Arizona Virtual Minute men???

[FlexyXJ]

Just "feeling the waters" Of how everyone here feels about this whole minuteman thing down at the border. Myself and about 4 other people are thinking of going down there.....I would be interested if anyone here had thought about it......If you feel as if you dont want to post it publicly, then send me a PM. I think this falls into the General Discussion part of this forum. I, Myself feel VERY strongly about this whole thing going on down there. Instead of all of us sitting here infront of our computers complaining about it, lets go do something.....in other words...."Let's Git er dun boys"


Joe

[fdxboy]

Good topic. Personally I think that it is about time that the residents of Arizona did something to protect our soverignty. The US government turns a blind eye to whole situation while allowing a PROBLEM perpetuate itself. No, I am not a racist or intolerable to other peoples culture. I have ZERO problem with anyone that comes into our country LEGALLY. However, I have a problem with someone who does not respect our country and slithers into the country discards our laws from the get go is a problem.

I am tired of hearing about the arguement, "These are the jobs that nobody else will do". This is completley and utterly false. Wages are driven by the regional market and is nothing more than pure capitalism. Company's that hire illegals (no you are not an "undocumented worker" you are here ILLEGALLY) keep wages down for those who are here legally wanting to do legitamate work at an honest wage. There are million of companies that do not hire illegals and are able to turn incredible profits. I work for one of them and I am 100% that we do not hire illegals.

It is a shame that Arizona has to do actually have an organization known as the Minute Men this problem should have been delt with years ago on a Federal level.

I don't think that there will be too many that will disagree due to the make up of the people in our hobby. By the way...what ever happened to Prop200.

Mike

[Turtle]

Minuteman... dangit Joe... what has my girlfriend been telling you??? I've had enough of this! Tonight I swear I am going for AT LEAST 2.5 mins!!!!

On a serious note... Joe, what exactly is this about? If you don't care to discuss this here, then shoot me a PM please.

Thanks!
Turtle!

[JamesT]

Minuteman... dangit Joe... what has my girlfriend been telling you??? I've had enough of this! Tonight I swear I am going for AT LEAST 2.5 mins!!!!

On a serious note... Joe, what exactly is this about? If you don't care to discuss this here, then shoot me a PM please.

Thanks!
Turtle!

LOL

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20050403/D897L0680.html
from this page: http://www.minutemanproject.com/

[RokNRich]

A couple of weeks ago the AZ Republic had a front page story detailing the damage the smugglers were doing to the environment along Devils Highway (Cabezo Prieta (sp?). The environmentalist are trying to close the area off due to the damage. Will it keep the illegals out ? No ! But it may end up getting closed off to us.

I haven't followed the minutemen story too much, but I did see that Border Patrol Rubicon on CNN last night. Nice rig, too much shovel though ! ;)

[Joe West]

If people want to help out with border security... I'm all for it. However, I'm not for any racial or biased actions by anyone. In other words; reporting illegal aliens is perfectly fine... harming, detaining, or abusing them is not fine.

The truth is; if I were born in Mexico, I WOULD be crossing the border into the US every chance I got. I would do whatever it took to take care of my family regardless of whether US citizens liked it or not.

I would prefer illegal aliens not enter the US, but were I in their shoes; I'd do exactly what they are.

Joe

[phoen1c1an]

If people want to help out with border security... I'm all for it. However, I'm not for any racial or biased actions by anyone. In other words; reporting illegal aliens is perfectly fine... harming, detaining, or abusing them is not fine.

The truth is; if I were born in Mexico, I WOULD be crossing the border into the US every chance I got. I would do whatever it took to take care of my family regardless of whether US citizens liked it or not.

I would prefer illegal aliens not enter the US, but were I in their shoes; I'd do exactly what they are.

Joe
Very well put.

[Turtle]

That is great! One thing I did not see (maybe I did not look hard enough), was how long is this going to go on for?

Joe, let me know the dates you might head down. I would seriously entertain the idea of going down for a while. I feel we need to do all we can to preserve our country.

I agree with Joe West that if I were in their shoes I would do the same thing... thankfully I am not though.

Turtle

[Sautin]

I think that it is great. And that it is drawing attention to a problem that transends all political parties as all that have been in power have done nothing to solve the problem. This is what America is supposed to be all about, this is why we have the freedom that we have, so that we the people can stand up for what we as individuals believe in. I personally have no problem with immigrants, I think that they enrich our own culture, but I also think that you need to do it legally. I just can't believe that the media is painting the picture that they are racist vigilantes, unbelieveable, you stand up for something that you believe in and someone calls you racist because a majority of the people that it will affect are of one race. Talk about black and white, I don't think the media sees in color anymore.

[Devil Man]

if they put the same time & effort into fixing mexico's problems as they put into border crossing's they could have a great country.

[My1stJeep]

As far as I know it is supposed to run for the month of April.

I do agree with Joe (well both of you this time), if I were in their shoes I would be crossing all the time too.

I do disagree with a previous post, most of the jobs that come from those crossing the border that are hispanic do take jobs most of us (not saying all here cause some do). How many hear want to pick lettuce, watermelons, graft buds (for roses) on rose bushes, etc... in 100+ degree temps? Not many of us would. That said for those of us who would do it, I do agree hiring of the illegals does drive down the wages.

I am all for closing the borders, especially removing those water tanks they installed, to me those only encourage attempts to cross. Find a way to give those workers legal work visas to come do those jobs and make sure they pay taxes on those wages, stop the under the table pay.

My only concern with this project will be when someone draws a weapon on one of them and if they act and shoot the whole point of this effort will be moot. If they stick to their plan of only calling in sightings I think it will be a success.

As for the race card, as soon as it started groups like the ACLU always play that card. However long after this project was defined, set in stone and ready to begin a white supremist group did go public and endorse it, almost tried to represent it like they were organizing, kinda cast a shadow on it. The true organizers have said all along it has nothing to do with race, only with securing our borders.

I personally like the idea of putting the National Guard along the border to stop the crossings until a wall can be built or something to stop them from coming across illegally, but I know the Governor (well start the ball rolling to get it done) will not sign the documents to make it happen, but to me it is a matter of national security and should be done.

Joe, keep us posted as to what you get organized.

[SavageSun4x4]

Joe, before you go:
Read our Consititution and Bill of Rights. Take a copy with you when you go. BE SURE to take a weapon for self defense purposes.

Stay safe and let us know when you get back.

One more thing. If you get pinned down and are running low on ammo, call me, it won't be my first "HOT LZ" I have gone into.

[Hackle]

To be honest the project has already acheived a large goal. They sent 150 more agents to the AZ border and are training 500 more to add in. We have been left as a huge hole in the border for a long time while the Feds built up other areas. The Minuteman project embarrassed the Feds to do what they should have done years ago.
Jim F.

[1BLKJP]

I'm all for this also and I think that the noise that it is creating is helping the situation. Didn't we just get an allocation for 500 more border patrol agents down in that area?

and Joe W you are right about wanting to help our families anyway possible. But would you go to your neighbors house and steal from his family to provide for yours? I highly doubt it. So why should we be excited about people illegally coming into our country and stealing our monies and jobs when we are the ones that are abiding by the laws that we have set for ourselves. It is not okay for them to come in here illegally. Every day that these actions continue it takes away from the millions that fled persecution or poverty in their homelands and put the time and effort into coming to America the right way.

Oh, and I would beg to differ on the jobs issue. I think that I would do whatever I needed to job wise to provide for my family. Along the lines of what everyone is agreeing with Joe W on. If I had to pick strawberries or lettuce to feed my kids I would.

[rolled1]

For those that dont beleve its afecting our jobs, go to any constuction site and look at the illegals working for 10 bucks an hour. Who is going to hire a carpenter for 18-20 bucks an hour when you get 2 for 1? I have even worked for a nation wide company that had some known illegals working for them, and when caught, fired them, helped them get a new ID and brought them back the next day.
I did report this to an ins agent I knew, but she said there was nothing she could do. Pisses me off!!!!

[Hackle]

Construction is being hit hard I agree. The quality is a lot lower along with the wages. It is not just lettice pickers as the liberal news media would like everyone to think.
Jim F.

[katvans]

:(
First let me say that I am not a racist, I love Mexico, have been deep in the interior (read middle of nowhere) many times, been close to the people there, feel for their third world culture and done what little I could to help.

I am posting this because of our current situation with the Mexican border, the "Minute men", and recent discussions on our Jeep boards about the border.

I do not condone the use of the original title which is "Take your Mexican Flag and stick it!" but I do believe it is time to close our borders. I do not believe in illegal immigration of Mexicans or anyone else. I do not believe we can change this at the voting booth. I do believe we can change this from within by a show of national force in the form of petitions to show our elected officials what we want done. It's basically the same thing we do to try and keep our trails open, we send letters and go to land use meetings. It is with this in mind that I post the following message and petition. Do what you will, flame me if you want but follow your heart and express your feelings now because there is no time like the present to do your part for your country. This is an easy way to try and help for those who care.

Rich & Kathy (the creekers)


"Take your Mexican Flag and stick it!"

Those were the words of a number of North Carolinians who sent
> angry e-mail messages to El Pueblo, a Hispanic advocacy group
> in Raleigh, North Carolina, recently.
>
> The e-mail stemmed in part from six bills in the House and
> Senate. One bill would allow undocumented high schools students
> to pay in-state tuition at North Carolina colleges and universities!
>
> As Grassfire has been saying for nearly two years, illegal
> immigration isn't just a problem in border-states. In fact, in the
> tarheel state, The Pew Hispanic Center found that illegal
> immigration has risen 43 percent from 2000-2004 to more than
> 300,000 illegals--making North Carolina the fastest-growing
> illegal population in the country!
>
> Robert, how serious is the illegal immigration problem
> in California?
>
> For years North Carolinians didn't think there was a problem, but
> now as State Senator Hugh Webster says, "They want to stop the
> flood."
>
> We want to stop the flood as well both in your state and
> nationally, but we need your help!
>
> + + 175,000 Petitions needed by the end of April!
>
> Robert, by the end of April, Grassfire will be presenting
> your petitions to key legislative leaders in Washington, as well as
> key local officials who are making an impact on the out-of-control
> illegal immigration situation.
>
> We want to make certain that these petition presentations strike a
> chord--both in Congress and with citizens nationwide.
>
> That is why we are urging everyone who supports our efforts to
> forward this message to 20-30 of your friends and family inviting
> them to take part in our national effort by clicking here:
>
> http://www.grassfire.org/42/petition.asp?PID=8528361
>
> + + Lighting a grassfire under our lawmakers!
>
> For action to take place, it is vital that grassroots America speaks
> up--not just in the border-states, but anywhere and everywhere
> illegal immigration is a problem.
>
> Keep in mind this petition isn't about stopping all immigration.
> We support immigration. We are simply against the uncontrolled
> flow of undocumented illegals, and through this petition, we are
> serving notice and holding leadership responsible for addressing
> the very serious security risk illegals pose to all citizens.
>
> THE TIME IS NOW TO SPEAK UP, and we want to hear from
> you before our petition presentations at the end of April!
>
> Will you add your name to this critical petition to secure our
> borders against illegal entry? Click here to take action now:
>
> http://www.grassfire.org/42/petition.asp?PID=8528361
>
> Please demonstrate your level of concern by reaching out to as
> many citizens as you can in the next 10 days to sign our petition.
>
> For action to take place, we must clearly demonstrate that the
> American people want action.
>
> Thank you for taking action with us!
>
> Grassfire.org Alliance

http://www.grassfire.org