blooddrive
01-02-2004, 07:30 PM
6643-6667 of 96466 | Previous | Next [ First | Last ] Msg # Date | Thread
6643 From: Len Sullivan <kermit@c...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 2:25am
Subject: repair manuals
Hello all
Stopped on the way home from work today and picked up a couple of Haynes
manuals (one full size Jeep, one full size Chevy since my truck is a hybrid)
and was/am very disappointed in them. I am planning on doing some "major"
repair/rebuild/improve work on the J-10 this summer and need some direction
for the projects I've never attempted before. I was hoping to find
instructions on the following subjects:
- upper/lower ball joint replacement on a Dana 44 front axle
- rebuild/overhaul on a NP208 transfer case
- rebuild/overhaul on a GM TH350 transmission
- rebuild/overhaul on a Dana 60 Trac-lock unit
Everything else I want to do I've either done before or found good
instructions on the net, but these are places that I've never gone before.
In the past, Haynes manuals have always been very descriptive and had
excellent diagrams, but things have changed. All four areas that I was
looking for (in both books) are now covered by the following text:
"Because of the special tools and skills needed, this work should be left
to a dealer service department or a qualified repair shop."
grumble, grumble, grumble
Does anyone have any recommendations on books or online sources for how-to
information on the subjects I'm after? I'm pretty sure that I can get the
TH350 tranny overhaul info from HP Books through work, but for the rest of
them I'm not sure where to start.........so I'm starting by asking the great
Jeep collective. :-)
many thanks in advance
Len Sullivan
'78 J-10
(mine's not cheep either! I kinda like Jeepolet)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ADVERTISEMENT
6644 From: Pat <Dreamwev@m...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 8:24pm
Subject: Re: Fw: Dust Abatement Ordinance
Roger,
The Problem was/is in the north valley. The tickets were being issued to
bikers stirring up dust and using state land without permits. The officers
are relatively reasonable. Their hands are tied with this stupid 40+ year
old law. Unfortunately others that are not the problem have been dragged
into it. All the balloonists just west of I-17 were forbidden from using the
middle mountain area north of Happy Valley because of dust complaints. Its
like people that move next to an airport and then complain about the noise!
I am in no way admonishing some these bikers, though. Many of them are
creating some big problems in the north valley (cutting fences, chasing
cows, stirring up alot of dust, harassing other land users, etc.) And then
there are the people that target practice in these area and shoot up all
their garbage. BTW, in case any of you target shoot in the north valley,
make sure you are outside the city of Phoenix. This is illegal, and you will
be cited. City of Phoenix extends well past Carefree Highway along I-17 now.
Sorry Roger, now I'm getting off topic.
Patrick (Balloon pilot and Jeeper)
----- Original Message -----
From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
To: <tomasr@a...>; <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 7:03 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Dust Abatement Ordinance
> Roger,
> Not at all claiming to be the expert on this problem, from what I have
> heard, it appears that Phoenix PD are the ones writing the tickets, mostly
> on the North end of the valley. I guess they have annexed some area that
> has state land in the middle of it. Hence, they write tickets when the
> locals complain about the dust, etc. If you are not around the City of
> Phoenix area, I don't believe you will have much of a problem (just my
> opinion).
>
> Stu Olson N7QJP
> Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
>
> http://www.qsl.net/n7qjp/
> http://home.off-road.com/~stu
> http://www.users.uswest.west/~solson8
> Developer of VKE Digital Voice Keyer
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roger Tomas [mailto:tomasr@a...]
> Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 9:09 AM
> To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Dust Abatement Ordinance
>
>
> My state trust land recreational permit just expired and I'm thinking
> about renewing it. But having read here about people with permits being
> cited for the dust abatement ordinance, I'm having second thoughts. Can
> anyone tell me about this ordinance? Is it enforced everywhere or just
> close to town? Does it prohibit me from traveling on trust land in any
way
> or does it just prohibit me from kicking up a bunch of dust. And how much
> is a bunch? Sounds like the enforcement could be rather subjective. TIA!
>
> -Roger
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get a FREE $15 BN.com gift certificate when you join carclub.com.
> As a member, you can save up to $550 a year if you own a car, and
> thousands more when you're buying one.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2064/4/_/1966/_/953050182/
>
> -- Talk to your group with your own voice!
> -- http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on the net.
> Try @Backup FREE and recieve 300 points from mypoints.com Install now:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2345/4/_/1966/_/953085929/
>
> -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> -- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/az_vjc/?m=1
>
>
6645 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 8:19pm
Subject: Re: repair manuals
There is a company that puts a ton of rebuild info on cd rom I think checker
sells it maybe autozone. can't rember. You pick the vehicle you want off the
cd and if you want to add to it you can down load a passkey to open the
others for a minimal fee...
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: Len Sullivan [mailto:kermit@c...]
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 3:25 AM
To: AZVJC; 1FSJ@onelist.com
Subject: [az_vjc] repair manuals
Hello all
Stopped on the way home from work today and picked up a couple of Haynes
manuals (one full size Jeep, one full size Chevy since my truck is a hybrid)
and was/am very disappointed in them. I am planning on doing some "major"
repair/rebuild/improve work on the J-10 this summer and need some direction
for the projects I've never attempted before. I was hoping to find
instructions on the following subjects:
- upper/lower ball joint replacement on a Dana 44 front axle
- rebuild/overhaul on a NP208 transfer case
- rebuild/overhaul on a GM TH350 transmission
- rebuild/overhaul on a Dana 60 Trac-lock unit
Everything else I want to do I've either done before or found good
instructions on the net, but these are places that I've never gone before.
In the past, Haynes manuals have always been very descriptive and had
excellent diagrams, but things have changed. All four areas that I was
looking for (in both books) are now covered by the following text:
"Because of the special tools and skills needed, this work should be left
to a dealer service department or a qualified repair shop."
grumble, grumble, grumble
Does anyone have any recommendations on books or online sources for how-to
information on the subjects I'm after? I'm pretty sure that I can get the
TH350 tranny overhaul info from HP Books through work, but for the rest of
them I'm not sure where to start.........so I'm starting by asking the great
Jeep collective. :-)
many thanks in advance
Len Sullivan
'78 J-10
(mine's not cheep either! I kinda like Jeepolet)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
http://click.egroups.com/1/2377/4/_/1966/_/953093959/
-- Check out your group's private Chat room
-- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
6646 From: Pat <Dreamwev@m...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 8:33pm
Subject: Re: Fw: Fw: Dust Abatement Ordinance
Yup, That name sounds familiar. He's from somewhere midwest. He had a
commercial balloon contract for a asphalt company or something. He was here
for a season flying for a brand X balloon company. Why do you ask?
Patrick
----- Original Message -----
From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
To: 'Pat' <Dreamwev@m...>
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 9:22 PM
Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Re: Fw: Dust Abatement Ordinance
> Pat,
> By any chance do you know a guy by the name of Dennis Day? He is a
> Balloonist too..
>
> Dave
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pat [mailto:Dreamwev@m...]
> Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 9:24 PM
> To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Fw: Dust Abatement Ordinance
>
>
> Roger,
>
> The Problem was/is in the north valley. The tickets were being issued to
> bikers stirring up dust and using state land without permits. The officers
> are relatively reasonable. Their hands are tied with this stupid 40+ year
> old law. Unfortunately others that are not the problem have been dragged
> into it. All the balloonists just west of I-17 were forbidden from using
the
> middle mountain area north of Happy Valley because of dust complaints. Its
> like people that move next to an airport and then complain about the
noise!
>
> I am in no way admonishing some these bikers, though. Many of them are
> creating some big problems in the north valley (cutting fences, chasing
> cows, stirring up alot of dust, harassing other land users, etc.) And then
> there are the people that target practice in these area and shoot up all
> their garbage. BTW, in case any of you target shoot in the north valley,
> make sure you are outside the city of Phoenix. This is illegal, and you
will
> be cited. City of Phoenix extends well past Carefree Highway along I-17
now.
>
> Sorry Roger, now I'm getting off topic.
>
> Patrick (Balloon pilot and Jeeper)
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
> To: <tomasr@a...>; <az_vjc@egroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 7:03 PM
> Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Dust Abatement Ordinance
>
>
> > Roger,
> > Not at all claiming to be the expert on this problem, from what I have
> > heard, it appears that Phoenix PD are the ones writing the tickets,
mostly
> > on the North end of the valley. I guess they have annexed some area
that
> > has state land in the middle of it. Hence, they write tickets when the
> > locals complain about the dust, etc. If you are not around the City of
> > Phoenix area, I don't believe you will have much of a problem (just my
> > opinion).
> >
> > Stu Olson N7QJP
> > Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
> >
> > http://www.qsl.net/n7qjp/
> > http://home.off-road.com/~stu
> > http://www.users.uswest.west/~solson8
> > Developer of VKE Digital Voice Keyer
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Roger Tomas [mailto:tomasr@a...]
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 9:09 AM
> > To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> > Subject: [az_vjc] Dust Abatement Ordinance
> >
> >
> > My state trust land recreational permit just expired and I'm thinking
> > about renewing it. But having read here about people with permits being
> > cited for the dust abatement ordinance, I'm having second thoughts. Can
> > anyone tell me about this ordinance? Is it enforced everywhere or just
> > close to town? Does it prohibit me from traveling on trust land in any
> way
> > or does it just prohibit me from kicking up a bunch of dust. And how
much
> > is a bunch? Sounds like the enforcement could be rather subjective.
TIA!
> >
> > -Roger
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Get a FREE $15 BN.com gift certificate when you join carclub.com.
> > As a member, you can save up to $550 a year if you own a car, and
> > thousands more when you're buying one.
> > http://click.egroups.com/1/2064/4/_/1966/_/953050182/
> >
> > -- Talk to your group with your own voice!
> > -- http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on the net.
> > Try @Backup FREE and recieve 300 points from mypoints.com Install now:
> > http://click.egroups.com/1/2345/4/_/1966/_/953085929/
> >
> > -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> > -- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/az_vjc/?m=1
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2377/4/_/1966/_/953094178/
>
> -- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar!
> -- http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
6647 From: Hal Loy <tucsonhal@e...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 8:35pm
Subject: Re: No Subject
Good idea Dave, it would be a nice rally point at large events.
Hal
6648 From: <IlTODll@a...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 3:47pm
Subject: Re: You know you are a Jeep owner
You choose to lengthen a normally 13 hour drive by 2 hours just because you
wonder "what's at the other end of that forest road?"
The location of your vehicle's swaybar is either your backyard or your local
dump.
You say things like "it's just paint" and "trail damage is cool"
The location of your "blind spot" is above your "really blind spot," where
anything shorter than a buick disappears.
You get pissed off every time you hear someone say something like "I own a
Lexus Jeep."
You set aside quality time to be spent with your Jeep, and spend more money
on it than on your girlfriend.
6649 From: Leonard K. Pennock <leonardpennock@h...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:11pm
Subject: Re: repair manuals
Try the used book stores like Bookmans and see if you can find a Motors
repair manual. They were always more throughal than Chilton's.
Len Sullivan wrote:
>
> Hello all
>
> Stopped on the way home from work today and picked up a couple of Haynes
> manuals (one full size Jeep, one full size Chevy since my truck is a hybrid)
> and was/am very disappointed in them. I am planning on doing some "major"
> repair/rebuild/improve work on the J-10 this summer and need some direction
> for the projects I've never attempted before. I was hoping to find
> instructions on the following subjects:
>
> - upper/lower ball joint replacement on a Dana 44 front axle
> - rebuild/overhaul on a NP208 transfer case
> - rebuild/overhaul on a GM TH350 transmission
> - rebuild/overhaul on a Dana 60 Trac-lock unit
>
> Everything else I want to do I've either done before or found good
> instructions on the net, but these are places that I've never gone before.
> In the past, Haynes manuals have always been very descriptive and had
> excellent diagrams, but things have changed. All four areas that I was
> looking for (in both books) are now covered by the following text:
>
> "Because of the special tools and skills needed, this work should be left
> to a dealer service department or a qualified repair shop."
>
> grumble, grumble, grumble
>
> Does anyone have any recommendations on books or online sources for how-to
> information on the subjects I'm after? I'm pretty sure that I can get the
> TH350 tranny overhaul info from HP Books through work, but for the rest of
> them I'm not sure where to start.........so I'm starting by asking the great
> Jeep collective. :-)
>
> many thanks in advance
>
> Len Sullivan
> '78 J-10
> (mine's not cheep either! I kinda like Jeepolet)
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2377/4/_/1966/_/953093959/
>
> -- Check out your group's private Chat room
> -- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
--
Leonard K. Pennock
Those who walk bravely through life, unafraid of loss or failure,
find that they very rarely lose or fail.
6650 From: Hal Loy <tucsonhal@e...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:07pm
Subject: Re: repair manuals
I believe Dave is talking about the Popular Mechanics series of cd's, I have
one of theirs for my Jeep and it's not that much help. I find I've gotten
more help from my Haynes.
Thanks to everyone who had answers to my question about the Dana 30 vacuum
motor, I think I'll look more into BDS's Rock Lock. Anybody got any
experience with this piece of equipment?
Hal
6651 From: Chip Jones <twogun@c...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:24pm
Subject: Re: You know your a Jeep owner when...
Don't forget..Washing your Jeep means you're going to hose out the inside...
Chris Krieg wrote:
What about:
You know your a Jeep owner when...
Getting a bigger pumpkin does not mean Halloween is around the corner
Getting bigger meats does not mean a trip to the butcher
A quick disconnect is not something you do when you are on the phone with your
lover and the spouse walks in the room
a 4x4 is not a peice of lumber
Bead Locks do not hold a necklace together
A rollover is not something you do with an IRA
Crawling for a grown person is OK
When you explain to your co-workers that you bought a winch this weekend and
they ask you "can't you get thrown in jail for that?"
Tread Lightly is not what you do when coming home too late so the spouse does
not hear you.
When you see how far you can climb that 6 tons of rock that were just dropped
off for your front yard (see previous Arizona list)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
Attachment: (image/gif) [not stored]
6652 From: Chip Jones <twogun@c...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:27pm
Subject: Re: You know your a Jeep owner when...
Don't forget..Washing your Jeep means you're going to hose out the
inside...
Chris Krieg wrote:
>
>
> What about:
> You know your a Jeep owner when...
>
> Getting a bigger pumpkin does not mean Halloween is around the corner
>
> Getting bigger meats does not mean a trip to the butcher
>
> A quick disconnect is not something you do when you are on the phone with your
> lover and the spouse walks in the room
>
> a 4x4 is not a peice of lumber
>
> Bead Locks do not hold a necklace together
>
> A rollover is not something you do with an IRA
>
> Crawling for a grown person is OK
>
> When you explain to your co-workers that you bought a winch this weekend and
> they ask you "can't you get thrown in jail for that?"
>
> Tread Lightly is not what you do when coming home too late so the spouse does
> not hear you.
>
> When you see how far you can climb that 6 tons of rock that were just dropped
> off for your front yard (see previous Arizona list)
>
>
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
> www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
6653 From: Chris Krieg <rv6a@m...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:29pm
Subject: Re: You know you are a Jeep owner
What about:
Getting a bigger pumpkin does not mean halloween is around the corner
Getting bigger meats does not mean a trip to the butcher
A quick disconnect is not something you do when talking on the phone to a
lover when the spouse walks in the room.
A 4x4 is not a peice of lumber
Bead locks do not hold a necklace together
A rollover has nothing to do with IRAs
Tread Lightly is not what you do when coming home too late so the spouse
does not hear you.
When you look at that 6 tons of rock that was just delivered for your yard
(see previous post about Arizona) and wonder what RTI you could get on it.
>
> Ok, Linda, now you've started it. Can anyone add to these??
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> You know you are a Jeep owner if:
>
> You are constantly broke or soon to be broke.
>
> The more you spend on car parts, the harder it is to get in the car.
>
> You suffer from height envy (clearance envy, lift envy - insert one)
>
> Articulation doesn't mean speaking clearly
>
> Droop doesn't refer to jowls after age 50
>
> A Super Swamper is not a nifty swamp cooler.
>
> A run doesn't involve moving feet quickly
>
> "I'm just going to the store", means "I'm going off road for the rest of
> the day."
>
> Channel 4 is not NBC (CBS, ABC, FOX)
>
> Traction is not putting your broken leg in a sling.
>
> Class 4 doesn't mean the 4th grade
>
> Rubicon Express is not a high speed jewelry scam
>
> Lockers are not what you get for your door to keep burglars out.
>
>
> ---------------------------
> Jon Loveless
> 480-816-6240
> jloveless@e...
> ----------------------------
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get a FREE $10 gas card when you join carclub.com. As a member,
> you can save up to $550 a year if you own a car, and thousands
> more when you're buying one.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2063/4/_/1966/_/953058688/
>
> -- Check out your group's private Chat room
> -- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
6654 From: Andy's Jeep Account <amjeep@h...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:32pm
Subject: Re: repair manuals
Not sure if this will help, but the Phoenix library (on Central & about
McDowell) has the factory service manuals for almost all makes and models of
cars going back in some cases to the 1950s. The manuals are on the 2nd
floor (If I remember correctly) and are considered reference materials so
they can not be checked out, but there are plenty of copy machines available
for use.
As an example, my wife has a 92 Cadillac Eldorado.... that was blinking
strange diagnostic codes at her. I went to the library and located the 92
service manual and solved the problem, I saw service manuals for Cadillacs
from the 70's all the way to 99.
I have not yet gone down there to look at the service manual for the 99
Wrangler, but I am sure that they have many Jeep service manuals available.
These are the actual factory service manuals, not aftermarket books.
Andy & Tina Mason
Black 99TJ
-----Original Message-----
From: Len Sullivan [mailto:kermit@c...]
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 3:25 AM
To: AZVJC; 1FSJ@onelist.com
Subject: [az_vjc] repair manuals
Hello all
Stopped on the way home from work today and picked up a couple of Haynes
manuals (one full size Jeep, one full size Chevy since my truck is a hybrid)
and was/am very disappointed in them. I am planning on doing some "major"
repair/rebuild/improve work on the J-10 this summer and need some direction
for the projects I've never attempted before. I was hoping to find
instructions on the following subjects:
- upper/lower ball joint replacement on a Dana 44 front axle
- rebuild/overhaul on a NP208 transfer case
- rebuild/overhaul on a GM TH350 transmission
- rebuild/overhaul on a Dana 60 Trac-lock unit
Everything else I want to do I've either done before or found good
instructions on the net, but these are places that I've never gone before.
In the past, Haynes manuals have always been very descriptive and had
excellent diagrams, but things have changed. All four areas that I was
looking for (in both books) are now covered by the following text:
"Because of the special tools and skills needed, this work should be left
to a dealer service department or a qualified repair shop."
grumble, grumble, grumble
Does anyone have any recommendations on books or online sources for how-to
information on the subjects I'm after? I'm pretty sure that I can get the
TH350 tranny overhaul info from HP Books through work, but for the rest of
them I'm not sure where to start.........so I'm starting by asking the great
Jeep collective. :-)
many thanks in advance
Len Sullivan
'78 J-10
(mine's not cheep either! I kinda like Jeepolet)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
http://click.egroups.com/1/2377/4/_/1966/_/953093959/
-- Check out your group's private Chat room
-- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
6655 From: Len Sullivan <kermit@c...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 3:41am
Subject: Re: repair manuals
Cool! I'll go there tomorrow. Thank you very much!
Len
----- Original Message -----
From: Andy's Jeep Account <amjeep@h...>
To: Len Sullivan <kermit@c...>; AZVJC <az_vjc@m...>;
<1FSJ@onelist.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 10:32 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: repair manuals
> Not sure if this will help, but the Phoenix library (on Central & about
> McDowell) has the factory service manuals for almost all makes and models
of
> cars going back in some cases to the 1950s. The manuals are on the 2nd
> floor (If I remember correctly) and are considered reference materials so
> they can not be checked out, but there are plenty of copy machines
available
> for use.
>
> As an example, my wife has a 92 Cadillac Eldorado.... that was blinking
> strange diagnostic codes at her. I went to the library and located the 92
> service manual and solved the problem, I saw service manuals for Cadillacs
> from the 70's all the way to 99.
>
> I have not yet gone down there to look at the service manual for the 99
> Wrangler, but I am sure that they have many Jeep service manuals
available.
> These are the actual factory service manuals, not aftermarket books.
>
> Andy & Tina Mason
> Black 99TJ
>
6656 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 11:41pm
Subject: Re: repair manuals
http://www.thejeep.com/manual.html
They have manuals for all Jeeps up to 94
they are a bit pricey but they are factor service manuals.....
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: Len Sullivan [mailto:kermit@c...]
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 4:41 AM
To: Andy's Jeep Account; AZVJC
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: repair manuals
Cool! I'll go there tomorrow. Thank you very much!
Len
----- Original Message -----
From: Andy's Jeep Account <amjeep@h...>
To: Len Sullivan <kermit@c...>; AZVJC <az_vjc@m...>;
<1FSJ@onelist.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 10:32 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: repair manuals
> Not sure if this will help, but the Phoenix library (on Central & about
> McDowell) has the factory service manuals for almost all makes and models
of
> cars going back in some cases to the 1950s. The manuals are on the 2nd
> floor (If I remember correctly) and are considered reference materials so
> they can not be checked out, but there are plenty of copy machines
available
> for use.
>
> As an example, my wife has a 92 Cadillac Eldorado.... that was blinking
> strange diagnostic codes at her. I went to the library and located the 92
> service manual and solved the problem, I saw service manuals for Cadillacs
> from the 70's all the way to 99.
>
> I have not yet gone down there to look at the service manual for the 99
> Wrangler, but I am sure that they have many Jeep service manuals
available.
> These are the actual factory service manuals, not aftermarket books.
>
> Andy & Tina Mason
> Black 99TJ
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
http://click.egroups.com/1/2377/4/_/1966/_/953098456/
-- Check out your group's private Chat room
-- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
6657 From: Ken Unterriner <jeep108@h...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 0:52am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
I have a 454 in my cj7 with wrangler front clip and use the engine
driven fan.It is easier with the cj than the wrangler because they make
a lot of good radiators.I have an electric fan also to help when I'm
crawling but I don't think it has to be there.I found out that a shroud
is very important.Hope this helps.
Ken
"larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine driven
> cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
today who
> said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric fan.
>
> Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
>
> I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want to go
> electric.
>
> Larry
>
6658 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 2:42am
Subject: Here is another one...
http://www.factoryautomanuals.com/ <http://www.factoryautomanuals.com/>
6659 From: Jay Eller <four_by_nut@n...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 5:57am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
Yep, I have the 4 core radiator from Mepco. I am running the biggest flex fan
that I could get (19"?) and I made an "attempt" at fabricating a fan shroud. On
the street in the middle of the summer, the engine temps stay around 190F and
below (unless I am stuck in traffic, at which point it begins to climb). Off
road it tends to run a LOT hotter. I plan to go to dual electrics before this
summer and custom fab a really nice fan shroud for it. I feel I won't have ANY
problems both on and off road once I do that. Here's what I would do if you
want to run a mechanical fan. Get a 16" flex fan (or equivalent) and build a
real good shroud for it. Completely surround the fan such that it sits in a
"tunnel" and have the box portion of the shroud hug real tight to the outer
parts of the radiator. With this setup and the 4 core Mepco radiator, you won't
have problems overheating in the summers on the street. As for trail driving, I
think you might be pushing the hot limit with the mechanical fan. I think it
still will need a flow like its running down the road even while sitting still.
And this will only happen with electrics.
One other note, since having installed the 4 core and the fan shroud, I've
noticed that the sheet metal that they mount to has begun to "bow" such that the
radiator is moving closer to fan. The added weight of the radiator along with
the added weight of the fan shroud is too much for the sheet metal mounting
points to support. You will want to look to strengthen this area before you
mount the new radiator and shroud. Nothing more ugly than a fan eating your
brand new radiator! :-)
Hope this helps.
--
-Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
----------------------------------------------------------
83 CJ7
Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
(Not to be confused with how it looks...)
Larry Maggio wrote:
> Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine driven
> cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone today who
> said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric fan.
>
> Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
>
> I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want to go
> electric.
>
> Larry
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on the net.
> Try @Backup FREE and recieve 300 points from mypoints.com Install now:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2345/4/_/1966/_/953084139/
>
> -- Check out your group's private Chat room
> -- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
6660 From: Jay Eller <four_by_nut@n...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 6:12am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
What kind of radiator are you running? You guys are making me rethink my
idea of going electric. I've heard that a 2 core aluminum radiator is far
superior to a conventional copper 4 core. True? Are you running an
aluminum rad. with your 454?
--
-Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
----------------------------------------------------------
83 CJ7
Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
(Not to be confused with how it looks...)
Ken Unterriner wrote:
> I have a 454 in my cj7 with wrangler front clip and use the engine
> driven fan.It is easier with the cj than the wrangler because they make
> a lot of good radiators.I have an electric fan also to help when I'm
> crawling but I don't think it has to be there.I found out that a shroud
> is very important.Hope this helps.
>
> Ken
>
> "larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
> original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> > Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine driven
> > cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
> today who
> > said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric fan.
> >
> > Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
> >
> > I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want to go
> > electric.
> >
> > Larry
> >
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Special Offer-Earn 300 Points from MyPoints.com for trying @Backup
> Get automatic protection and access to your important computer files.
> Install today:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2344/4/_/1966/_/953110405/
>
> -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> -- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/az_vjc/?m=1
6661 From: T.J. Nosmo-King <ice626@h...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 0:02am
Subject: Re: No Subject
that does sound like a good idea.....I spent alot of time looking for AZVJC
decals on jeeps saturday....a banner/flag of some sort would definitely be
easier....
__________________________________________________ ____
6662 From: T.J. Nosmo-King <ice626@h...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 0:06am
Subject: Re: repair manuals
I just got a chiltons from ebay (paid 9.00)....there are always people
selling different jeep manuals on ebay....
__________________________________________________ ____
6663 From: mike stenson <mstens1@y...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 7:52am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
Well, from what Ive heard and seen 4 row cores simply move fluid too
fast to cool it at crawling speeds. I would recommend a 3 row high
effeciency core, an electric fan (for more reasons than just
overheating), and quite possibly an oil cooler. But, Im a bit anal
about cooling out here after a few hard learned lessons. Shrouds
either way are very important.
mike
jay eller <four_by_nu-@n...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6660
> What kind of radiator are you running? You guys are making me
rethink my
> idea of going electric. I've heard that a 2 core aluminum radiator
is far
> superior to a conventional copper 4 core. True? Are you running an
> aluminum rad. with your 454?
> --
> -Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> 83 CJ7
> Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
> (Not to be confused with how it looks...)
> Ken Unterriner wrote:
>
> > I have a 454 in my cj7 with wrangler front clip and use the engine
> > driven fan.It is easier with the cj than the wrangler because they
make
> > a lot of good radiators.I have an electric fan also to help when I'm
> > crawling but I don't think it has to be there.I found out that a
shroud
> > is very important.Hope this helps.
> >
> > Ken
> >
> > "larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
> > original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> > > Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine
driven
> > > cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
> > today who
> > > said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric
fan.
> > >
> > > Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
> > >
> > > I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want
to go
> > > electric.
> > >
> > > Larry
> > >
> >
6664 From: Joe West <joefwest@h...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 0:55am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
Mike,
I'm not an expert in thermodynamics (in fact, as an electrical engineer; I
hated the class), but I suspect that the difference in flow rate between a
three core radiator and four core radiator does not cause overheating in a
four core radiator at low speeds.
The four core radiator (all other things equal) will flow about 33% more
fluid through it than a three core radiator... however; the flow rate
through the radiator will not be determined significantly by the size
difference between a three and four core radiator, but rather; by the flow
rate of the water pump. The radiator creates a small backpressure to the
water pump, but if the system is designed properly, the backpressure caused
by the radiator will not be significant in a three core radiator, and it
will be even less in a four core radiator. Although a clogged radiator can
control water pump flow rate... a properly operating radiator will not.
The benefits of a four core radiator include;
Greater coolent capacity.
More surface area for increased energy dissipation.
Less back pressure on the water pump.
I can't think of a single drawback to a four core radiator (other than cost
perhaps) when compared to a three core radiator.
(although because the four core radiator is thicker... the resistance to air
flow through the radiator will increase causing a decrease air volume
through the radiator... but I suspect that this third-order effect is
negligible)
Perhaps we can get all those BSMEs out there (who liked thermodynamics) to
speak up and correct me if I'm wrong.
Regards,
Joe
Joe F. West
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
-----Original Message-----
From: mike stenson [mailto:mstens1@y...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2000 8:53 AM
To: az_vjc@eGroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
Well, from what Ive heard and seen 4 row cores simply move fluid too
fast to cool it at crawling speeds. I would recommend a 3 row high
effeciency core, an electric fan (for more reasons than just
overheating), and quite possibly an oil cooler. But, Im a bit anal
about cooling out here after a few hard learned lessons. Shrouds
either way are very important.
mike
jay eller <four_by_nu-@n...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6660
>What kind of radiator are you running? You guys are making me
rethink my
>idea of going electric. I've heard that a 2 core aluminum radiator
is far
>superior to a conventional copper 4 core. True? Are you running an
>aluminum rad. with your 454?
>--
>-Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
>----------------------------------------------------------
>83 CJ7
>Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
>(Not to be confused with how it looks...)
>Ken Unterriner wrote:
>
> > I have a 454 in my cj7 with wrangler front clip and use the engine
> > driven fan.It is easier with the cj than the wrangler because they
make
> > a lot of good radiators.I have an electric fan also to help when I'm
> > crawling but I don't think it has to be there.I found out that a
shroud
> > is very important.Hope this helps.
> >
> > Ken
> >
> > "larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
> > original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> > > Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine
driven
> > > cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
> > today who
> > > said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric
fan.
> > >
> > > Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
> > >
> > > I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want
to go
> > > electric.
> > >
> > > Larry
> > >
> >
__________________________________________________ ____
6665 From: Ken Unterriner <jeep108@h...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 9:00am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
My radiator is a stock wrangler one with an extra core added.They make
lots of aluminum radiators that would be great but cost too much for
me.I run a 7 blade clutch fan,I dont run a flex fan because they wont
pull enough air going slow and at idle.The guy who built my radiator
said that the shroud should be sit in front of the fan or half way into
to be effective.
Ken
jay eller <four_by_nu-@n...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6660
> What kind of radiator are you running? You guys are making me
rethink my
> idea of going electric. I've heard that a 2 core aluminum radiator
is far
> superior to a conventional copper 4 core. True? Are you running an
> aluminum rad. with your 454?
> --
> -Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> 83 CJ7
> Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
> (Not to be confused with how it looks...)
> Ken Unterriner wrote:
>
> > I have a 454 in my cj7 with wrangler front clip and use the engine
> > driven fan.It is easier with the cj than the wrangler because they
make
> > a lot of good radiators.I have an electric fan also to help when I'm
> > crawling but I don't think it has to be there.I found out that a
shroud
> > is very important.Hope this helps.
> >
> > Ken
> >
> > "larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
> > original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> > > Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine
driven
> > > cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
> > today who
> > > said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric
fan.
> > >
> > > Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
> > >
> > > I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want
to go
> > > electric.
> > >
> > > Larry
> > >
> >
6666 From: Sullivan, Len <LSULLIV@C...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 9:03am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
I think the man we need here is George Andrews...........as a nuclear
engineer he is rather well versed in thermodynamics.
As far as 'real world' experience goes, I replaced my 3 core rad with a 4
core last summer and noticed a significant improvement. I'm running a chevy
350 with a 19" flex fan - around town it sits right on 180 degrees, on the
trail it will sometimes climb up to 200 during a slow crawl. I added a 14"
electric pusher fan to the front of the radiator to help air flow during
slow crawls and to assist in cool down afterwards. I haven't 'needed' the
electric fan anytime except for the White Tanks run last summer when we were
down in a wash with virtually no air movement and a 120 degree ambient temp.
YMMV of course
Len Sullivan
Vendor Direct Transmissions
and Faxstar Operations Coordinator
CSK Automotive, Inc.
602.631.7845
mailto:lsulliv@c...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joe West
> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2000 9:55 AM
> To: mstens1@y...; az_vjc@eGroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan =
> overheating?
>
> Mike,
>
> I'm not an expert in thermodynamics (in fact, as an electrical engineer; I
>
> hated the class), but I suspect that the difference in flow rate between a
>
> three core radiator and four core radiator does not cause overheating in a
>
> four core radiator at low speeds.
>
>
6667 From: Michael Chatfield <mike.chatfield@r...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 9:13am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
Larry,
I run a Chevy 350 in my CJ-5. My dad runs a Chevy 350 in his CJ-7. My
brother had a Chevy 305 in his CJ-5. Previous to the 350 in my jeep I
had a Chevy 327. The only problems any of us have had with overheating
is when my waterpump failed on the 327 in Prescott (resulting in a
cracked block). None of us have a fan shroud, my Dad and I run 4 core
radiators. The important thing is that the fan is not to far away from
the radiator, or it will pull air from under the radiator rather than
through it. Which is why a fan shroud is used in some instances. When
running in hotter weather, my jeep does tend to get over 200, however,
by holding it at a fast idle when stopped at lights, or on the trail
moves the temp back down to under 190. An electric fan, under these
conditions (low idle, slow moving) would help cool the water in the
radiator by moving more air through it, but it doesn't turn the
waterpump any faster.
When I first bought my jeep it had a 258 with a serpentine belt system,
which requires a reverse flow engine fan. I had a hard time trying to
find one that would fit, so instead I bought an electric. In the
winter, the electric worked too good, and the engine would never get to
proper operating temperature. I had to keep turning it off and on
again (usually forgetting to turn it back on until it was well over
200).
My suggestion is this. Run the mechanical engine fan, either close to
the radiator, or with a shroud. If you start having over-heating
problems, find a slim electric fan, put in front of the radiator to
help push air through at slow speeds. You could hook it up either to a
switch inside, or to a temperature sensing relay switch.
Good Luck
Mike Chatfield.
"larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine driven
> cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
today who
> said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric fan.
>
> Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
>
> I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want to go
> electric.
>
> Larry
>
6643 From: Len Sullivan <kermit@c...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 2:25am
Subject: repair manuals
Hello all
Stopped on the way home from work today and picked up a couple of Haynes
manuals (one full size Jeep, one full size Chevy since my truck is a hybrid)
and was/am very disappointed in them. I am planning on doing some "major"
repair/rebuild/improve work on the J-10 this summer and need some direction
for the projects I've never attempted before. I was hoping to find
instructions on the following subjects:
- upper/lower ball joint replacement on a Dana 44 front axle
- rebuild/overhaul on a NP208 transfer case
- rebuild/overhaul on a GM TH350 transmission
- rebuild/overhaul on a Dana 60 Trac-lock unit
Everything else I want to do I've either done before or found good
instructions on the net, but these are places that I've never gone before.
In the past, Haynes manuals have always been very descriptive and had
excellent diagrams, but things have changed. All four areas that I was
looking for (in both books) are now covered by the following text:
"Because of the special tools and skills needed, this work should be left
to a dealer service department or a qualified repair shop."
grumble, grumble, grumble
Does anyone have any recommendations on books or online sources for how-to
information on the subjects I'm after? I'm pretty sure that I can get the
TH350 tranny overhaul info from HP Books through work, but for the rest of
them I'm not sure where to start.........so I'm starting by asking the great
Jeep collective. :-)
many thanks in advance
Len Sullivan
'78 J-10
(mine's not cheep either! I kinda like Jeepolet)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ADVERTISEMENT
6644 From: Pat <Dreamwev@m...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 8:24pm
Subject: Re: Fw: Dust Abatement Ordinance
Roger,
The Problem was/is in the north valley. The tickets were being issued to
bikers stirring up dust and using state land without permits. The officers
are relatively reasonable. Their hands are tied with this stupid 40+ year
old law. Unfortunately others that are not the problem have been dragged
into it. All the balloonists just west of I-17 were forbidden from using the
middle mountain area north of Happy Valley because of dust complaints. Its
like people that move next to an airport and then complain about the noise!
I am in no way admonishing some these bikers, though. Many of them are
creating some big problems in the north valley (cutting fences, chasing
cows, stirring up alot of dust, harassing other land users, etc.) And then
there are the people that target practice in these area and shoot up all
their garbage. BTW, in case any of you target shoot in the north valley,
make sure you are outside the city of Phoenix. This is illegal, and you will
be cited. City of Phoenix extends well past Carefree Highway along I-17 now.
Sorry Roger, now I'm getting off topic.
Patrick (Balloon pilot and Jeeper)
----- Original Message -----
From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
To: <tomasr@a...>; <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 7:03 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Dust Abatement Ordinance
> Roger,
> Not at all claiming to be the expert on this problem, from what I have
> heard, it appears that Phoenix PD are the ones writing the tickets, mostly
> on the North end of the valley. I guess they have annexed some area that
> has state land in the middle of it. Hence, they write tickets when the
> locals complain about the dust, etc. If you are not around the City of
> Phoenix area, I don't believe you will have much of a problem (just my
> opinion).
>
> Stu Olson N7QJP
> Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
>
> http://www.qsl.net/n7qjp/
> http://home.off-road.com/~stu
> http://www.users.uswest.west/~solson8
> Developer of VKE Digital Voice Keyer
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roger Tomas [mailto:tomasr@a...]
> Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 9:09 AM
> To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Dust Abatement Ordinance
>
>
> My state trust land recreational permit just expired and I'm thinking
> about renewing it. But having read here about people with permits being
> cited for the dust abatement ordinance, I'm having second thoughts. Can
> anyone tell me about this ordinance? Is it enforced everywhere or just
> close to town? Does it prohibit me from traveling on trust land in any
way
> or does it just prohibit me from kicking up a bunch of dust. And how much
> is a bunch? Sounds like the enforcement could be rather subjective. TIA!
>
> -Roger
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get a FREE $15 BN.com gift certificate when you join carclub.com.
> As a member, you can save up to $550 a year if you own a car, and
> thousands more when you're buying one.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2064/4/_/1966/_/953050182/
>
> -- Talk to your group with your own voice!
> -- http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on the net.
> Try @Backup FREE and recieve 300 points from mypoints.com Install now:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2345/4/_/1966/_/953085929/
>
> -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> -- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/az_vjc/?m=1
>
>
6645 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 8:19pm
Subject: Re: repair manuals
There is a company that puts a ton of rebuild info on cd rom I think checker
sells it maybe autozone. can't rember. You pick the vehicle you want off the
cd and if you want to add to it you can down load a passkey to open the
others for a minimal fee...
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: Len Sullivan [mailto:kermit@c...]
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 3:25 AM
To: AZVJC; 1FSJ@onelist.com
Subject: [az_vjc] repair manuals
Hello all
Stopped on the way home from work today and picked up a couple of Haynes
manuals (one full size Jeep, one full size Chevy since my truck is a hybrid)
and was/am very disappointed in them. I am planning on doing some "major"
repair/rebuild/improve work on the J-10 this summer and need some direction
for the projects I've never attempted before. I was hoping to find
instructions on the following subjects:
- upper/lower ball joint replacement on a Dana 44 front axle
- rebuild/overhaul on a NP208 transfer case
- rebuild/overhaul on a GM TH350 transmission
- rebuild/overhaul on a Dana 60 Trac-lock unit
Everything else I want to do I've either done before or found good
instructions on the net, but these are places that I've never gone before.
In the past, Haynes manuals have always been very descriptive and had
excellent diagrams, but things have changed. All four areas that I was
looking for (in both books) are now covered by the following text:
"Because of the special tools and skills needed, this work should be left
to a dealer service department or a qualified repair shop."
grumble, grumble, grumble
Does anyone have any recommendations on books or online sources for how-to
information on the subjects I'm after? I'm pretty sure that I can get the
TH350 tranny overhaul info from HP Books through work, but for the rest of
them I'm not sure where to start.........so I'm starting by asking the great
Jeep collective. :-)
many thanks in advance
Len Sullivan
'78 J-10
(mine's not cheep either! I kinda like Jeepolet)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
http://click.egroups.com/1/2377/4/_/1966/_/953093959/
-- Check out your group's private Chat room
-- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
6646 From: Pat <Dreamwev@m...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 8:33pm
Subject: Re: Fw: Fw: Dust Abatement Ordinance
Yup, That name sounds familiar. He's from somewhere midwest. He had a
commercial balloon contract for a asphalt company or something. He was here
for a season flying for a brand X balloon company. Why do you ask?
Patrick
----- Original Message -----
From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
To: 'Pat' <Dreamwev@m...>
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 9:22 PM
Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Re: Fw: Dust Abatement Ordinance
> Pat,
> By any chance do you know a guy by the name of Dennis Day? He is a
> Balloonist too..
>
> Dave
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pat [mailto:Dreamwev@m...]
> Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 9:24 PM
> To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Fw: Dust Abatement Ordinance
>
>
> Roger,
>
> The Problem was/is in the north valley. The tickets were being issued to
> bikers stirring up dust and using state land without permits. The officers
> are relatively reasonable. Their hands are tied with this stupid 40+ year
> old law. Unfortunately others that are not the problem have been dragged
> into it. All the balloonists just west of I-17 were forbidden from using
the
> middle mountain area north of Happy Valley because of dust complaints. Its
> like people that move next to an airport and then complain about the
noise!
>
> I am in no way admonishing some these bikers, though. Many of them are
> creating some big problems in the north valley (cutting fences, chasing
> cows, stirring up alot of dust, harassing other land users, etc.) And then
> there are the people that target practice in these area and shoot up all
> their garbage. BTW, in case any of you target shoot in the north valley,
> make sure you are outside the city of Phoenix. This is illegal, and you
will
> be cited. City of Phoenix extends well past Carefree Highway along I-17
now.
>
> Sorry Roger, now I'm getting off topic.
>
> Patrick (Balloon pilot and Jeeper)
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
> To: <tomasr@a...>; <az_vjc@egroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 7:03 PM
> Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Dust Abatement Ordinance
>
>
> > Roger,
> > Not at all claiming to be the expert on this problem, from what I have
> > heard, it appears that Phoenix PD are the ones writing the tickets,
mostly
> > on the North end of the valley. I guess they have annexed some area
that
> > has state land in the middle of it. Hence, they write tickets when the
> > locals complain about the dust, etc. If you are not around the City of
> > Phoenix area, I don't believe you will have much of a problem (just my
> > opinion).
> >
> > Stu Olson N7QJP
> > Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
> >
> > http://www.qsl.net/n7qjp/
> > http://home.off-road.com/~stu
> > http://www.users.uswest.west/~solson8
> > Developer of VKE Digital Voice Keyer
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Roger Tomas [mailto:tomasr@a...]
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 9:09 AM
> > To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> > Subject: [az_vjc] Dust Abatement Ordinance
> >
> >
> > My state trust land recreational permit just expired and I'm thinking
> > about renewing it. But having read here about people with permits being
> > cited for the dust abatement ordinance, I'm having second thoughts. Can
> > anyone tell me about this ordinance? Is it enforced everywhere or just
> > close to town? Does it prohibit me from traveling on trust land in any
> way
> > or does it just prohibit me from kicking up a bunch of dust. And how
much
> > is a bunch? Sounds like the enforcement could be rather subjective.
TIA!
> >
> > -Roger
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Get a FREE $15 BN.com gift certificate when you join carclub.com.
> > As a member, you can save up to $550 a year if you own a car, and
> > thousands more when you're buying one.
> > http://click.egroups.com/1/2064/4/_/1966/_/953050182/
> >
> > -- Talk to your group with your own voice!
> > -- http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on the net.
> > Try @Backup FREE and recieve 300 points from mypoints.com Install now:
> > http://click.egroups.com/1/2345/4/_/1966/_/953085929/
> >
> > -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> > -- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/az_vjc/?m=1
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2377/4/_/1966/_/953094178/
>
> -- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar!
> -- http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
6647 From: Hal Loy <tucsonhal@e...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 8:35pm
Subject: Re: No Subject
Good idea Dave, it would be a nice rally point at large events.
Hal
6648 From: <IlTODll@a...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 3:47pm
Subject: Re: You know you are a Jeep owner
You choose to lengthen a normally 13 hour drive by 2 hours just because you
wonder "what's at the other end of that forest road?"
The location of your vehicle's swaybar is either your backyard or your local
dump.
You say things like "it's just paint" and "trail damage is cool"
The location of your "blind spot" is above your "really blind spot," where
anything shorter than a buick disappears.
You get pissed off every time you hear someone say something like "I own a
Lexus Jeep."
You set aside quality time to be spent with your Jeep, and spend more money
on it than on your girlfriend.
6649 From: Leonard K. Pennock <leonardpennock@h...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:11pm
Subject: Re: repair manuals
Try the used book stores like Bookmans and see if you can find a Motors
repair manual. They were always more throughal than Chilton's.
Len Sullivan wrote:
>
> Hello all
>
> Stopped on the way home from work today and picked up a couple of Haynes
> manuals (one full size Jeep, one full size Chevy since my truck is a hybrid)
> and was/am very disappointed in them. I am planning on doing some "major"
> repair/rebuild/improve work on the J-10 this summer and need some direction
> for the projects I've never attempted before. I was hoping to find
> instructions on the following subjects:
>
> - upper/lower ball joint replacement on a Dana 44 front axle
> - rebuild/overhaul on a NP208 transfer case
> - rebuild/overhaul on a GM TH350 transmission
> - rebuild/overhaul on a Dana 60 Trac-lock unit
>
> Everything else I want to do I've either done before or found good
> instructions on the net, but these are places that I've never gone before.
> In the past, Haynes manuals have always been very descriptive and had
> excellent diagrams, but things have changed. All four areas that I was
> looking for (in both books) are now covered by the following text:
>
> "Because of the special tools and skills needed, this work should be left
> to a dealer service department or a qualified repair shop."
>
> grumble, grumble, grumble
>
> Does anyone have any recommendations on books or online sources for how-to
> information on the subjects I'm after? I'm pretty sure that I can get the
> TH350 tranny overhaul info from HP Books through work, but for the rest of
> them I'm not sure where to start.........so I'm starting by asking the great
> Jeep collective. :-)
>
> many thanks in advance
>
> Len Sullivan
> '78 J-10
> (mine's not cheep either! I kinda like Jeepolet)
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2377/4/_/1966/_/953093959/
>
> -- Check out your group's private Chat room
> -- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
--
Leonard K. Pennock
Those who walk bravely through life, unafraid of loss or failure,
find that they very rarely lose or fail.
6650 From: Hal Loy <tucsonhal@e...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:07pm
Subject: Re: repair manuals
I believe Dave is talking about the Popular Mechanics series of cd's, I have
one of theirs for my Jeep and it's not that much help. I find I've gotten
more help from my Haynes.
Thanks to everyone who had answers to my question about the Dana 30 vacuum
motor, I think I'll look more into BDS's Rock Lock. Anybody got any
experience with this piece of equipment?
Hal
6651 From: Chip Jones <twogun@c...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:24pm
Subject: Re: You know your a Jeep owner when...
Don't forget..Washing your Jeep means you're going to hose out the inside...
Chris Krieg wrote:
What about:
You know your a Jeep owner when...
Getting a bigger pumpkin does not mean Halloween is around the corner
Getting bigger meats does not mean a trip to the butcher
A quick disconnect is not something you do when you are on the phone with your
lover and the spouse walks in the room
a 4x4 is not a peice of lumber
Bead Locks do not hold a necklace together
A rollover is not something you do with an IRA
Crawling for a grown person is OK
When you explain to your co-workers that you bought a winch this weekend and
they ask you "can't you get thrown in jail for that?"
Tread Lightly is not what you do when coming home too late so the spouse does
not hear you.
When you see how far you can climb that 6 tons of rock that were just dropped
off for your front yard (see previous Arizona list)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
Attachment: (image/gif) [not stored]
6652 From: Chip Jones <twogun@c...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:27pm
Subject: Re: You know your a Jeep owner when...
Don't forget..Washing your Jeep means you're going to hose out the
inside...
Chris Krieg wrote:
>
>
> What about:
> You know your a Jeep owner when...
>
> Getting a bigger pumpkin does not mean Halloween is around the corner
>
> Getting bigger meats does not mean a trip to the butcher
>
> A quick disconnect is not something you do when you are on the phone with your
> lover and the spouse walks in the room
>
> a 4x4 is not a peice of lumber
>
> Bead Locks do not hold a necklace together
>
> A rollover is not something you do with an IRA
>
> Crawling for a grown person is OK
>
> When you explain to your co-workers that you bought a winch this weekend and
> they ask you "can't you get thrown in jail for that?"
>
> Tread Lightly is not what you do when coming home too late so the spouse does
> not hear you.
>
> When you see how far you can climb that 6 tons of rock that were just dropped
> off for your front yard (see previous Arizona list)
>
>
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
> www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
6653 From: Chris Krieg <rv6a@m...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:29pm
Subject: Re: You know you are a Jeep owner
What about:
Getting a bigger pumpkin does not mean halloween is around the corner
Getting bigger meats does not mean a trip to the butcher
A quick disconnect is not something you do when talking on the phone to a
lover when the spouse walks in the room.
A 4x4 is not a peice of lumber
Bead locks do not hold a necklace together
A rollover has nothing to do with IRAs
Tread Lightly is not what you do when coming home too late so the spouse
does not hear you.
When you look at that 6 tons of rock that was just delivered for your yard
(see previous post about Arizona) and wonder what RTI you could get on it.
>
> Ok, Linda, now you've started it. Can anyone add to these??
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> You know you are a Jeep owner if:
>
> You are constantly broke or soon to be broke.
>
> The more you spend on car parts, the harder it is to get in the car.
>
> You suffer from height envy (clearance envy, lift envy - insert one)
>
> Articulation doesn't mean speaking clearly
>
> Droop doesn't refer to jowls after age 50
>
> A Super Swamper is not a nifty swamp cooler.
>
> A run doesn't involve moving feet quickly
>
> "I'm just going to the store", means "I'm going off road for the rest of
> the day."
>
> Channel 4 is not NBC (CBS, ABC, FOX)
>
> Traction is not putting your broken leg in a sling.
>
> Class 4 doesn't mean the 4th grade
>
> Rubicon Express is not a high speed jewelry scam
>
> Lockers are not what you get for your door to keep burglars out.
>
>
> ---------------------------
> Jon Loveless
> 480-816-6240
> jloveless@e...
> ----------------------------
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get a FREE $10 gas card when you join carclub.com. As a member,
> you can save up to $550 a year if you own a car, and thousands
> more when you're buying one.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2063/4/_/1966/_/953058688/
>
> -- Check out your group's private Chat room
> -- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
6654 From: Andy's Jeep Account <amjeep@h...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 9:32pm
Subject: Re: repair manuals
Not sure if this will help, but the Phoenix library (on Central & about
McDowell) has the factory service manuals for almost all makes and models of
cars going back in some cases to the 1950s. The manuals are on the 2nd
floor (If I remember correctly) and are considered reference materials so
they can not be checked out, but there are plenty of copy machines available
for use.
As an example, my wife has a 92 Cadillac Eldorado.... that was blinking
strange diagnostic codes at her. I went to the library and located the 92
service manual and solved the problem, I saw service manuals for Cadillacs
from the 70's all the way to 99.
I have not yet gone down there to look at the service manual for the 99
Wrangler, but I am sure that they have many Jeep service manuals available.
These are the actual factory service manuals, not aftermarket books.
Andy & Tina Mason
Black 99TJ
-----Original Message-----
From: Len Sullivan [mailto:kermit@c...]
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 3:25 AM
To: AZVJC; 1FSJ@onelist.com
Subject: [az_vjc] repair manuals
Hello all
Stopped on the way home from work today and picked up a couple of Haynes
manuals (one full size Jeep, one full size Chevy since my truck is a hybrid)
and was/am very disappointed in them. I am planning on doing some "major"
repair/rebuild/improve work on the J-10 this summer and need some direction
for the projects I've never attempted before. I was hoping to find
instructions on the following subjects:
- upper/lower ball joint replacement on a Dana 44 front axle
- rebuild/overhaul on a NP208 transfer case
- rebuild/overhaul on a GM TH350 transmission
- rebuild/overhaul on a Dana 60 Trac-lock unit
Everything else I want to do I've either done before or found good
instructions on the net, but these are places that I've never gone before.
In the past, Haynes manuals have always been very descriptive and had
excellent diagrams, but things have changed. All four areas that I was
looking for (in both books) are now covered by the following text:
"Because of the special tools and skills needed, this work should be left
to a dealer service department or a qualified repair shop."
grumble, grumble, grumble
Does anyone have any recommendations on books or online sources for how-to
information on the subjects I'm after? I'm pretty sure that I can get the
TH350 tranny overhaul info from HP Books through work, but for the rest of
them I'm not sure where to start.........so I'm starting by asking the great
Jeep collective. :-)
many thanks in advance
Len Sullivan
'78 J-10
(mine's not cheep either! I kinda like Jeepolet)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
http://click.egroups.com/1/2377/4/_/1966/_/953093959/
-- Check out your group's private Chat room
-- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
6655 From: Len Sullivan <kermit@c...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 3:41am
Subject: Re: repair manuals
Cool! I'll go there tomorrow. Thank you very much!
Len
----- Original Message -----
From: Andy's Jeep Account <amjeep@h...>
To: Len Sullivan <kermit@c...>; AZVJC <az_vjc@m...>;
<1FSJ@onelist.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 10:32 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: repair manuals
> Not sure if this will help, but the Phoenix library (on Central & about
> McDowell) has the factory service manuals for almost all makes and models
of
> cars going back in some cases to the 1950s. The manuals are on the 2nd
> floor (If I remember correctly) and are considered reference materials so
> they can not be checked out, but there are plenty of copy machines
available
> for use.
>
> As an example, my wife has a 92 Cadillac Eldorado.... that was blinking
> strange diagnostic codes at her. I went to the library and located the 92
> service manual and solved the problem, I saw service manuals for Cadillacs
> from the 70's all the way to 99.
>
> I have not yet gone down there to look at the service manual for the 99
> Wrangler, but I am sure that they have many Jeep service manuals
available.
> These are the actual factory service manuals, not aftermarket books.
>
> Andy & Tina Mason
> Black 99TJ
>
6656 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Tue Mar 14, 2000 11:41pm
Subject: Re: repair manuals
http://www.thejeep.com/manual.html
They have manuals for all Jeeps up to 94
they are a bit pricey but they are factor service manuals.....
Dave
-----Original Message-----
From: Len Sullivan [mailto:kermit@c...]
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 4:41 AM
To: Andy's Jeep Account; AZVJC
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: repair manuals
Cool! I'll go there tomorrow. Thank you very much!
Len
----- Original Message -----
From: Andy's Jeep Account <amjeep@h...>
To: Len Sullivan <kermit@c...>; AZVJC <az_vjc@m...>;
<1FSJ@onelist.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2000 10:32 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: repair manuals
> Not sure if this will help, but the Phoenix library (on Central & about
> McDowell) has the factory service manuals for almost all makes and models
of
> cars going back in some cases to the 1950s. The manuals are on the 2nd
> floor (If I remember correctly) and are considered reference materials so
> they can not be checked out, but there are plenty of copy machines
available
> for use.
>
> As an example, my wife has a 92 Cadillac Eldorado.... that was blinking
> strange diagnostic codes at her. I went to the library and located the 92
> service manual and solved the problem, I saw service manuals for Cadillacs
> from the 70's all the way to 99.
>
> I have not yet gone down there to look at the service manual for the 99
> Wrangler, but I am sure that they have many Jeep service manuals
available.
> These are the actual factory service manuals, not aftermarket books.
>
> Andy & Tina Mason
> Black 99TJ
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
http://click.egroups.com/1/2377/4/_/1966/_/953098456/
-- Check out your group's private Chat room
-- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
6657 From: Ken Unterriner <jeep108@h...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 0:52am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
I have a 454 in my cj7 with wrangler front clip and use the engine
driven fan.It is easier with the cj than the wrangler because they make
a lot of good radiators.I have an electric fan also to help when I'm
crawling but I don't think it has to be there.I found out that a shroud
is very important.Hope this helps.
Ken
"larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine driven
> cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
today who
> said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric fan.
>
> Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
>
> I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want to go
> electric.
>
> Larry
>
6658 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 2:42am
Subject: Here is another one...
http://www.factoryautomanuals.com/ <http://www.factoryautomanuals.com/>
6659 From: Jay Eller <four_by_nut@n...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 5:57am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
Yep, I have the 4 core radiator from Mepco. I am running the biggest flex fan
that I could get (19"?) and I made an "attempt" at fabricating a fan shroud. On
the street in the middle of the summer, the engine temps stay around 190F and
below (unless I am stuck in traffic, at which point it begins to climb). Off
road it tends to run a LOT hotter. I plan to go to dual electrics before this
summer and custom fab a really nice fan shroud for it. I feel I won't have ANY
problems both on and off road once I do that. Here's what I would do if you
want to run a mechanical fan. Get a 16" flex fan (or equivalent) and build a
real good shroud for it. Completely surround the fan such that it sits in a
"tunnel" and have the box portion of the shroud hug real tight to the outer
parts of the radiator. With this setup and the 4 core Mepco radiator, you won't
have problems overheating in the summers on the street. As for trail driving, I
think you might be pushing the hot limit with the mechanical fan. I think it
still will need a flow like its running down the road even while sitting still.
And this will only happen with electrics.
One other note, since having installed the 4 core and the fan shroud, I've
noticed that the sheet metal that they mount to has begun to "bow" such that the
radiator is moving closer to fan. The added weight of the radiator along with
the added weight of the fan shroud is too much for the sheet metal mounting
points to support. You will want to look to strengthen this area before you
mount the new radiator and shroud. Nothing more ugly than a fan eating your
brand new radiator! :-)
Hope this helps.
--
-Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
----------------------------------------------------------
83 CJ7
Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
(Not to be confused with how it looks...)
Larry Maggio wrote:
> Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine driven
> cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone today who
> said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric fan.
>
> Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
>
> I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want to go
> electric.
>
> Larry
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> @Backup- Protect and Access your data any time, any where on the net.
> Try @Backup FREE and recieve 300 points from mypoints.com Install now:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2345/4/_/1966/_/953084139/
>
> -- Check out your group's private Chat room
> -- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
6660 From: Jay Eller <four_by_nut@n...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 6:12am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
What kind of radiator are you running? You guys are making me rethink my
idea of going electric. I've heard that a 2 core aluminum radiator is far
superior to a conventional copper 4 core. True? Are you running an
aluminum rad. with your 454?
--
-Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
----------------------------------------------------------
83 CJ7
Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
(Not to be confused with how it looks...)
Ken Unterriner wrote:
> I have a 454 in my cj7 with wrangler front clip and use the engine
> driven fan.It is easier with the cj than the wrangler because they make
> a lot of good radiators.I have an electric fan also to help when I'm
> crawling but I don't think it has to be there.I found out that a shroud
> is very important.Hope this helps.
>
> Ken
>
> "larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
> original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> > Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine driven
> > cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
> today who
> > said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric fan.
> >
> > Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
> >
> > I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want to go
> > electric.
> >
> > Larry
> >
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Special Offer-Earn 300 Points from MyPoints.com for trying @Backup
> Get automatic protection and access to your important computer files.
> Install today:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2344/4/_/1966/_/953110405/
>
> -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> -- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/az_vjc/?m=1
6661 From: T.J. Nosmo-King <ice626@h...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 0:02am
Subject: Re: No Subject
that does sound like a good idea.....I spent alot of time looking for AZVJC
decals on jeeps saturday....a banner/flag of some sort would definitely be
easier....
__________________________________________________ ____
6662 From: T.J. Nosmo-King <ice626@h...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 0:06am
Subject: Re: repair manuals
I just got a chiltons from ebay (paid 9.00)....there are always people
selling different jeep manuals on ebay....
__________________________________________________ ____
6663 From: mike stenson <mstens1@y...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 7:52am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
Well, from what Ive heard and seen 4 row cores simply move fluid too
fast to cool it at crawling speeds. I would recommend a 3 row high
effeciency core, an electric fan (for more reasons than just
overheating), and quite possibly an oil cooler. But, Im a bit anal
about cooling out here after a few hard learned lessons. Shrouds
either way are very important.
mike
jay eller <four_by_nu-@n...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6660
> What kind of radiator are you running? You guys are making me
rethink my
> idea of going electric. I've heard that a 2 core aluminum radiator
is far
> superior to a conventional copper 4 core. True? Are you running an
> aluminum rad. with your 454?
> --
> -Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> 83 CJ7
> Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
> (Not to be confused with how it looks...)
> Ken Unterriner wrote:
>
> > I have a 454 in my cj7 with wrangler front clip and use the engine
> > driven fan.It is easier with the cj than the wrangler because they
make
> > a lot of good radiators.I have an electric fan also to help when I'm
> > crawling but I don't think it has to be there.I found out that a
shroud
> > is very important.Hope this helps.
> >
> > Ken
> >
> > "larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
> > original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> > > Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine
driven
> > > cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
> > today who
> > > said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric
fan.
> > >
> > > Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
> > >
> > > I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want
to go
> > > electric.
> > >
> > > Larry
> > >
> >
6664 From: Joe West <joefwest@h...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 0:55am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
Mike,
I'm not an expert in thermodynamics (in fact, as an electrical engineer; I
hated the class), but I suspect that the difference in flow rate between a
three core radiator and four core radiator does not cause overheating in a
four core radiator at low speeds.
The four core radiator (all other things equal) will flow about 33% more
fluid through it than a three core radiator... however; the flow rate
through the radiator will not be determined significantly by the size
difference between a three and four core radiator, but rather; by the flow
rate of the water pump. The radiator creates a small backpressure to the
water pump, but if the system is designed properly, the backpressure caused
by the radiator will not be significant in a three core radiator, and it
will be even less in a four core radiator. Although a clogged radiator can
control water pump flow rate... a properly operating radiator will not.
The benefits of a four core radiator include;
Greater coolent capacity.
More surface area for increased energy dissipation.
Less back pressure on the water pump.
I can't think of a single drawback to a four core radiator (other than cost
perhaps) when compared to a three core radiator.
(although because the four core radiator is thicker... the resistance to air
flow through the radiator will increase causing a decrease air volume
through the radiator... but I suspect that this third-order effect is
negligible)
Perhaps we can get all those BSMEs out there (who liked thermodynamics) to
speak up and correct me if I'm wrong.
Regards,
Joe
Joe F. West
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
-----Original Message-----
From: mike stenson [mailto:mstens1@y...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2000 8:53 AM
To: az_vjc@eGroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
Well, from what Ive heard and seen 4 row cores simply move fluid too
fast to cool it at crawling speeds. I would recommend a 3 row high
effeciency core, an electric fan (for more reasons than just
overheating), and quite possibly an oil cooler. But, Im a bit anal
about cooling out here after a few hard learned lessons. Shrouds
either way are very important.
mike
jay eller <four_by_nu-@n...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6660
>What kind of radiator are you running? You guys are making me
rethink my
>idea of going electric. I've heard that a 2 core aluminum radiator
is far
>superior to a conventional copper 4 core. True? Are you running an
>aluminum rad. with your 454?
>--
>-Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
>----------------------------------------------------------
>83 CJ7
>Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
>(Not to be confused with how it looks...)
>Ken Unterriner wrote:
>
> > I have a 454 in my cj7 with wrangler front clip and use the engine
> > driven fan.It is easier with the cj than the wrangler because they
make
> > a lot of good radiators.I have an electric fan also to help when I'm
> > crawling but I don't think it has to be there.I found out that a
shroud
> > is very important.Hope this helps.
> >
> > Ken
> >
> > "larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
> > original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> > > Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine
driven
> > > cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
> > today who
> > > said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric
fan.
> > >
> > > Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
> > >
> > > I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want
to go
> > > electric.
> > >
> > > Larry
> > >
> >
__________________________________________________ ____
6665 From: Ken Unterriner <jeep108@h...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 9:00am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
My radiator is a stock wrangler one with an extra core added.They make
lots of aluminum radiators that would be great but cost too much for
me.I run a 7 blade clutch fan,I dont run a flex fan because they wont
pull enough air going slow and at idle.The guy who built my radiator
said that the shroud should be sit in front of the fan or half way into
to be effective.
Ken
jay eller <four_by_nu-@n...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6660
> What kind of radiator are you running? You guys are making me
rethink my
> idea of going electric. I've heard that a 2 core aluminum radiator
is far
> superior to a conventional copper 4 core. True? Are you running an
> aluminum rad. with your 454?
> --
> -Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> 83 CJ7
> Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
> (Not to be confused with how it looks...)
> Ken Unterriner wrote:
>
> > I have a 454 in my cj7 with wrangler front clip and use the engine
> > driven fan.It is easier with the cj than the wrangler because they
make
> > a lot of good radiators.I have an electric fan also to help when I'm
> > crawling but I don't think it has to be there.I found out that a
shroud
> > is very important.Hope this helps.
> >
> > Ken
> >
> > "larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
> > original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> > > Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine
driven
> > > cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
> > today who
> > > said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric
fan.
> > >
> > > Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
> > >
> > > I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want
to go
> > > electric.
> > >
> > > Larry
> > >
> >
6666 From: Sullivan, Len <LSULLIV@C...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 9:03am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
I think the man we need here is George Andrews...........as a nuclear
engineer he is rather well versed in thermodynamics.
As far as 'real world' experience goes, I replaced my 3 core rad with a 4
core last summer and noticed a significant improvement. I'm running a chevy
350 with a 19" flex fan - around town it sits right on 180 degrees, on the
trail it will sometimes climb up to 200 during a slow crawl. I added a 14"
electric pusher fan to the front of the radiator to help air flow during
slow crawls and to assist in cool down afterwards. I haven't 'needed' the
electric fan anytime except for the White Tanks run last summer when we were
down in a wash with virtually no air movement and a 120 degree ambient temp.
YMMV of course
Len Sullivan
Vendor Direct Transmissions
and Faxstar Operations Coordinator
CSK Automotive, Inc.
602.631.7845
mailto:lsulliv@c...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joe West
> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2000 9:55 AM
> To: mstens1@y...; az_vjc@eGroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan =
> overheating?
>
> Mike,
>
> I'm not an expert in thermodynamics (in fact, as an electrical engineer; I
>
> hated the class), but I suspect that the difference in flow rate between a
>
> three core radiator and four core radiator does not cause overheating in a
>
> four core radiator at low speeds.
>
>
6667 From: Michael Chatfield <mike.chatfield@r...>
Date: Wed Mar 15, 2000 9:13am
Subject: Re: SWB Jeep + V8 + engine driven fan = overheating?
Larry,
I run a Chevy 350 in my CJ-5. My dad runs a Chevy 350 in his CJ-7. My
brother had a Chevy 305 in his CJ-5. Previous to the 350 in my jeep I
had a Chevy 327. The only problems any of us have had with overheating
is when my waterpump failed on the 327 in Prescott (resulting in a
cracked block). None of us have a fan shroud, my Dad and I run 4 core
radiators. The important thing is that the fan is not to far away from
the radiator, or it will pull air from under the radiator rather than
through it. Which is why a fan shroud is used in some instances. When
running in hotter weather, my jeep does tend to get over 200, however,
by holding it at a fast idle when stopped at lights, or on the trail
moves the temp back down to under 190. An electric fan, under these
conditions (low idle, slow moving) would help cool the water in the
radiator by moving more air through it, but it doesn't turn the
waterpump any faster.
When I first bought my jeep it had a 258 with a serpentine belt system,
which requires a reverse flow engine fan. I had a hard time trying to
find one that would fit, so instead I bought an electric. In the
winter, the electric worked too good, and the engine would never get to
proper operating temperature. I had to keep turning it off and on
again (usually forgetting to turn it back on until it was well over
200).
My suggestion is this. Run the mechanical engine fan, either close to
the radiator, or with a shroud. If you start having over-heating
problems, find a slim electric fan, put in front of the radiator to
help push air through at slow speeds. You could hook it up either to a
switch inside, or to a temperature sensing relay switch.
Good Luck
Mike Chatfield.
"larry maggio" <lmaggi-@p...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6625
> Does anyone run a chevy V8 in a CJ or YJ, along with an engine driven
> cooling fan? Im back to work on my CJ and I was talking to someone
today who
> said I will have overheating problems if I didnt run an electric fan.
>
> Jay, are you still running the Mepco radiator? Fan shroud?
>
> I have and planned on using a Mepco 4-core radiator. I dont want to go
> electric.
>
> Larry
>