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Thread: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

  1. #16
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    Both of you are reading way into much of what my post is about and going off on tangents simply put water methanol has been shown and proven to assist with the completed and clean combustion on DIESEl emissions vehicles plain and simple. my question was about people who have ran this on current emmissikned controlled diesel vehicles. Airplanes have nothing to do with anything I'm asking about totally different animal so please get off your high horse yes I'm asking for an QUALIFIED OPINION on a specific thing not opinions on what you think about airplane engines and emissions on gasoline engines specifically diesel and the benefits of water/meth.

    Engineers and manufactures will not put on a system like water meth when the truck was designed to do specific things within the parameters that's why there's people like us that like to modify and enhance the operation of vehicles just like lifting a jeep so you can enhance your off-road experience obviously jeeps don't come from the factory All out buggy with 40" inch tires now do they ??
    My name is Daniel. I pretty much STILL do what I want.

  2. #17
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    If you take out the whole "enhance performance" part, which seems to be what's causing the tongue lashing, and just address the soot produced in a diesel engine, it's pretty simple to understand what Daniel is asking.

    HP=heat=friction=wear. We all know that. So, by doing this mod he may only get 450,000 miles out of that cummins instead of 475,000!

    Daniel, If you do figure something out for removing the soot without it going through the intake, let me know. I'm very concerned with what I saw in mine. So much so, that when I do replace the EGR I'm going to let someone else do it. It's that ole ignorance is bliss thing...
    Non-College Educated Working Class White Deplorable....

  3. #18
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    I have zero experience with diesels, but I do have quite a bit of experience with water/methanol injection. I ran a snow performance system on my old SRT-4 and when we pulled the engine to rebuild it, there was practically zero deposits on any of the valves. Even the pistons looked like they had been "steam cleaned". EGT's were reduced and a good amount of performance was added. On a 116 degree day, the air coming out of the intercooler measured 122 degrees and the air going into the intake (post water/meth injection) measured 87 degrees. This colder, denser air allowed the car to increase output from 465ish whp to 491 whp simply by switching from a 325 cc/min to a 675 cc/min injector (boost and timing remained the same).

    Some reading material:
    http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/eng...h-is-too-much/
    http://www.snowperformance.net/Diese...kits-s/101.htm


    Quote Originally Posted by ob1jeeper View Post
    I ... am not aware of any OEM production IC engines (diesel or otherwise) in use for ground transportation vehicles, which are making use of that technology.
    FYI, the 2016 BMW M4 GTS comes with a water injection system (now you know of one. )
    - Michael
    2016 Jeep JKU Rubicon - 99% stock.

  4. #19
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    I have a 07' dodge with the 6.7L. I have deleted the dpf, nox, and egr. I went from 14-15mpg with tuner to 18+ with same turner. I looked into the water meth and I decided against it as it would only benefit me if I was running high HP. On the newer 6.7L with the def, I have heard mixed results with deleting. I seem to average 6-7 ppm when emission tested, allowed 40 ppm.

    As for the egr, I think taking it out was one of the best things I did. Before I removed it, the oil would stain anything it touched. Also the truck had more soot in the exhaust. As for what the egr does, yes it might help reduce nox, but it also reduces performance and mpg. The way that I like to think of it is fill a room with oxygen, and do some exercise. Then remove 25% of the oxygen and fill with C02 and perform same exercise and see how it feels. Also I used to put block off plates on my old carburetor trucks for the egr and they would pass the roller test better then with the egr in place and functional.
    2013 JKU RUBICON 10TH ANNIVERSARY EDITION: Wife's DD
    2003 TJ Rubicon: Trailer queen
    1990 XJ: Somewhere in Mesa

  5. #20
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    Thank you Mchat and AZJeeps!!
    My name is Daniel. I pretty much STILL do what I want.

  6. #21
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    Okay, but what's this have to do with midget porn?
    Get Down With the Sickness!

  7. #22
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bugs View Post
    Okay, but what's this have to do with midget porn?
    You don't see the midget in the sexy black leather standing next to the bike?
    Non-College Educated Working Class White Deplorable....

  8. #23
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    [QUOTE=mchat;1035769]
    FYI, the 2016 BMW M4 GTS comes with a water injection system (now you know of one. )
    I stand corrected... That one snuck up on me... You are indeed correct that the first ever production automobile using this technology was just recently released for sale.

    Thanks for making my point regarding the reasoning behind the use of water injection. Performance enhancements, as opposed to longevity.

    Quoting from some press materials I just found online: "BMW claims the GTS will lap the Nurburgring track in 7:28 minutes, making it the quickest Bimmer around the "Green Hell" as of 2015. That figure makes the M4 GTS as fast as the Porsche Carrera GT, McLaren MP4-12C McLaren MP4-12C, and Ferrari 458 Italia, and itís quicker than supercars like the Koenigsegg CCX and the Porsche 911 GT2."

    Advertised pricing @ $134,200 per copy, including the over-sized "wing" on the rear, AND the water injection on the 6-cyl engine, with only 300 to be built for export to the USA they are intended primarily for use on the race track, not at all unlike the ACR Viper, where longevity is measured by completing a single race.

    I'm done derailing this thread. I'll let the VJC's IC engine water injection experts, help Daniel make his tow vehicle all it can be...
    Working for a living is highly over-rated...

  9. #24
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZJROCKRIG View Post

    TJ tim, thanks for your response, I disagree with you in the EGR and Unburnt fuel in a diesel. I agree with you on that point for a gasoline engine. Diesels a completely different fuel and the characteristics are not the same as gasoline. Thus why us diesel owners are concerned with EGT's and gasoline engine owners are not.
    Diesel is definitely a different animal in many respects. In the respect that it is a hydrocarbon that combusts with oxygen to produce CO2 and H2O, it is exactly the same as gasoline. The whole goal of emissions management of any internal combustion engine is to combust its reactants in a stoichiometric reaction which results in the most complete chemical reaction of said reactants. In other words, the whole goal is to end up with as little fuel left over as possible. It's 100% your right to disagree with that point, but it doesn't change the fact that I'm still right

    And the reason why exhaust gas temperature, in general, is more of a concern with diesel engines vs gasoline engines is that, in general, most modern diesels are equipped with turbochargers. The turbocharger is the component that drives the need for monitoring EGT, not the fuel being burnt. EGT is equally important in a gasoline engine when it is turbocharged.

    I think the direction you're thinking in regards to EGT and EGR systems is this. For an EGR system to function in a turbocharged diesel engine, the exhaust pressure has to be higher than the intake pressure. Being turbocharged obviously means during a lot of engine operation that the intake is under positive pressure. Achieving higher exhaust pressure is accomplished via a couple different methods, but pretty much all of them involve using the turbine of the turbocharger as a restriction to increase exhaust back pressure. This in turn increases exhaust gas temperature. Typically, deleting the EGR system reduces this stress on the exhaust system, lowering EGT.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZJROCKRIG View Post
    Unfortunately your answer also contradicts Rowdy Rack guys answer as he states his deletes will pass emissions. So obviously he is not increasing NOX past limits... Answer that please since you have the better understanding of it... (PS I am a trained tech to set emmisions on natural gas engines which are the same principal as other fossil fuel engines in relation to VOC's etc).
    This.

    Quote Originally Posted by YJin View Post
    Not sure about different locations but in AZ the diesel emissions check is a visual check for equipment and a snap acceleration test to check opacity. NOX is not tested so if you do a non visual delete and don't blow to much smoke it will pass.
    And I never said deleting the EGR system would cause you to fail emissions, I just said it'll make baby Jesus cry

    It's good to hear that you're a trained tech, so I'm sure you're getting everything I'm spitting out, but I still think you have a ways to go in having a good in depth understanding of the systems involved and how they interact with each other. If I can answer any other question let me know, and if I don't have the answers I'll tell you instead of blowing internet smoke up your ace. And I'll quote this for posterity

    Quote Originally Posted by TanTJJim
    I know this answers 0% of your questions about water/meth injection and EGR systems....and deleting, diesel? But at least it should give you a little better understanding of what exactly an EGR system is and does.
    I'ma cookin' somethin' up!

  10. #25
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    Quote Originally Posted by OTR-93YJ View Post
    You don't see the midget in the sexy black leather standing next to the bike?
    LOL! I am a midget!! Especially standing next to Phill!!! Damn circus must have forgot him in Arizona!! Hahahah!!
    My name is Daniel. I pretty much STILL do what I want.

  11. #26
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    Ok gentlemen, I have asked a couple read what I and you have said to make sure I was not sounding like an *** and if I was making sense.... Let's start over. I WILL be doing a W/M system. Not right here soon as I am in the middle of moving. I will keep a seperate write up of it. I already have one on my emmisions friendly tuner installation when I got my truck, I just need to edit and get the pictures I order.

    This is the system I am going with. Also wanted to point out that regardless of emissions, this system will be a benefit to any set up. With out emissions diesels still make high EGT's...

    http://www.snowperformance.net/MPG-M...mins-p/510.htm

    Looking at this style as tank as well so I can carry a truck camper:

    http://www.snowperformance.net/10-Ga...ir-p/40015.htm

    My son bought one of these and actually it really works great! This is on the list too.

    http://www.dieselperformance.com/ind...uct/index/339P

    They offer a dash switch as well.

    One thing I have not upgraded yet is the lift pump. The new trucks as far as I have researched are pretty good and solid in this department compared to 3rd gens.
    My name is Daniel. I pretty much STILL do what I want.

  12. #27
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZJROCKRIG View Post
    This is the system I am going with. Also wanted to point out that regardless of emissions, this system will be a benefit to any set up. With out emissions diesels still make high EGT's...
    http://www.snowperformance.net/MPG-M...mins-p/510.htm
    Nice. Back when I was helping others tune their cars I got to see a variety of water injection kits. Of all the kits out there, I liked Snow Performance the best.
    - Michael
    2016 Jeep JKU Rubicon - 99% stock.

  13. #28
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    I also came across these folks that make a bolt in twin set up and you keep all your stock components, turbo, air box, manifold etc. Factory exhaust brake/turbo is utilized/functional as well.

    http://hardwayperformance.com/featur...t-stage-1.html
    My name is Daniel. I pretty much STILL do what I want.

  14. #29
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    I'll admit, I was poking the bear a bit earlier but serious question here, what is your primary motivation for doing this? Is it to simply decrease EGT's?
    I'ma cookin' somethin' up!

  15. #30
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    Re: Ok smart people... Deleting diesels & other options.

    Quote Originally Posted by TanTJJim View Post
    I'll admit, I was poking the bear a bit earlier .....
    I know, I can't believe you mentioned baby Jesus....
    Non-College Educated Working Class White Deplorable....

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