

I believe this comment period closes tomorrow. Send them in today!!

[OTR-93YJ]

Remember, if you do not comment on these projects now you may not be able to comment on or protest the results. Even a generic comment gets your email address on the list.

[OTR-93YJ]

Huge thanks to Ryan! He brought this to my attention.

Public review and comment period. The site says 155 miles of trails will be closed. This meeting will be when they show you which trails are being closed. And this may be the last chance to protest any of the closures.


https://eplanning.blm.gov/epl-front-...tPageId=118132

Meeting locations.

https://eplanning.blm.gov/epl-front-...tPageId=118136

Here are the maps. Looks like they are going with "c". Take a hard look at the maps and prepare your comments.

https://eplanning.blm.gov/epl-front-...PageId=118137#

[OTR-93YJ]

Looks like both Gila Monster and Cheap Trick will be non motorized.

Maybe some of you Facebook users can cross post this.

[ehall]

BLM is a POS. Everyone needs to look at these maps.

[OTR-93YJ]

Yea, they really put the screws to the motorized crowd. I knew it was going to happen. The room was full of non motorized folks during the scoping meeting.

We really need comments from the people that use these trails.

[ehall]

They force everyone to be outlaws. Catch me if you can you sob's. (on my bike) lol

[OTR-93YJ]

The meeting is tonight.

Community Center
201 E. Centre Avenue
Buckeye, Arizona, 85326

Bring your attitudes! LOL.

[ehall]

What a surprise. Every trail that was shown to them by the public they now propose closing.

[OTR-93YJ]

It was a good old fashion kick in the teeth to say the least!

Some talking points-
There will be no designated trails in washes. Which means all of the obstacles in these areas will not be part of a designated trail. The strange part is that they never said we couldn't use them, or that they would now be illegal, they just said they will not be designated trails. This stems from a liability issue. When that family was washed away in the Tonto while enjoying a designated recreational location, it changed their policy. Ed Kinder was very adamant on this. They did ask us to provide them the trails we use to get to the those trails.

I worked my tail off trying to get motorcycle guys to get involved to make sure their singletrack trails were on the map. Instead, the singletrack is now non-motorized and all of the two track I sent them is now singletrack. I'm not sure how this happened, and when I sat with the GIS guy, even he could see the trails are two track.

I've got some work to do!

It was good seeing you Ed! Also good to see Bab again. It's been a while.

I'll share my thoughts and comments on this once I have them all sorted out. I have to get over the anger and desire to give up and walk away first.

[OTR-93YJ]

Try this for the map of Buckeye Hills east.

https://blm-egis.maps.arcgis.com/app...155f832a095e67

scroll in and click on each trail to see what the route designation is.

[OTR-93YJ]

My comment-


My first comment is just a general comment on alternative C.

I sent in my GPS tracks of the trails I use with my jeep. Many other people use those trails in jeeps and UTV's. But you have them listed as Motorcycle, and some of them as "lightly used" single track.

You're putting the non motorized on the Singletrack, the Motorcycles on the two track, and the jeeps on trails that resemble bladed roads.

Comment 1.
At the meeting, Mr. Kinder said that there would no designated trails in washes. He stated liability as the reason. While I may not agree with that, it's hard to argue with. That being said, motorized vehicles would have a much better chance in a flash flood than non motorized. In section 15, T1S-R3W You have trail #BH1429 in a wash and listed as non motorized. It's also listed as a "proposed new route". This trail has been motorized for years and was even on the route inventory completed about 10 years ago, or maybe before that. It's been an extreme trail for purpose built vehicles for a long time. Mountain bikes will not enjoy this trail and should not be in a wash, if liability is an issue.

Also in section 15, T1S-R3W, you have some roads closed that are access roads to houses out there. PLO1015.

Comment 2.
In section 21, T1S-R3W, Trail BH1429 is a two track that completes a loop that many people use in jeeps. Without that, vehicles would have to turn back and possible meet other groups of vehicles. I've been using that trail for years leading jeeps around that loop. In my GPS tracks I called that the north loop.

Comment 3.
In section 24, T1S-R3W, you have no access to the trails for jeeps and quads and UTV's. This is the main access point used for all of the trails out there for all the different types of vehicles. We need one of the BH1119 leading to wash to remain open, even if the wash itself is closed. Also BH115 and BH1175 are used to access BH1176. This allows us to ingress and egress the area with little disturbance to the homes in that area.

Comment 4.
In section 25, T1s-R3W, BH1178 and BH1078 are observed as heavily used 4wd, but it looks like you are designating it as equestrian and non motorized. Not sure if that's just a mistake, or what. But the horse and mountain bike people will not enjoy that trail.

Comment 5.
In section 02, T2S- R3W, BH1429 is a two track trail I've used for years on quads and in the jeep. You can zoom in on G-earth or G-maps to see the trail is established two track. You have it listed as New Route, for mountain bike.

Comment 6.
In section 02, T2S-R3W, this is where there seems to be some confusion between the singletrack motorcycle and the non motorized. Nearly everything you have designated as non-motorized is singletrack motorcycle, and some of that was proposed as new singletrack for motorcycles. In this area, I don't see an issue with the singletrack being used by both the motorized and non motorized two wheelers.

Also, Part of BH1075 is two track, jeep trail. I've used it for years and lead groups out there. In my GPS tracks, I called that the south loop.

Comment 7.
In section 36, T1S-R3W, BH1429 is where the two track turns east off BH1078, and the singletrack turns north and remains BH1078.
Also in section 36, on the north side of the mountain, BH1427 is a motorized singletrack trail.

Comment 8.
In section 26, T1S-R3W, BH1074 is a two track. Tight in places, but I've been using it for years. You can zoom into 33.307135, -112.526319 in google maps and see the two track. There should be no reason that jeeps and motorcycles can't use the same trails. Jeeps are slow. I've met bikes out there many times and there has never been an issue.

Comment 9.
In section 27, T1S-R3W, you are sending motorcycles up a trail I won't even do with the jeep. Its BH1103.

BH1105 is a trail I use from BH1070 to make a loop around that hill that people climb. In that same area, but in section 26 you have BH1104 closed and that is how I get back to BH1074. You have BH1074 as equestrian and motorcycle and that is part of my north loop I sent in.

Comment 10.
In sections 22 and 23, T1S-R3W, you have BH1109 as "open", but no designation. That is also part of one of the loops I sent in. The North loop.

Comment 11.
In section 27, T1S- R3W, BH1427, coming off BH1070 at the cattle guard, is singletrack motorcycle trail on both sides of BH1070. On the north leg of that trail, It ties into a two track I use which is BH1429. But the two track stops at the top of that pass. From there north is singletrack motorcycle stuff. But your map is off. Right where there is a little "Y" in the trail is where the two track stops, and the singletrack motorcycle trail goes off to the north west. Your map shows it going north. You can zoom in on that to see it as well.

I will make myself available for consult in office or in the field if needed.

Thank you.
Doug Martin

[OTR-93YJ]

If you agree with my comments, please copy them, in part or in whole, and send them to buckeyehills@blm.gov

[ehall]

Wow. Great work Doug.

[OTR-93YJ]

Thx