blooddrive
01-02-2004, 07:20 PM
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6192 From: joey <monosyllabicguy@w...>
Date: Sat Mar 4, 2000 11:02pm
Subject: Re: Problem
Robert ive had problems with the spark plug wires coming off the cap.
im figuring youre talking about a 304 which is what i have also. ive
also had problems with the spark plugs themselves working themselves
loose. i try to make it a point to check them every time i get back
from wheelin along with the bolts on the steering box and the bolts on
the hubs. it seems like all these come loose on every trip. ive never
heard of spark plugs coming loose on any other engines but i know mine
do on the 304. and no im not finger tightening them either. i torque
them down pretty good. also id check your wires. if ya just pull the
jeep into a garage at night and close the door and start the engine
with the hood up(make sure its pretty dark in there), just look in
there and see if you see any electricity running along the wires. hope
this helps
Joey
monosyllabic guy
robert nyberg <r.nyber-@w...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6181
> Well folks I was wrong. The fuel pump didn't fix the problem. I took
it
> down to the shop today and had it scoped out. Everything looked good
> except a week ballast resistor but I got a new one. I am out of ideas.
> Any help would sure help my sanity. Just as a refresher, the problem
is
> an intermittent miss at highway cruse speed. A tad worse up a gradual
> hill. Ignition good top to bottom. Carb rebuilt and set up. New fuel
> pump.
>
> Bob
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ADVERTISEMENT
6193 From: <A8868542@a...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 2:12am
Subject: Bar-BQ Oxen
Yesterday my Jeep went up in a ball of fire and smoke. The Blue Ox is no
more. I was running around on some hills south east of Tucson where I like
to go test out any tweaks or mods I ve done to my Jeep. As I was climbing
one of the steep loose little hills it stalled just before the top. Well I
tried to start it again in order to avoid that "oh crap" feeling of haveing
to roll off a steep grade in reverse. As I was cranking the engine it
seemed very hard to start and then poof. A little wiff of smoke appeard from
the engine compartment. I rolled back of the hill as quick as I could,
jumped from the Ox and grabbed my fire extinguiser. In those few seconds
hood had blistered and begun to bulge upward from the heat. I didn't dare
lift the hood for fear of adding oxygen to the fire and getting burned
myself. I stuck the fire extinguisher under the fenders and into the engine
compartment on both sides and emptied its contents. It seemed to squelch
things for a moment but then the fire broiled up again with a vengence. A
man on a quaud came racing over and saw my Ox cooking and then went zooming
off in the other direction. I had thought to grab only two things from my
Jeep when I jumped out and one, thank God, was my cell phone. I called 911
who put me in touch with the Tucson Fire Department who dispatched a truck.
The guy on the quad came back leading a man from a local construction site
that was driving a huge water tanker truck with a fire hose attached. By
then the Jeep was more then half engulfed in flames and was nearly a total
loss. The man on the quad was an ex-firefighter. He manned the hose from
the truck and was just about to get the fire out when we found out that the
tanker was 3/4 empty. Still the fire was 98% out when the water ran out
except for a small flame remaining at the filler neck of the fuel tank which
was full (20 gal). I thanked the two men who had tried so hard to help me
and they rode away. As they left the burning fuel filler neck melted away
and dropped onto the right rear tire which re-ignited and began burning
again. This eventually got hot enough to melt the main body of the
poly/plastic fuel tank and man then things got real hot. My Jeep was sending
flames 12 or 14 feet into the air. The smoke blacked out the sun above me
and I felt sick. Then I heard the sirens from the fire truck.
After the fire truck left I called Tom, my brother inlaw, who came to get
me. He brought me beers and smokes (what a good brother inlaw). We called a
tow service fellow who Tom knows and then waited as the vultures began to
circle. We hauled it to Tom's house where I can take my time seeing what if
anything can be salvaged. By the way, did I mention that the tweaks and mods
that I was testing out yesterday on those hills were Carberator
Modifications. I will realy miss that Jeep.
Al Dickson (Goat Boy)
81CJ7 (Blue Ox) The spirit lives
62 Scout 80 (Whoa Nellie)
98 Chevy 3/4T 4X4
6194 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 7:27am
Subject: Re: Bar-BQ Oxen
Sorry to hear it Al - Glad you weren't hurt. It may to too early to speak
of this (since your still in mourning), but we could all keep a lookout for
a new CJ for you.
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: <A8868542@a...>
To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>; <4critter@f...>; <dirtdog@u...>;
<jeep@a...>; <tim.naylor@w...>; <Azjpr53@a...>
Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 8:12 AM
Subject: [az_vjc] Bar-BQ Oxen
> Yesterday my Jeep went up in a ball of fire and smoke. The Blue Ox is
no
> more. I was running around on some hills south east of Tucson where I
like
> to go test out any tweaks or mods I ve done to my Jeep. As I was climbing
> one of the steep loose little hills it stalled just before the top. Well
I
> tried to start it again in order to avoid that "oh crap" feeling of
haveing
> to roll off a steep grade in reverse. As I was cranking the engine it
> seemed very hard to start and then poof. A little wiff of smoke appeard
from
> the engine compartment. I rolled back of the hill as quick as I could,
> jumped from the Ox and grabbed my fire extinguiser. In those few seconds
> hood had blistered and begun to bulge upward from the heat. I didn't dare
> lift the hood for fear of adding oxygen to the fire and getting burned
> myself. I stuck the fire extinguisher under the fenders and into the
engine
> compartment on both sides and emptied its contents. It seemed to squelch
> things for a moment but then the fire broiled up again with a vengence. A
> man on a quaud came racing over and saw my Ox cooking and then went
zooming
> off in the other direction. I had thought to grab only two things from my
> Jeep when I jumped out and one, thank God, was my cell phone. I called
911
> who put me in touch with the Tucson Fire Department who dispatched a
truck.
> The guy on the quad came back leading a man from a local construction site
> that was driving a huge water tanker truck with a fire hose attached. By
> then the Jeep was more then half engulfed in flames and was nearly a total
> loss. The man on the quad was an ex-firefighter. He manned the hose from
> the truck and was just about to get the fire out when we found out that
the
> tanker was 3/4 empty. Still the fire was 98% out when the water ran out
> except for a small flame remaining at the filler neck of the fuel tank
which
> was full (20 gal). I thanked the two men who had tried so hard to help me
> and they rode away. As they left the burning fuel filler neck melted away
> and dropped onto the right rear tire which re-ignited and began burning
> again. This eventually got hot enough to melt the main body of the
> poly/plastic fuel tank and man then things got real hot. My Jeep was
sending
> flames 12 or 14 feet into the air. The smoke blacked out the sun above me
> and I felt sick. Then I heard the sirens from the fire truck.
> After the fire truck left I called Tom, my brother inlaw, who came to
get
> me. He brought me beers and smokes (what a good brother inlaw). We
called a
> tow service fellow who Tom knows and then waited as the vultures began to
> circle. We hauled it to Tom's house where I can take my time seeing what
if
> anything can be salvaged. By the way, did I mention that the tweaks and
mods
> that I was testing out yesterday on those hills were Carberator
> Modifications. I will realy miss that Jeep.
>
> Al Dickson (Goat Boy)
> 81CJ7 (Blue Ox) The spirit lives
> 62 Scout 80 (Whoa Nellie)
> 98 Chevy 3/4T 4X4
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2130/4/_/1966/_/952269175/
>
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>
>
6195 From: Joe West <joefwest@h...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 0:16am
Subject: Crawl Ratio... How to calculate..
Hello Everyone,
I have a few moments on this rainy Sunday morning, and since I have never
calculated my crawl ratio, I decided to do it for the first time now. Let's
see if I can do this correctly.
(These details are for a TJ)
For 6 cylinder motors which have an AX15 Transmission, the first gear ratio
(the lowest and the only one we care about)is as follows:
3.83:1
For 4 cylinder motors which have the AX5 Transmission, the first gear ratio
is:
3.93:1
And for the Automatic, the first gear ratio is:
2.74:1
For all transfer cases (NV231), the low gear ratio is:
2.72:1
My axle ratios are 4.56:1
For any stock TJ with a Dana 44 it will be
3.73:1
For a 6 cylinder with a 35C rear axle the ratio will be
3.55:1 (I think)
For a 4 cylinder the rear axle ratio is
4.10:1 (I think)
So... after getting all this data together, I think that the crawl ratio
formula is:
(First Gear Ratio)*(Transfer Case Ratio)*(Rear Axle Ratio)=Crawl Ratio
For my TJ it would be:
(3.83)*(2.72)*(4.56)= 47.50
I really don't have any idea about what an adequate crawl ratio is... or how
much is too much, but I suspect that mine is a bit on the wimpy side...
<grin>
Just killing a few minutes. Everyone have a great weekend.
Joe West
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
__________________________________________________ ____
6196 From: <DirtTourist@a...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 3:32am
Subject: Re: Bar-BQ Oxen
We'll all be wearing black and flying flags at half mast. My sincerest
condolences for your loss. Keep the faith though... the spirit of the Blue Ox
will live on....
6197 From: Joe West <Joe.West@f...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 9:13am
Subject: Does ANYONE want ANY of this Stuff?
Hello Everyone,
Here's a short list of STUFF that I want to get rid of. No prices because
quite frankly, I'll take just about any price or sell it for free. I've
taken so much off of my 98TJ that my garage is full of barely used Jeep
parts... <grin>
If you are interested in any of the stuff below... just email me:
(All of these items are off of a 98TJ Sahara with 6 cylinder, 5 speed, Green
and Spice)
Factory spare tire cover for 30" wheel, Spice color with black Jeep logo.
Factory high performance shocks
Factory springs
Factory side steps
Factory beauty side covers
Factory trailer hitch and wiring
Factory Stereo and speakers (with cassette, no CD)
Factory tow hooks
Factory tie rod
Factory front track bar
Rear factory brake assemblies from backing plate to drums... complete and in
great shape.
Factory rear drive shaft assembly, complete.
Factory front bumper
Factory rear bumper
Factory 3.73:1 rear track-loc complete for Dana 44
Factory 3.73:1 front carrier, ring and pinion assembly for Dana 30
Factory Dana 30 axles (complete).
Factory front bumper beauty plate (where winch goes, says Jeep on it).
Factory Fog Light assemblies with brush guards (6 available).
If anyone wants anything... send me your request and your offer (even if it
is free) privately.
I can't see this stuff sitting around if anyone can use it.
Joe
Joe F. West
98TJ Completely Stock, Not an aftermarket part on it.
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
(Okay... so I lied) <grin>
6198 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 9:37am
Subject: extended brake lines for SOA CJ
Awhile back someone posted a question about what size brakelines to use when
going SOA. While attempting to clean out the 3000+ email msgs in my inbox I
came across this....
>Got a set of good, rubber extended brake hoses today thanks to Al
>Bsharah's tip. He told me about some Napa part number BH36957, >which
>turns out to be a Raybestos part number, if you want to buy it >at a
>cheaper store. The raybestos brand was $36 each (NAPA wanted >45 each),
>and I ended up getting the Coni-seal brand (same part, but >part number is
>10-36957) for $18 each. Turns out these are from a >1979-1987 Chevy C30
>truck, in case anybody is interested. The 1979 >ford one (Part number BH
>36931) would work also, but they were only >21" long, and the Chevy ones
>were 23" long. Also, the fitting at >the brake seemed like it might be too
>large, and not fit the brake >of the CJ. It looks like both would probably
>work with the CJ >though, and Al said they work with the YJ too.
Hope this helps... if they dont work you can always take them back.
Regards,
Larry
6199 From: James A Langdon <yucca-man@j...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 10:45am
Subject: Re: Bar-BQ Oxen
Al, that's quite a bummer about the Jeep, but most importantly you made
it out okay. The Jeep is always replaceable, hte driver (and any
passengers) are not. This gives you more time to figure out the brakes
on Whoa Nellie now, doesn't it?
Jim Yucca-man@j...
Dirty 1/2 dozen - Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
http://azvjc.web.com
89 Cherokee (Resurrected?) 73 CJ5 (RIP)
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6200 From: James A Langdon <yucca-man@j...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 11:23am
Subject: Re: Crawl Ratio... How to calculate..
Joe,
You got bored huh? Your 47.50:1 crawl ratio is actually bordering on
being pretty decent. When you get into the 50-60 range, that's where
most writers and Jeepers seem to agree that you've found good numbers.
Figure that at 800RPM idle, your tire only rotates 16.8 times per minute.
This is the only place where a smaller tire would help you, since it
woud not go as far as a larger one, reducing your feet per minute...
Anyway, also remember that although the automatic is 2.74:1, the
converter helps by almost doubling the output, so they really run
somewhere around 4-5:1.
For others in the Club who want to do their own math:
(Transmission 1st gear)x(transfer case lo-reduction)x(axle ratio)=crawl
ratio
3.39 (BA10/5) x 2.71(NP231) x 3.07=28.3:1 Cherokee
3.00 (T15) x 2.03 (Dana 20) x 4.27= 26:1 CJ5
Thanks for pointing out that my Cherokee actually crawls better than my
CJ, Joe...
BTW Joe, your Member's Rig age is hopelessly out-of-date...do you have
any updates? <G>
Jim Yucca-man@j...
Dirty 1/2 dozen - Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
http://azvjc.web.com
89 Cherokee (Resurrected?) 73 CJ5 (RIP)
__________________________________________________ ______________
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
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6201 From: linda luik <minihummer@w...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 0:30pm
Subject: Re: Arizona licenses and insurance
USFS, USNM, USPS, BLM, Arizona State Trust Land, Military reservations, Indian
Reservations all require vehicles to be licensed and insured with the exception
of some officially designated OHV areas. You can get recreational use licenses
for off-highway vehicles. I think they are similar to the green tags used in
California. I don't know if vehicles with this designation need to pass
emissions testing.
Linda
Daniel Weed wrote:
> The Laws of the Land are available on-line at:
>
> http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/ars.htm
>
> You should be able to find the answers regarding registration of off
> highway vehicles under section 28:
>
> http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/28/title28.htm
>
> Hope this helps. Sometimes the laws aren't very clear.
>
> -- Dan
> Revolvr@a...
>
> "kevin wyas" <nau88x-@h...> wrote:
> original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6167
> > hi all, i am moving to arizona in a couple months here. I am bringing
> > my XJ and I am thinking about buying a project CJ after I get down
> > there this summer. If I were to buy that CJ and make it a trail rig
> > that would only see dirt, not pavement. Would I have to license that
> > under AZ law and have insurance? What all fees are involved in AZ in
> > that situation (sales tax, property tax, licensing, etc.)....Also, on
> > my XJ, would I have to pay a bunch for licensing and stuff out there
> > where here in missouri i only pay about $20 a year for license? I
> > heard that AZ licensing fees suck.
> >
> >
> > thanks
> >
> > kevin
> >
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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6202 From: linda luik <minihummer@w...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 0:35pm
Subject: Re: Going UP!!!!!
Cool! XJ on steroids!
Linda
B H wrote:
> Doug and all,
>
> Just got through putting on the revolver shaclkes and 4" national 10 leaf
> springs.....then had to go th the local rental yard to borrow thier fork
> truck.....without the setup I was able to lift the cherokee front tire about
> 28" before the raer tire lifted.....with the new setup I can lift the front
> tire about 38" and thats with the 3" shocks.....tommorrow I put on the 4.5"
> I should pick up another 4+ inches. now all I need is those front alum
> spacers.....
>
> Brian Harmon
> 88 XJ
>
> __________________________________________________ _____
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6203 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 1:38pm
Subject: Fw: [JEEP-L] FWD: From Clark Collins, Blue Ribbon Coalition
Just a reminder that the Blue Ribbon Coalition has called for a National
Call In on Tue., March 7 - to protest the Roadless Initiative - for
details - see below. Every little bit helps.
Doug
> Subject: [JEEP-L] FWD: From Clark Collins, Blue Ribbon Coalition
> > Hey Guys -
> >
> > Mark your calendars - only takes a couple of minutes..
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > > ACTION ALERT
> > >
> > > To: All Multiple-Use Recreationists:
> > >
> > > MULTIPLE USE RECREATIONISTS TO CALL-IN ON MARCH 7
> > >
> > > On March 9, the anti-everyone-but-me crowd is planning a national
> > > call-in
> > > day to the US Forest Service urging them to (functionally) BAN all OHV
> > > recreation on lands managed by the Forest Service. We have to upstage
> > > them
> > > in a massive way by preempting their strike with one of our own!
> > >
> > > On March 7, the Blue Ribbon Coalition, along with a number of
> > > multiple-use
> > > recreation and resource groups, is planning a national PRO-OHV call-in
> > > day.
> > > The reason for having our call-in on March 7 is because if we don't
> > > separate our call-in by at least one day...our legislators and federal
> > > agencies might CONFUSE our call-in with that of our opponents.
> > >
> > > This is a maximum effort campaign by our side and all of us need to
make
> > >
> > > sure that we burn up the email, phone, and FAX lines into the Forest
> > > Service. Please reroute this ALERT to your own communication networks
> > > so
> > > that our voices will be heard by Chief Dombeck.
> > >
> > > Please email, phone, and FAX your positive comments about how
important
> > > responsible OHV recreation is to millions of Americans. Be sure and
> > > tell
> > > the Chief about how OHV recreation relates to your family or business.
> > >
> > > Here are some things you might include in your comments.
> > >
> > > 1) OHV users are protecting the environment by promoting user ethics
as
> > > outlined by groups and organizations such as; Tread Lightly!, the Blue
> > > Ribbon Coalition, United Four Wheel Drive Associations, American
Council
> > > of
> > > Snowmobile Associations, National Off Highway Vehicle Conservation
> > > Council,
> > > and the American Motorcyclist Association (list other groups in this
> > > list
> > > as well)
> > >
> > > 2) OHV users contribute thousands of man/woman hours each year on
> > > volunteer
> > > programs that protect and preserve our natural resources.
> > >
> > > 3) OHV users support managed recreational opportunities on Forest
> > > Service
> > > lands.
> > >
> > > 4) While most OHV users support the original intent of the 1964
> > > Wilderness
> > > Act to protect lands untrammeled by modern man, the lands currently
> > > available for multiple-use must be managed and remain open for the
> > > general
> > > public to use and enjoy for a wide variety of opportunities.
> > >
> > > 5) OHV users do not support the Presidents roadless directive that
could
> > >
> > > CLOSE millions of acres of prime multiple-use recreation areas that
have
> > >
> > > established and legal recreational roads, trails, and dispersed
> > > campgrounds.
> > >
> > > 6) Tell the Chief that you want him to ask for funds to adequately
> > > support
> > > the Forest Services recreation and trail programs. For many years the
> > > Forest Service has said they support recreation but they have NOT
asked
> > > for
> > > the appropriated monies to do so.
> > >
> > > Please call, email, and FAX to the numbers below on March 7th (if you
> > > can't
> > > get through on the 7th continue on the 8th):
> > >
> > > Chief Mike Dombeck
> > > Email: Mike.Dombeck/wo@f...
> > > FAX: (202)205-1765
> > > Phone: (202)205-1661
> > >
> > > Again, thanks for your time and effort to promote and protect
> > > responsible
> > > OHV recreation on our public lands. Don't let the Sierra Club, The
> > > Wilderness Society, the Wildlands Center for Preventing Roads, and
other
> > >
> > > extreme preservationist groups cast aspersions on all the hard work
that
> > >
> > > you have done to make OHV recreation the family-oriented sport it is
> > > today.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: jeep-l-unsubscribe@m...
> > For additional commands, e-mail: jeep-l-help@m...
> >
>
6204 From: linda luik <minihummer@w...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 2:02pm
Subject: Camp site - Rock Crawling Championship
Hi All,
I drove out the the Jamboree campsitejust as the National Guard was
leaving. They like to drive down the middle of the road and high speeds.
It's a good thing it was raining!
The Jamboree site looks great. I spent some time driving around it and
finally decided on the far east end. The campsite is easy to find and
can handle a large group including trailers, motor homes, etc.. It is
far enough off the road so that dust won't be a problem. Plenty of trees
for privacy and hanging solar showers.
Here's the directions.
Starting at Florence Junction (US60 and Hwy 79) go south (5.5 miles) to
Cottonwood Canyon Rd. Cottonwood Canyon Rd is just south of milepost
145 on the east side of Hwy 79. The entrance to the road is marked
with a flag pole. It is very easy to miss in the dark.
Go east on Cottonwood Canyon Rd. There is a fork in the road (3 miles).
Stay to the right. The road gets a little narrower and more washboard.
There are several entrances into the Jambore site on the left side of
the road after the fork. I think the first two are the easiest and
probably the best choices if you are coming in with a motorhome, large
travel trailer or car trailer. The next two have wash crossings that are
a little too steep.
After you enter the Jamboree site, head east. There isn't a road or
anything but there is plenty of room to maneuver. We'll be camped at the
far east end of the site.
I have attached a map in PDF file format. I hope it works.
I'll be camping there Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights. I am not
sure what would be a good meeting time or place, but I would like to set
up camp before dark. My idea is to meet at the Texaco Thursday at
5:00pm and head out to the campsite. Sound good? I can also hang white
plastic markers (plastic grocery bags) on Cottonwood Canyon Rd to help
anyone who is coming out after dark find the campsite. If you are coming
out on Friday or Saturday, just head out to the contest and look for the
dark blue ZJ. I don't know where the event route is but I will be at one
of the obstacles.
Ted: I don't know who is volunteering from the Lo-Rangers, but if any
are planning on camping out this will probably be the least 'zoo-like'
place.
Linda
Attachment: (application/pdf) map1.pdf [not stored]
6205 From: linda luik <minihummer@w...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 2:41pm
Subject: [Fwd: Stockton Record (March 5, 2000)]
FYI
Linda
From: Oo4x4@a...
Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 16:30:32 EST
Subject: Stockton Record (March 5, 2000)
To: landuse@m...
Sender: owner-landuse@m...
From: Donald C. Amador, 112531,1311
TO: "Amador", INTERNET:brdon_a@sharetrails.org
DATE: 3/5/00 3:47 AM
RE: Copy of: Article on Road Policy--Stockton Record (March 5, 2000)
* I wanted to share this article with you today from the Stockton Record.
It has quotes from Dombeck/ FS, CFA, BRC, Sierra Club, etc.
STOCKTON RECORD
Published March 5, 2000
Stanislaus National Forest
Agency looks at shifting road policy
By Francis P. Garland
Lode Bureau Chief
ANGELS CAMP -- The U.S. Forest Service on Friday shifted gears on its road
policy, moving its emphasis from building new roads to maintaining the
existing ones they need and closing those deemed expendable.
The proposed policy change was applauded by environmentalists who said it
will benefit taxpayers and improve water quality and wildlife habitat. But
some forest users said the new emphasis will limit access and could
increase the risk of catastrophic wildfire in the nation's forests.
About 12 percent of the nation's 380,000 miles of forest roads are found in
California's national forests. Of those 44,000 miles, about 2,900 are in
the Stanislaus National Forest.
Forest Service officials say a new policy is needed to reflect changes in
how the public uses the forest and to better address socioeconomic and
environmental impacts associated with road building and maintenance. In
addition, they say there's not enough money to take care of the 380,000
miles of forest roads that exist today.
Mike Dombeck, the Forest Service chief, said vehicle travel associated with
recreational use and tourism has dramatically increased in recent years
while more traditional forest road usage -- for timber harvesting and
management -- "is basically flat."
The proposal, Dombeck said, would enable the Forest Service to maintain its
existing road network in an "environmentally and fiscally responsible way."
The Forest Service claims to have at least an $8.4 billion
maintenance-and-reconstruction backlog and receives only about 20 percent
of the annual funding needed to keep its existing roads safe and
environmentally sound. Funding for road maintenance and construction fell
from $297 million in 1988 to $187 million in 1998.
Under the proposal, each of the 155 national forests and grasslands would
work with the public and local officials to identify heavily used roads
that require maintenance or upgrading as well as roads that are unused or
environmentally damaging that can be decommissioned or converted to other
uses.
Previously, policies focused on road building and maintenance, and only
limited attention was paid to decommissioning roads. With the change,
priority would be given to decommissioning those roads that pose the
greatest risk of environmental damage.
Decommissioning roads involves restoring them to a more natural state by
stabilizing slopes, restoring vegetation, blocking entrances, removing
culverts or changing drainage patterns.
New roads would be added only after carefully considering the financial
implications and only if there was a "compelling need." Such needs include
public safety, critical resource restoration and private-property access.
In any given year, the local forest funds the maintenance of about 500
miles of road. John Schmechel, a Forest Service spokesman, said last year
the Stanislaus National Forest budgeted about $800,000 to maintain 505
miles of road.
During an eight-year period that ended in 1999, 28.7 miles of new road were
built on the Stanislaus -- or about 3.6 miles per year. But another 266.3
miles were reconstructed and another 28 miles were obliterated, Schmechel
said.
Schmechel said if the new policy is approved, the environmental
requirements for building a new road on the Stanislaus won't change. But
instead of the local forest chief signing off on such a project, it would
need to be approved by the regional forester, based in San Francisco.
Schmechel said the "second level of review" is needed to ensure a
compelling need for a new road exists.
Robert Stack, with the Jumping Frog Research Institute of Angels Camp, said
he wasn't familiar with the details of the Forest Service proposal but said
the agency needs a "sensible" road-management policy because it can't
afford to do everything on its limited budget.
Sean Cosgrove, the Sierra Club's national forest-policy specialist, said
the proposal is long overdue.
"It's high time to move past subsidized road construction and logging on
the national forests," he said. "The Forest Service should seize this
opportunity to get its affairs in order and protect clean water and
wildlife habitat at the same time."
The proposal was skewered by other groups, including the California
Forestry Association. Chris Nance, an association spokesman, said past
Forest Service promises to involve the local community in important
decision-making have yet to materialize, and he holds out little hope that
local input will be genuinely considered during the road system analysis.
Nance also said a "one-size-fits-all" policy isn't appropriate and added
that closing roads could hamper firefighting efforts and exacerbate the
potential for catastrophic wildfires.
Don Amador, of the Blue Ribbon Coalition, a national recreation group that
champions multiple use of public lands, said the Forest Service proposal is
merely a bid to close millions of acres now available for different uses.
================================================== =========
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6206 From: B H <boh105@e...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 2:56pm
Subject: Re: Camp site - Rock Crawling Championship
Hi Linda,
I will be coming down about 12:00 from Flagstaff be there around 3:30 after
I do some stuff, Im gonna head straight to the camp sites and set up before
the meeting at 7:00.
Brian Harmon
88 XJ
PS thanks for the map and info!
On Sun, 05 Mar 2000 15:02:42 -0700, minihummer@w... wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I drove out the the Jamboree campsitejust as the National Guard was
> leaving. They like to drive down the middle of the road and high speeds.
> It's a good thing it was raining!
>
> The Jamboree site looks great. I spent some time driving around it and
> finally decided on the far east end. The campsite is easy to find and
> can handle a large group including trailers, motor homes, etc.. It is
> far enough off the road so that dust won't be a problem. Plenty of trees
> for privacy and hanging solar showers.
>
> Here's the directions.
>
> Starting at Florence Junction (US60 and Hwy 79) go south (5.5 miles) to
> Cottonwood Canyon Rd. Cottonwood Canyon Rd is just south of milepost
> 145 on the east side of Hwy 79. The entrance to the road is marked
> with a flag pole. It is very easy to miss in the dark.
>
> Go east on Cottonwood Canyon Rd. There is a fork in the road (3 miles).
> Stay to the right. The road gets a little narrower and more washboard.
>
> There are several entrances into the Jambore site on the left side of
> the road after the fork. I think the first two are the easiest and
> probably the best choices if you are coming in with a motorhome, large
> travel trailer or car trailer. The next two have wash crossings that are
> a little too steep.
>
> After you enter the Jamboree site, head east. There isn't a road or
> anything but there is plenty of room to maneuver. We'll be camped at the
> far east end of the site.
>
> I have attached a map in PDF file format. I hope it works.
>
> I'll be camping there Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights. I am not
> sure what would be a good meeting time or place, but I would like to set
> up camp before dark. My idea is to meet at the Texaco Thursday at
> 5:00pm and head out to the campsite. Sound good? I can also hang white
> plastic markers (plastic grocery bags) on Cottonwood Canyon Rd to help
> anyone who is coming out after dark find the campsite. If you are coming
> out on Friday or Saturday, just head out to the contest and look for the
> dark blue ZJ. I don't know where the event route is but I will be at one
> of the obstacles.
>
> Ted: I don't know who is volunteering from the Lo-Rangers, but if any
> are planning on camping out this will probably be the least 'zoo-like'
> place.
>
> Linda
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Planning a party? iParty.com is your complete source for party planning
and
> supplies, with everything you need to throw the perfect party!
> http://click.egroups.com/1/1635/4/_/1966/_/952293596/
>
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>
> << File Attachment Removed: "application/pdf;
> name="map1.pdf"" >>
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6207 From: Tom Quinn <tquinn@u...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 4:47pm
Subject: Re: Camp site - Rock Crawling Championship
What time does the actual rock crawling begin on Friday and Saturday?
> Hi Linda,
>
> I will be coming down about 12:00 from Flagstaff be there around 3:30
after
> I do some stuff, Im gonna head straight to the camp sites and set up
before
> the meeting at 7:00.
>
> Brian Harmon
> 88 XJ
>
> PS thanks for the map and info!
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, 05 Mar 2000 15:02:42 -0700, minihummer@w... wrote:
>
> > Hi All,
> >
> > I drove out the the Jamboree campsitejust as the National Guard was
> > leaving. They like to drive down the middle of the road and high
speeds.
> > It's a good thing it was raining!
> >
> > The Jamboree site looks great. I spent some time driving around it
and
> > finally decided on the far east end. The campsite is easy to find
and
> > can handle a large group including trailers, motor homes, etc.. It
is
> > far enough off the road so that dust won't be a problem. Plenty of
trees
> > for privacy and hanging solar showers.
> >
> > Here's the directions.
> >
> > Starting at Florence Junction (US60 and Hwy 79) go south (5.5
miles) to
> > Cottonwood Canyon Rd. Cottonwood Canyon Rd is just south of
milepost
> > 145 on the east side of Hwy 79. The entrance to the road is
marked
> > with a flag pole. It is very easy to miss in the dark.
> >
> > Go east on Cottonwood Canyon Rd. There is a fork in the road (3
miles).
> > Stay to the right. The road gets a little narrower and more
washboard.
> >
> > There are several entrances into the Jambore site on the left side
of
> > the road after the fork. I think the first two are the easiest and
> > probably the best choices if you are coming in with a motorhome,
large
> > travel trailer or car trailer. The next two have wash crossings
that are
> > a little too steep.
> >
> > After you enter the Jamboree site, head east. There isn't a road or
> > anything but there is plenty of room to maneuver. We'll be camped
at the
> > far east end of the site.
> >
> > I have attached a map in PDF file format. I hope it works.
> >
> > I'll be camping there Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights. I am
not
> > sure what would be a good meeting time or place, but I would like
to set
> > up camp before dark. My idea is to meet at the Texaco Thursday at
> > 5:00pm and head out to the campsite. Sound good? I can also hang
white
> > plastic markers (plastic grocery bags) on Cottonwood Canyon Rd to
help
> > anyone who is coming out after dark find the campsite. If you are
coming
> > out on Friday or Saturday, just head out to the contest and look
for the
> > dark blue ZJ. I don't know where the event route is but I will be
at one
> > of the obstacles.
> >
> > Ted: I don't know who is volunteering from the Lo-Rangers, but if
any
> > are planning on camping out this will probably be the least
'zoo-like'
> > place.
> >
> > Linda
> >
> >
6208 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 5:18pm
Subject: Re: Thanks, Jon!
Jon....outstanding job on the organization of this event!
Attached is a shot of the results from Saturday. I snapped it at about 4:30
PM, when the group I was with got back from coves 4 and 5.
For those of you who missed the weekend, you missed an opportunity to meet
some great folks, catch some rays while retrieving the trash, and a great
day of wheeling on Sunday (look Mom, no dust!)
Thanks again Jon and to all that came!
Stu Olson N7QJP
Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
http://www.qsl.net/n7qjp/
http://home.off-road.com/~stu
http://www.users.uswest.west/~solson8
Developer of VKE Digital Voice Keyer
-----Original Message-----
From: Joe West [mailto:Joe.West@future.ca]
Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 8:19 PM
To: 'DougB'; Jeep AzVJC
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Thanks, Jon!
Here Here!!!
It was kind of nice getting to feel like I contributed something to our
sport. It took a great deal of work to organize this... great job Jon! By
the way Jon... I have a gift for all your hard work the next time we get
together. <grin>
Joe
Joe F. West
98TJ Completely Stock, Not an aftermarket part on it.
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
(Okay... so I lied) <grin>
-----Original Message-----
From: DougB [mailto:azjeep@home.com]
Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 7:43 PM
To: Jeep AzVJC
Subject: [az_vjc] Thanks, Jon!
Just want to say thanks, Jon - for organizing the Coves clean up. It went
great. We had about 30 vehicles, and pulled out gobs of junk. I'm sure there
will be some photo's posted.
Doug
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Attachment: (image/jpeg) MVC-169S.JPG [not stored]
6209 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 5:31pm
Subject: Re: Crawl Ratio... How to calculate..
Joe,
Your crawl ratio is not up to standards for the Warn Rockcrawling series,
but it is not that bad either. With the 4.56 gears, you are doing the best
you will get until you:
a. pop for a Tera 4:1 lo-kit, which will put out around 75:1
b. pop for a new tranny with a granny gear of about 6:1
c. pop for a new t-case with a lower lo-range
Even option A is kind of pricey, but not as bad as B or C. I like my 4.56
gears and had a great chance this morning at the Coves to test them out
(first good chance since last month's install).
Later.......Stu
Stu Olson N7QJP
Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
http://www.qsl.net/n7qjp/
http://home.off-road.com/~stu
http://www.users.uswest.west/~solson8
Developer of VKE Digital Voice Keyer
-----Original Message-----
From: Joe West [mailto:joefwest@h...]
Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 9:16 AM
To: az_vjc@eGroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Crawl Ratio... How to calculate..
Hello Everyone,
I have a few moments on this rainy Sunday morning, and since I have never
calculated my crawl ratio, I decided to do it for the first time now. Let's
see if I can do this correctly.
(These details are for a TJ)
For 6 cylinder motors which have an AX15 Transmission, the first gear ratio
(the lowest and the only one we care about)is as follows:
3.83:1
For 4 cylinder motors which have the AX5 Transmission, the first gear ratio
is:
3.93:1
And for the Automatic, the first gear ratio is:
2.74:1
For all transfer cases (NV231), the low gear ratio is:
2.72:1
My axle ratios are 4.56:1
For any stock TJ with a Dana 44 it will be
3.73:1
For a 6 cylinder with a 35C rear axle the ratio will be
3.55:1 (I think)
For a 4 cylinder the rear axle ratio is
4.10:1 (I think)
So... after getting all this data together, I think that the crawl ratio
formula is:
(First Gear Ratio)*(Transfer Case Ratio)*(Rear Axle Ratio)=Crawl Ratio
For my TJ it would be:
(3.83)*(2.72)*(4.56)= 47.50
I really don't have any idea about what an adequate crawl ratio is... or how
much is too much, but I suspect that mine is a bit on the wimpy side...
<grin>
Just killing a few minutes. Everyone have a great weekend.
Joe West
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
__________________________________________________ ____
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6210 From: Joe F. West <joewest2@h...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 8:14am
Subject: Calculating Crawl Ratio... Here's how I think it is done:
Hello Everyone,
I have a few moments on this rainy Sunday morning, and since I have never
calculated my crawl ratio, I decided to do it for the first time now. Let's
see if I can do this correctly.
(These details are for a TJ)
For 6 cylinder motors which have an AX15 Transmission, the first gear ratio
(the lowest and the only one we care about)is as follows:
3.83:1
For 4 cylinder motors which have the AX5 Transmission, the first gear ratio
is:
3.93:1
And for the Automatic, the first gear ratio is:
2.74:1
For all transfer cases (NV231), the low gear ratio is:
2.72:1
My axle ratios are 4.56:1
For any stock TJ with a Dana 44 it will be
3.73:1
For a 6 cylinder with a 35C rear axle the ratio will be
3.55:1 (I think)
For a 4 cylinder the rear axle ratio is
4.10:1 (I think)
So... after getting all this data together, I think that the crawl ratio
formula is:
(First Gear Ratio)*(Transfer Case Ratio)*(Rear Axle Ratio)=Crawl Ratio
For my TJ it would be:
(3.83)*(2.72)*(4.56)= 47.50
I really don't have any idea about what an adequate crawl ratio is... or how
much is too much, but I suspect that mine is a bit on the wimpy side...
<grin>
Just killing a few minutes. Everyone have a great weekend.
Joe West
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
6211 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 10:36am
Subject: Re: Bar-BQ Oxen
Al,
I am sorry to hear the bad news. I hope you are able to salvage something.
Take care and thank god you didn't get hurt...
Dave
6212 From: <AphroDsyak@a...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 2:52pm
Subject: rock crawling event.
I have a couple questions regarding this event. When does it start? How
do you get to the trails will you be able to drive??? I would assume there
would be nowhere to park. Any special passes or permits to view this event???
I am thinking of driving early and I was wondering how I would go about
seeing one of the run one of the days? could i get some suggestions and
some info on what to expect besides a ton of people. thank you ERIC
6213 From: <AphroDsyak@a...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 3:15pm
Subject: shocks. and the tj
I have a question. I saw the tera shock relocators. Does anyone know what
they run?? and what about that maco part what is it?? Same thing?? Where can
I get one? The big thing is I Reinstalled my shocks can up to prevent them
from smacking the perch. The *** end of my tj bounces horribly now??? Do
shocks not work upside down?? I am looking to go from the procomp 3000 to a
ranch 9000 but do they all have to be can down??? I don't know much about
shocks but I know some use oil. Would that cause them not to work well or at
all?? till the get seriously compressed?? Are there any shocks that you can
do this with??? I have read a lot of the install articles for the RE lift
and they say install upside down. I cant imagine them driving theirs if it
acts anything like mine does. PLEASE HELP THIS IS SOOOOOO ANNOYING>
ERIC
6214 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 8:33pm
Subject: shocks. and the tj
Not sure about the Pro Comps, but many shocks work equally well upside
down.
The Pro Comps tend to be on the stiff side, though.
As to the Tera relocators, they run about $40 and can be purchased from any
Tera dealer.
BTW, even w/ the relocators, you'll likely need for the rears to be can up.
Doug
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <AphroDsyak@a...>
> To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>
> Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 9:15 PM
> Subject: [az_vjc] shocks. and the tj
>
>
> I have a question. I saw the tera shock relocators. Does anyone know
> what
> they run?? and what about that maco part what is it?? Same thing?? Where
> can
> I get one? The big thing is I Reinstalled my shocks can up to prevent
> them
> from smacking the perch. The *** end of my tj bounces horribly now???
Do
> shocks not work upside down?? I am looking to go from the procomp 3000
> to a
> ranch 9000 but do they all have to be can down??? I don't know much
> about
> shocks but I know some use oil. Would that cause them not to work well
or
> at
> all?? till the get seriously compressed?? Are there any shocks that you
> can
> do this with??? I have read a lot of the install articles for the RE
lift
> and they say install upside down. I cant imagine them driving theirs if
> it
> acts anything like mine does. PLEASE HELP THIS IS SOOOOOO ANNOYING>
>
> ERIC
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2130/4/_/1966/_/952316179/
>
> -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> -- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/az_vjc/?m=1
>
>
>
6215 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 8:51pm
Subject: Re: shocks. and the tj
The Tera shock brackets are not yet available. They are still printing up
instructions and should be ready some time in the next week.
----- Original Message -----
From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
To: Jeep AzVJC <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 9:33 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] shocks. and the tj
> Not sure about the Pro Comps, but many shocks work equally well upside
> down.
> The Pro Comps tend to be on the stiff side, though.
>
> As to the Tera relocators, they run about $40 and can be purchased from
any
> Tera dealer.
>
> BTW, even w/ the relocators, you'll likely need for the rears to be can
up.
>
> Doug
>
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <AphroDsyak@a...>
> > To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 9:15 PM
> > Subject: [az_vjc] shocks. and the tj
> >
> >
> > I have a question. I saw the tera shock relocators. Does anyone know
> > what
> > they run?? and what about that maco part what is it?? Same thing??
Where
> > can
> > I get one? The big thing is I Reinstalled my shocks can up to prevent
> > them
> > from smacking the perch. The *** end of my tj bounces horribly now???
> Do
> > shocks not work upside down?? I am looking to go from the procomp 3000
> > to a
> > ranch 9000 but do they all have to be can down??? I don't know much
> > about
> > shocks but I know some use oil. Would that cause them not to work well
> or
> > at
> > all?? till the get seriously compressed?? Are there any shocks that
you
> > can
> > do this with??? I have read a lot of the install articles for the RE
> lift
> > and they say install upside down. I cant imagine them driving theirs
if
> > it
> > acts anything like mine does. PLEASE HELP THIS IS SOOOOOO ANNOYING>
> >
> > ERIC
> >
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
> > http://click.egroups.com/1/2130/4/_/1966/_/952316179/
> >
> > -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> > -- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/az_vjc/?m=1
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get a FREE $10 gas card when you join carclub.com. As a member,
> you can save up to $550 a year if you own a car, and thousands
> more when you're buying one.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2063/4/_/1966/_/952317286/
>
> -- Talk to your group with your own voice!
> -- http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
>
6216 From: Jeff Chapman <jkchapman@u...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 8:57pm
Subject: Opinion/Wheels
Hey everyone.I'm gonna be gettin' my wheels & tires this week,:D
Been looking real serious at the centerline "Hellcats",but some say
they are hard to keep clean.Anyone running these?Your opinion is greatly
appreciated! 99TJ
6192 From: joey <monosyllabicguy@w...>
Date: Sat Mar 4, 2000 11:02pm
Subject: Re: Problem
Robert ive had problems with the spark plug wires coming off the cap.
im figuring youre talking about a 304 which is what i have also. ive
also had problems with the spark plugs themselves working themselves
loose. i try to make it a point to check them every time i get back
from wheelin along with the bolts on the steering box and the bolts on
the hubs. it seems like all these come loose on every trip. ive never
heard of spark plugs coming loose on any other engines but i know mine
do on the 304. and no im not finger tightening them either. i torque
them down pretty good. also id check your wires. if ya just pull the
jeep into a garage at night and close the door and start the engine
with the hood up(make sure its pretty dark in there), just look in
there and see if you see any electricity running along the wires. hope
this helps
Joey
monosyllabic guy
robert nyberg <r.nyber-@w...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6181
> Well folks I was wrong. The fuel pump didn't fix the problem. I took
it
> down to the shop today and had it scoped out. Everything looked good
> except a week ballast resistor but I got a new one. I am out of ideas.
> Any help would sure help my sanity. Just as a refresher, the problem
is
> an intermittent miss at highway cruse speed. A tad worse up a gradual
> hill. Ignition good top to bottom. Carb rebuilt and set up. New fuel
> pump.
>
> Bob
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ADVERTISEMENT
6193 From: <A8868542@a...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 2:12am
Subject: Bar-BQ Oxen
Yesterday my Jeep went up in a ball of fire and smoke. The Blue Ox is no
more. I was running around on some hills south east of Tucson where I like
to go test out any tweaks or mods I ve done to my Jeep. As I was climbing
one of the steep loose little hills it stalled just before the top. Well I
tried to start it again in order to avoid that "oh crap" feeling of haveing
to roll off a steep grade in reverse. As I was cranking the engine it
seemed very hard to start and then poof. A little wiff of smoke appeard from
the engine compartment. I rolled back of the hill as quick as I could,
jumped from the Ox and grabbed my fire extinguiser. In those few seconds
hood had blistered and begun to bulge upward from the heat. I didn't dare
lift the hood for fear of adding oxygen to the fire and getting burned
myself. I stuck the fire extinguisher under the fenders and into the engine
compartment on both sides and emptied its contents. It seemed to squelch
things for a moment but then the fire broiled up again with a vengence. A
man on a quaud came racing over and saw my Ox cooking and then went zooming
off in the other direction. I had thought to grab only two things from my
Jeep when I jumped out and one, thank God, was my cell phone. I called 911
who put me in touch with the Tucson Fire Department who dispatched a truck.
The guy on the quad came back leading a man from a local construction site
that was driving a huge water tanker truck with a fire hose attached. By
then the Jeep was more then half engulfed in flames and was nearly a total
loss. The man on the quad was an ex-firefighter. He manned the hose from
the truck and was just about to get the fire out when we found out that the
tanker was 3/4 empty. Still the fire was 98% out when the water ran out
except for a small flame remaining at the filler neck of the fuel tank which
was full (20 gal). I thanked the two men who had tried so hard to help me
and they rode away. As they left the burning fuel filler neck melted away
and dropped onto the right rear tire which re-ignited and began burning
again. This eventually got hot enough to melt the main body of the
poly/plastic fuel tank and man then things got real hot. My Jeep was sending
flames 12 or 14 feet into the air. The smoke blacked out the sun above me
and I felt sick. Then I heard the sirens from the fire truck.
After the fire truck left I called Tom, my brother inlaw, who came to get
me. He brought me beers and smokes (what a good brother inlaw). We called a
tow service fellow who Tom knows and then waited as the vultures began to
circle. We hauled it to Tom's house where I can take my time seeing what if
anything can be salvaged. By the way, did I mention that the tweaks and mods
that I was testing out yesterday on those hills were Carberator
Modifications. I will realy miss that Jeep.
Al Dickson (Goat Boy)
81CJ7 (Blue Ox) The spirit lives
62 Scout 80 (Whoa Nellie)
98 Chevy 3/4T 4X4
6194 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 7:27am
Subject: Re: Bar-BQ Oxen
Sorry to hear it Al - Glad you weren't hurt. It may to too early to speak
of this (since your still in mourning), but we could all keep a lookout for
a new CJ for you.
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: <A8868542@a...>
To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>; <4critter@f...>; <dirtdog@u...>;
<jeep@a...>; <tim.naylor@w...>; <Azjpr53@a...>
Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 8:12 AM
Subject: [az_vjc] Bar-BQ Oxen
> Yesterday my Jeep went up in a ball of fire and smoke. The Blue Ox is
no
> more. I was running around on some hills south east of Tucson where I
like
> to go test out any tweaks or mods I ve done to my Jeep. As I was climbing
> one of the steep loose little hills it stalled just before the top. Well
I
> tried to start it again in order to avoid that "oh crap" feeling of
haveing
> to roll off a steep grade in reverse. As I was cranking the engine it
> seemed very hard to start and then poof. A little wiff of smoke appeard
from
> the engine compartment. I rolled back of the hill as quick as I could,
> jumped from the Ox and grabbed my fire extinguiser. In those few seconds
> hood had blistered and begun to bulge upward from the heat. I didn't dare
> lift the hood for fear of adding oxygen to the fire and getting burned
> myself. I stuck the fire extinguisher under the fenders and into the
engine
> compartment on both sides and emptied its contents. It seemed to squelch
> things for a moment but then the fire broiled up again with a vengence. A
> man on a quaud came racing over and saw my Ox cooking and then went
zooming
> off in the other direction. I had thought to grab only two things from my
> Jeep when I jumped out and one, thank God, was my cell phone. I called
911
> who put me in touch with the Tucson Fire Department who dispatched a
truck.
> The guy on the quad came back leading a man from a local construction site
> that was driving a huge water tanker truck with a fire hose attached. By
> then the Jeep was more then half engulfed in flames and was nearly a total
> loss. The man on the quad was an ex-firefighter. He manned the hose from
> the truck and was just about to get the fire out when we found out that
the
> tanker was 3/4 empty. Still the fire was 98% out when the water ran out
> except for a small flame remaining at the filler neck of the fuel tank
which
> was full (20 gal). I thanked the two men who had tried so hard to help me
> and they rode away. As they left the burning fuel filler neck melted away
> and dropped onto the right rear tire which re-ignited and began burning
> again. This eventually got hot enough to melt the main body of the
> poly/plastic fuel tank and man then things got real hot. My Jeep was
sending
> flames 12 or 14 feet into the air. The smoke blacked out the sun above me
> and I felt sick. Then I heard the sirens from the fire truck.
> After the fire truck left I called Tom, my brother inlaw, who came to
get
> me. He brought me beers and smokes (what a good brother inlaw). We
called a
> tow service fellow who Tom knows and then waited as the vultures began to
> circle. We hauled it to Tom's house where I can take my time seeing what
if
> anything can be salvaged. By the way, did I mention that the tweaks and
mods
> that I was testing out yesterday on those hills were Carberator
> Modifications. I will realy miss that Jeep.
>
> Al Dickson (Goat Boy)
> 81CJ7 (Blue Ox) The spirit lives
> 62 Scout 80 (Whoa Nellie)
> 98 Chevy 3/4T 4X4
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2130/4/_/1966/_/952269175/
>
> -- Check out your group's private Chat room
> -- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
6195 From: Joe West <joefwest@h...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 0:16am
Subject: Crawl Ratio... How to calculate..
Hello Everyone,
I have a few moments on this rainy Sunday morning, and since I have never
calculated my crawl ratio, I decided to do it for the first time now. Let's
see if I can do this correctly.
(These details are for a TJ)
For 6 cylinder motors which have an AX15 Transmission, the first gear ratio
(the lowest and the only one we care about)is as follows:
3.83:1
For 4 cylinder motors which have the AX5 Transmission, the first gear ratio
is:
3.93:1
And for the Automatic, the first gear ratio is:
2.74:1
For all transfer cases (NV231), the low gear ratio is:
2.72:1
My axle ratios are 4.56:1
For any stock TJ with a Dana 44 it will be
3.73:1
For a 6 cylinder with a 35C rear axle the ratio will be
3.55:1 (I think)
For a 4 cylinder the rear axle ratio is
4.10:1 (I think)
So... after getting all this data together, I think that the crawl ratio
formula is:
(First Gear Ratio)*(Transfer Case Ratio)*(Rear Axle Ratio)=Crawl Ratio
For my TJ it would be:
(3.83)*(2.72)*(4.56)= 47.50
I really don't have any idea about what an adequate crawl ratio is... or how
much is too much, but I suspect that mine is a bit on the wimpy side...
<grin>
Just killing a few minutes. Everyone have a great weekend.
Joe West
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
__________________________________________________ ____
6196 From: <DirtTourist@a...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 3:32am
Subject: Re: Bar-BQ Oxen
We'll all be wearing black and flying flags at half mast. My sincerest
condolences for your loss. Keep the faith though... the spirit of the Blue Ox
will live on....
6197 From: Joe West <Joe.West@f...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 9:13am
Subject: Does ANYONE want ANY of this Stuff?
Hello Everyone,
Here's a short list of STUFF that I want to get rid of. No prices because
quite frankly, I'll take just about any price or sell it for free. I've
taken so much off of my 98TJ that my garage is full of barely used Jeep
parts... <grin>
If you are interested in any of the stuff below... just email me:
(All of these items are off of a 98TJ Sahara with 6 cylinder, 5 speed, Green
and Spice)
Factory spare tire cover for 30" wheel, Spice color with black Jeep logo.
Factory high performance shocks
Factory springs
Factory side steps
Factory beauty side covers
Factory trailer hitch and wiring
Factory Stereo and speakers (with cassette, no CD)
Factory tow hooks
Factory tie rod
Factory front track bar
Rear factory brake assemblies from backing plate to drums... complete and in
great shape.
Factory rear drive shaft assembly, complete.
Factory front bumper
Factory rear bumper
Factory 3.73:1 rear track-loc complete for Dana 44
Factory 3.73:1 front carrier, ring and pinion assembly for Dana 30
Factory Dana 30 axles (complete).
Factory front bumper beauty plate (where winch goes, says Jeep on it).
Factory Fog Light assemblies with brush guards (6 available).
If anyone wants anything... send me your request and your offer (even if it
is free) privately.
I can't see this stuff sitting around if anyone can use it.
Joe
Joe F. West
98TJ Completely Stock, Not an aftermarket part on it.
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
(Okay... so I lied) <grin>
6198 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 9:37am
Subject: extended brake lines for SOA CJ
Awhile back someone posted a question about what size brakelines to use when
going SOA. While attempting to clean out the 3000+ email msgs in my inbox I
came across this....
>Got a set of good, rubber extended brake hoses today thanks to Al
>Bsharah's tip. He told me about some Napa part number BH36957, >which
>turns out to be a Raybestos part number, if you want to buy it >at a
>cheaper store. The raybestos brand was $36 each (NAPA wanted >45 each),
>and I ended up getting the Coni-seal brand (same part, but >part number is
>10-36957) for $18 each. Turns out these are from a >1979-1987 Chevy C30
>truck, in case anybody is interested. The 1979 >ford one (Part number BH
>36931) would work also, but they were only >21" long, and the Chevy ones
>were 23" long. Also, the fitting at >the brake seemed like it might be too
>large, and not fit the brake >of the CJ. It looks like both would probably
>work with the CJ >though, and Al said they work with the YJ too.
Hope this helps... if they dont work you can always take them back.
Regards,
Larry
6199 From: James A Langdon <yucca-man@j...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 10:45am
Subject: Re: Bar-BQ Oxen
Al, that's quite a bummer about the Jeep, but most importantly you made
it out okay. The Jeep is always replaceable, hte driver (and any
passengers) are not. This gives you more time to figure out the brakes
on Whoa Nellie now, doesn't it?
Jim Yucca-man@j...
Dirty 1/2 dozen - Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
http://azvjc.web.com
89 Cherokee (Resurrected?) 73 CJ5 (RIP)
__________________________________________________ ______________
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6200 From: James A Langdon <yucca-man@j...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 11:23am
Subject: Re: Crawl Ratio... How to calculate..
Joe,
You got bored huh? Your 47.50:1 crawl ratio is actually bordering on
being pretty decent. When you get into the 50-60 range, that's where
most writers and Jeepers seem to agree that you've found good numbers.
Figure that at 800RPM idle, your tire only rotates 16.8 times per minute.
This is the only place where a smaller tire would help you, since it
woud not go as far as a larger one, reducing your feet per minute...
Anyway, also remember that although the automatic is 2.74:1, the
converter helps by almost doubling the output, so they really run
somewhere around 4-5:1.
For others in the Club who want to do their own math:
(Transmission 1st gear)x(transfer case lo-reduction)x(axle ratio)=crawl
ratio
3.39 (BA10/5) x 2.71(NP231) x 3.07=28.3:1 Cherokee
3.00 (T15) x 2.03 (Dana 20) x 4.27= 26:1 CJ5
Thanks for pointing out that my Cherokee actually crawls better than my
CJ, Joe...
BTW Joe, your Member's Rig age is hopelessly out-of-date...do you have
any updates? <G>
Jim Yucca-man@j...
Dirty 1/2 dozen - Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
http://azvjc.web.com
89 Cherokee (Resurrected?) 73 CJ5 (RIP)
__________________________________________________ ______________
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
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6201 From: linda luik <minihummer@w...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 0:30pm
Subject: Re: Arizona licenses and insurance
USFS, USNM, USPS, BLM, Arizona State Trust Land, Military reservations, Indian
Reservations all require vehicles to be licensed and insured with the exception
of some officially designated OHV areas. You can get recreational use licenses
for off-highway vehicles. I think they are similar to the green tags used in
California. I don't know if vehicles with this designation need to pass
emissions testing.
Linda
Daniel Weed wrote:
> The Laws of the Land are available on-line at:
>
> http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/ars.htm
>
> You should be able to find the answers regarding registration of off
> highway vehicles under section 28:
>
> http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/28/title28.htm
>
> Hope this helps. Sometimes the laws aren't very clear.
>
> -- Dan
> Revolvr@a...
>
> "kevin wyas" <nau88x-@h...> wrote:
> original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=6167
> > hi all, i am moving to arizona in a couple months here. I am bringing
> > my XJ and I am thinking about buying a project CJ after I get down
> > there this summer. If I were to buy that CJ and make it a trail rig
> > that would only see dirt, not pavement. Would I have to license that
> > under AZ law and have insurance? What all fees are involved in AZ in
> > that situation (sales tax, property tax, licensing, etc.)....Also, on
> > my XJ, would I have to pay a bunch for licensing and stuff out there
> > where here in missouri i only pay about $20 a year for license? I
> > heard that AZ licensing fees suck.
> >
> >
> > thanks
> >
> > kevin
> >
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Planning a party? iParty.com is your complete source for party planning and
> supplies, with everything you need to throw the perfect party!
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6202 From: linda luik <minihummer@w...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 0:35pm
Subject: Re: Going UP!!!!!
Cool! XJ on steroids!
Linda
B H wrote:
> Doug and all,
>
> Just got through putting on the revolver shaclkes and 4" national 10 leaf
> springs.....then had to go th the local rental yard to borrow thier fork
> truck.....without the setup I was able to lift the cherokee front tire about
> 28" before the raer tire lifted.....with the new setup I can lift the front
> tire about 38" and thats with the 3" shocks.....tommorrow I put on the 4.5"
> I should pick up another 4+ inches. now all I need is those front alum
> spacers.....
>
> Brian Harmon
> 88 XJ
>
> __________________________________________________ _____
> Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite
> Visit http://freeworld.excite.com
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> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
6203 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 1:38pm
Subject: Fw: [JEEP-L] FWD: From Clark Collins, Blue Ribbon Coalition
Just a reminder that the Blue Ribbon Coalition has called for a National
Call In on Tue., March 7 - to protest the Roadless Initiative - for
details - see below. Every little bit helps.
Doug
> Subject: [JEEP-L] FWD: From Clark Collins, Blue Ribbon Coalition
> > Hey Guys -
> >
> > Mark your calendars - only takes a couple of minutes..
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > > ACTION ALERT
> > >
> > > To: All Multiple-Use Recreationists:
> > >
> > > MULTIPLE USE RECREATIONISTS TO CALL-IN ON MARCH 7
> > >
> > > On March 9, the anti-everyone-but-me crowd is planning a national
> > > call-in
> > > day to the US Forest Service urging them to (functionally) BAN all OHV
> > > recreation on lands managed by the Forest Service. We have to upstage
> > > them
> > > in a massive way by preempting their strike with one of our own!
> > >
> > > On March 7, the Blue Ribbon Coalition, along with a number of
> > > multiple-use
> > > recreation and resource groups, is planning a national PRO-OHV call-in
> > > day.
> > > The reason for having our call-in on March 7 is because if we don't
> > > separate our call-in by at least one day...our legislators and federal
> > > agencies might CONFUSE our call-in with that of our opponents.
> > >
> > > This is a maximum effort campaign by our side and all of us need to
make
> > >
> > > sure that we burn up the email, phone, and FAX lines into the Forest
> > > Service. Please reroute this ALERT to your own communication networks
> > > so
> > > that our voices will be heard by Chief Dombeck.
> > >
> > > Please email, phone, and FAX your positive comments about how
important
> > > responsible OHV recreation is to millions of Americans. Be sure and
> > > tell
> > > the Chief about how OHV recreation relates to your family or business.
> > >
> > > Here are some things you might include in your comments.
> > >
> > > 1) OHV users are protecting the environment by promoting user ethics
as
> > > outlined by groups and organizations such as; Tread Lightly!, the Blue
> > > Ribbon Coalition, United Four Wheel Drive Associations, American
Council
> > > of
> > > Snowmobile Associations, National Off Highway Vehicle Conservation
> > > Council,
> > > and the American Motorcyclist Association (list other groups in this
> > > list
> > > as well)
> > >
> > > 2) OHV users contribute thousands of man/woman hours each year on
> > > volunteer
> > > programs that protect and preserve our natural resources.
> > >
> > > 3) OHV users support managed recreational opportunities on Forest
> > > Service
> > > lands.
> > >
> > > 4) While most OHV users support the original intent of the 1964
> > > Wilderness
> > > Act to protect lands untrammeled by modern man, the lands currently
> > > available for multiple-use must be managed and remain open for the
> > > general
> > > public to use and enjoy for a wide variety of opportunities.
> > >
> > > 5) OHV users do not support the Presidents roadless directive that
could
> > >
> > > CLOSE millions of acres of prime multiple-use recreation areas that
have
> > >
> > > established and legal recreational roads, trails, and dispersed
> > > campgrounds.
> > >
> > > 6) Tell the Chief that you want him to ask for funds to adequately
> > > support
> > > the Forest Services recreation and trail programs. For many years the
> > > Forest Service has said they support recreation but they have NOT
asked
> > > for
> > > the appropriated monies to do so.
> > >
> > > Please call, email, and FAX to the numbers below on March 7th (if you
> > > can't
> > > get through on the 7th continue on the 8th):
> > >
> > > Chief Mike Dombeck
> > > Email: Mike.Dombeck/wo@f...
> > > FAX: (202)205-1765
> > > Phone: (202)205-1661
> > >
> > > Again, thanks for your time and effort to promote and protect
> > > responsible
> > > OHV recreation on our public lands. Don't let the Sierra Club, The
> > > Wilderness Society, the Wildlands Center for Preventing Roads, and
other
> > >
> > > extreme preservationist groups cast aspersions on all the hard work
that
> > >
> > > you have done to make OHV recreation the family-oriented sport it is
> > > today.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: jeep-l-unsubscribe@m...
> > For additional commands, e-mail: jeep-l-help@m...
> >
>
6204 From: linda luik <minihummer@w...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 2:02pm
Subject: Camp site - Rock Crawling Championship
Hi All,
I drove out the the Jamboree campsitejust as the National Guard was
leaving. They like to drive down the middle of the road and high speeds.
It's a good thing it was raining!
The Jamboree site looks great. I spent some time driving around it and
finally decided on the far east end. The campsite is easy to find and
can handle a large group including trailers, motor homes, etc.. It is
far enough off the road so that dust won't be a problem. Plenty of trees
for privacy and hanging solar showers.
Here's the directions.
Starting at Florence Junction (US60 and Hwy 79) go south (5.5 miles) to
Cottonwood Canyon Rd. Cottonwood Canyon Rd is just south of milepost
145 on the east side of Hwy 79. The entrance to the road is marked
with a flag pole. It is very easy to miss in the dark.
Go east on Cottonwood Canyon Rd. There is a fork in the road (3 miles).
Stay to the right. The road gets a little narrower and more washboard.
There are several entrances into the Jambore site on the left side of
the road after the fork. I think the first two are the easiest and
probably the best choices if you are coming in with a motorhome, large
travel trailer or car trailer. The next two have wash crossings that are
a little too steep.
After you enter the Jamboree site, head east. There isn't a road or
anything but there is plenty of room to maneuver. We'll be camped at the
far east end of the site.
I have attached a map in PDF file format. I hope it works.
I'll be camping there Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights. I am not
sure what would be a good meeting time or place, but I would like to set
up camp before dark. My idea is to meet at the Texaco Thursday at
5:00pm and head out to the campsite. Sound good? I can also hang white
plastic markers (plastic grocery bags) on Cottonwood Canyon Rd to help
anyone who is coming out after dark find the campsite. If you are coming
out on Friday or Saturday, just head out to the contest and look for the
dark blue ZJ. I don't know where the event route is but I will be at one
of the obstacles.
Ted: I don't know who is volunteering from the Lo-Rangers, but if any
are planning on camping out this will probably be the least 'zoo-like'
place.
Linda
Attachment: (application/pdf) map1.pdf [not stored]
6205 From: linda luik <minihummer@w...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 2:41pm
Subject: [Fwd: Stockton Record (March 5, 2000)]
FYI
Linda
From: Oo4x4@a...
Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 16:30:32 EST
Subject: Stockton Record (March 5, 2000)
To: landuse@m...
Sender: owner-landuse@m...
From: Donald C. Amador, 112531,1311
TO: "Amador", INTERNET:brdon_a@sharetrails.org
DATE: 3/5/00 3:47 AM
RE: Copy of: Article on Road Policy--Stockton Record (March 5, 2000)
* I wanted to share this article with you today from the Stockton Record.
It has quotes from Dombeck/ FS, CFA, BRC, Sierra Club, etc.
STOCKTON RECORD
Published March 5, 2000
Stanislaus National Forest
Agency looks at shifting road policy
By Francis P. Garland
Lode Bureau Chief
ANGELS CAMP -- The U.S. Forest Service on Friday shifted gears on its road
policy, moving its emphasis from building new roads to maintaining the
existing ones they need and closing those deemed expendable.
The proposed policy change was applauded by environmentalists who said it
will benefit taxpayers and improve water quality and wildlife habitat. But
some forest users said the new emphasis will limit access and could
increase the risk of catastrophic wildfire in the nation's forests.
About 12 percent of the nation's 380,000 miles of forest roads are found in
California's national forests. Of those 44,000 miles, about 2,900 are in
the Stanislaus National Forest.
Forest Service officials say a new policy is needed to reflect changes in
how the public uses the forest and to better address socioeconomic and
environmental impacts associated with road building and maintenance. In
addition, they say there's not enough money to take care of the 380,000
miles of forest roads that exist today.
Mike Dombeck, the Forest Service chief, said vehicle travel associated with
recreational use and tourism has dramatically increased in recent years
while more traditional forest road usage -- for timber harvesting and
management -- "is basically flat."
The proposal, Dombeck said, would enable the Forest Service to maintain its
existing road network in an "environmentally and fiscally responsible way."
The Forest Service claims to have at least an $8.4 billion
maintenance-and-reconstruction backlog and receives only about 20 percent
of the annual funding needed to keep its existing roads safe and
environmentally sound. Funding for road maintenance and construction fell
from $297 million in 1988 to $187 million in 1998.
Under the proposal, each of the 155 national forests and grasslands would
work with the public and local officials to identify heavily used roads
that require maintenance or upgrading as well as roads that are unused or
environmentally damaging that can be decommissioned or converted to other
uses.
Previously, policies focused on road building and maintenance, and only
limited attention was paid to decommissioning roads. With the change,
priority would be given to decommissioning those roads that pose the
greatest risk of environmental damage.
Decommissioning roads involves restoring them to a more natural state by
stabilizing slopes, restoring vegetation, blocking entrances, removing
culverts or changing drainage patterns.
New roads would be added only after carefully considering the financial
implications and only if there was a "compelling need." Such needs include
public safety, critical resource restoration and private-property access.
In any given year, the local forest funds the maintenance of about 500
miles of road. John Schmechel, a Forest Service spokesman, said last year
the Stanislaus National Forest budgeted about $800,000 to maintain 505
miles of road.
During an eight-year period that ended in 1999, 28.7 miles of new road were
built on the Stanislaus -- or about 3.6 miles per year. But another 266.3
miles were reconstructed and another 28 miles were obliterated, Schmechel
said.
Schmechel said if the new policy is approved, the environmental
requirements for building a new road on the Stanislaus won't change. But
instead of the local forest chief signing off on such a project, it would
need to be approved by the regional forester, based in San Francisco.
Schmechel said the "second level of review" is needed to ensure a
compelling need for a new road exists.
Robert Stack, with the Jumping Frog Research Institute of Angels Camp, said
he wasn't familiar with the details of the Forest Service proposal but said
the agency needs a "sensible" road-management policy because it can't
afford to do everything on its limited budget.
Sean Cosgrove, the Sierra Club's national forest-policy specialist, said
the proposal is long overdue.
"It's high time to move past subsidized road construction and logging on
the national forests," he said. "The Forest Service should seize this
opportunity to get its affairs in order and protect clean water and
wildlife habitat at the same time."
The proposal was skewered by other groups, including the California
Forestry Association. Chris Nance, an association spokesman, said past
Forest Service promises to involve the local community in important
decision-making have yet to materialize, and he holds out little hope that
local input will be genuinely considered during the road system analysis.
Nance also said a "one-size-fits-all" policy isn't appropriate and added
that closing roads could hamper firefighting efforts and exacerbate the
potential for catastrophic wildfires.
Don Amador, of the Blue Ribbon Coalition, a national recreation group that
champions multiple use of public lands, said the Forest Service proposal is
merely a bid to close millions of acres now available for different uses.
================================================== =========
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6206 From: B H <boh105@e...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 2:56pm
Subject: Re: Camp site - Rock Crawling Championship
Hi Linda,
I will be coming down about 12:00 from Flagstaff be there around 3:30 after
I do some stuff, Im gonna head straight to the camp sites and set up before
the meeting at 7:00.
Brian Harmon
88 XJ
PS thanks for the map and info!
On Sun, 05 Mar 2000 15:02:42 -0700, minihummer@w... wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I drove out the the Jamboree campsitejust as the National Guard was
> leaving. They like to drive down the middle of the road and high speeds.
> It's a good thing it was raining!
>
> The Jamboree site looks great. I spent some time driving around it and
> finally decided on the far east end. The campsite is easy to find and
> can handle a large group including trailers, motor homes, etc.. It is
> far enough off the road so that dust won't be a problem. Plenty of trees
> for privacy and hanging solar showers.
>
> Here's the directions.
>
> Starting at Florence Junction (US60 and Hwy 79) go south (5.5 miles) to
> Cottonwood Canyon Rd. Cottonwood Canyon Rd is just south of milepost
> 145 on the east side of Hwy 79. The entrance to the road is marked
> with a flag pole. It is very easy to miss in the dark.
>
> Go east on Cottonwood Canyon Rd. There is a fork in the road (3 miles).
> Stay to the right. The road gets a little narrower and more washboard.
>
> There are several entrances into the Jambore site on the left side of
> the road after the fork. I think the first two are the easiest and
> probably the best choices if you are coming in with a motorhome, large
> travel trailer or car trailer. The next two have wash crossings that are
> a little too steep.
>
> After you enter the Jamboree site, head east. There isn't a road or
> anything but there is plenty of room to maneuver. We'll be camped at the
> far east end of the site.
>
> I have attached a map in PDF file format. I hope it works.
>
> I'll be camping there Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights. I am not
> sure what would be a good meeting time or place, but I would like to set
> up camp before dark. My idea is to meet at the Texaco Thursday at
> 5:00pm and head out to the campsite. Sound good? I can also hang white
> plastic markers (plastic grocery bags) on Cottonwood Canyon Rd to help
> anyone who is coming out after dark find the campsite. If you are coming
> out on Friday or Saturday, just head out to the contest and look for the
> dark blue ZJ. I don't know where the event route is but I will be at one
> of the obstacles.
>
> Ted: I don't know who is volunteering from the Lo-Rangers, but if any
> are planning on camping out this will probably be the least 'zoo-like'
> place.
>
> Linda
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> supplies, with everything you need to throw the perfect party!
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6207 From: Tom Quinn <tquinn@u...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 4:47pm
Subject: Re: Camp site - Rock Crawling Championship
What time does the actual rock crawling begin on Friday and Saturday?
> Hi Linda,
>
> I will be coming down about 12:00 from Flagstaff be there around 3:30
after
> I do some stuff, Im gonna head straight to the camp sites and set up
before
> the meeting at 7:00.
>
> Brian Harmon
> 88 XJ
>
> PS thanks for the map and info!
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, 05 Mar 2000 15:02:42 -0700, minihummer@w... wrote:
>
> > Hi All,
> >
> > I drove out the the Jamboree campsitejust as the National Guard was
> > leaving. They like to drive down the middle of the road and high
speeds.
> > It's a good thing it was raining!
> >
> > The Jamboree site looks great. I spent some time driving around it
and
> > finally decided on the far east end. The campsite is easy to find
and
> > can handle a large group including trailers, motor homes, etc.. It
is
> > far enough off the road so that dust won't be a problem. Plenty of
trees
> > for privacy and hanging solar showers.
> >
> > Here's the directions.
> >
> > Starting at Florence Junction (US60 and Hwy 79) go south (5.5
miles) to
> > Cottonwood Canyon Rd. Cottonwood Canyon Rd is just south of
milepost
> > 145 on the east side of Hwy 79. The entrance to the road is
marked
> > with a flag pole. It is very easy to miss in the dark.
> >
> > Go east on Cottonwood Canyon Rd. There is a fork in the road (3
miles).
> > Stay to the right. The road gets a little narrower and more
washboard.
> >
> > There are several entrances into the Jambore site on the left side
of
> > the road after the fork. I think the first two are the easiest and
> > probably the best choices if you are coming in with a motorhome,
large
> > travel trailer or car trailer. The next two have wash crossings
that are
> > a little too steep.
> >
> > After you enter the Jamboree site, head east. There isn't a road or
> > anything but there is plenty of room to maneuver. We'll be camped
at the
> > far east end of the site.
> >
> > I have attached a map in PDF file format. I hope it works.
> >
> > I'll be camping there Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights. I am
not
> > sure what would be a good meeting time or place, but I would like
to set
> > up camp before dark. My idea is to meet at the Texaco Thursday at
> > 5:00pm and head out to the campsite. Sound good? I can also hang
white
> > plastic markers (plastic grocery bags) on Cottonwood Canyon Rd to
help
> > anyone who is coming out after dark find the campsite. If you are
coming
> > out on Friday or Saturday, just head out to the contest and look
for the
> > dark blue ZJ. I don't know where the event route is but I will be
at one
> > of the obstacles.
> >
> > Ted: I don't know who is volunteering from the Lo-Rangers, but if
any
> > are planning on camping out this will probably be the least
'zoo-like'
> > place.
> >
> > Linda
> >
> >
6208 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 5:18pm
Subject: Re: Thanks, Jon!
Jon....outstanding job on the organization of this event!
Attached is a shot of the results from Saturday. I snapped it at about 4:30
PM, when the group I was with got back from coves 4 and 5.
For those of you who missed the weekend, you missed an opportunity to meet
some great folks, catch some rays while retrieving the trash, and a great
day of wheeling on Sunday (look Mom, no dust!)
Thanks again Jon and to all that came!
Stu Olson N7QJP
Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
http://www.qsl.net/n7qjp/
http://home.off-road.com/~stu
http://www.users.uswest.west/~solson8
Developer of VKE Digital Voice Keyer
-----Original Message-----
From: Joe West [mailto:Joe.West@future.ca]
Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 8:19 PM
To: 'DougB'; Jeep AzVJC
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Thanks, Jon!
Here Here!!!
It was kind of nice getting to feel like I contributed something to our
sport. It took a great deal of work to organize this... great job Jon! By
the way Jon... I have a gift for all your hard work the next time we get
together. <grin>
Joe
Joe F. West
98TJ Completely Stock, Not an aftermarket part on it.
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
(Okay... so I lied) <grin>
-----Original Message-----
From: DougB [mailto:azjeep@home.com]
Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 7:43 PM
To: Jeep AzVJC
Subject: [az_vjc] Thanks, Jon!
Just want to say thanks, Jon - for organizing the Coves clean up. It went
great. We had about 30 vehicles, and pulled out gobs of junk. I'm sure there
will be some photo's posted.
Doug
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Attachment: (image/jpeg) MVC-169S.JPG [not stored]
6209 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 5:31pm
Subject: Re: Crawl Ratio... How to calculate..
Joe,
Your crawl ratio is not up to standards for the Warn Rockcrawling series,
but it is not that bad either. With the 4.56 gears, you are doing the best
you will get until you:
a. pop for a Tera 4:1 lo-kit, which will put out around 75:1
b. pop for a new tranny with a granny gear of about 6:1
c. pop for a new t-case with a lower lo-range
Even option A is kind of pricey, but not as bad as B or C. I like my 4.56
gears and had a great chance this morning at the Coves to test them out
(first good chance since last month's install).
Later.......Stu
Stu Olson N7QJP
Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
http://www.qsl.net/n7qjp/
http://home.off-road.com/~stu
http://www.users.uswest.west/~solson8
Developer of VKE Digital Voice Keyer
-----Original Message-----
From: Joe West [mailto:joefwest@h...]
Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 9:16 AM
To: az_vjc@eGroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Crawl Ratio... How to calculate..
Hello Everyone,
I have a few moments on this rainy Sunday morning, and since I have never
calculated my crawl ratio, I decided to do it for the first time now. Let's
see if I can do this correctly.
(These details are for a TJ)
For 6 cylinder motors which have an AX15 Transmission, the first gear ratio
(the lowest and the only one we care about)is as follows:
3.83:1
For 4 cylinder motors which have the AX5 Transmission, the first gear ratio
is:
3.93:1
And for the Automatic, the first gear ratio is:
2.74:1
For all transfer cases (NV231), the low gear ratio is:
2.72:1
My axle ratios are 4.56:1
For any stock TJ with a Dana 44 it will be
3.73:1
For a 6 cylinder with a 35C rear axle the ratio will be
3.55:1 (I think)
For a 4 cylinder the rear axle ratio is
4.10:1 (I think)
So... after getting all this data together, I think that the crawl ratio
formula is:
(First Gear Ratio)*(Transfer Case Ratio)*(Rear Axle Ratio)=Crawl Ratio
For my TJ it would be:
(3.83)*(2.72)*(4.56)= 47.50
I really don't have any idea about what an adequate crawl ratio is... or how
much is too much, but I suspect that mine is a bit on the wimpy side...
<grin>
Just killing a few minutes. Everyone have a great weekend.
Joe West
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
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6210 From: Joe F. West <joewest2@h...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 8:14am
Subject: Calculating Crawl Ratio... Here's how I think it is done:
Hello Everyone,
I have a few moments on this rainy Sunday morning, and since I have never
calculated my crawl ratio, I decided to do it for the first time now. Let's
see if I can do this correctly.
(These details are for a TJ)
For 6 cylinder motors which have an AX15 Transmission, the first gear ratio
(the lowest and the only one we care about)is as follows:
3.83:1
For 4 cylinder motors which have the AX5 Transmission, the first gear ratio
is:
3.93:1
And for the Automatic, the first gear ratio is:
2.74:1
For all transfer cases (NV231), the low gear ratio is:
2.72:1
My axle ratios are 4.56:1
For any stock TJ with a Dana 44 it will be
3.73:1
For a 6 cylinder with a 35C rear axle the ratio will be
3.55:1 (I think)
For a 4 cylinder the rear axle ratio is
4.10:1 (I think)
So... after getting all this data together, I think that the crawl ratio
formula is:
(First Gear Ratio)*(Transfer Case Ratio)*(Rear Axle Ratio)=Crawl Ratio
For my TJ it would be:
(3.83)*(2.72)*(4.56)= 47.50
I really don't have any idea about what an adequate crawl ratio is... or how
much is too much, but I suspect that mine is a bit on the wimpy side...
<grin>
Just killing a few minutes. Everyone have a great weekend.
Joe West
http://members.home.com/joewest2/
6211 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 10:36am
Subject: Re: Bar-BQ Oxen
Al,
I am sorry to hear the bad news. I hope you are able to salvage something.
Take care and thank god you didn't get hurt...
Dave
6212 From: <AphroDsyak@a...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 2:52pm
Subject: rock crawling event.
I have a couple questions regarding this event. When does it start? How
do you get to the trails will you be able to drive??? I would assume there
would be nowhere to park. Any special passes or permits to view this event???
I am thinking of driving early and I was wondering how I would go about
seeing one of the run one of the days? could i get some suggestions and
some info on what to expect besides a ton of people. thank you ERIC
6213 From: <AphroDsyak@a...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 3:15pm
Subject: shocks. and the tj
I have a question. I saw the tera shock relocators. Does anyone know what
they run?? and what about that maco part what is it?? Same thing?? Where can
I get one? The big thing is I Reinstalled my shocks can up to prevent them
from smacking the perch. The *** end of my tj bounces horribly now??? Do
shocks not work upside down?? I am looking to go from the procomp 3000 to a
ranch 9000 but do they all have to be can down??? I don't know much about
shocks but I know some use oil. Would that cause them not to work well or at
all?? till the get seriously compressed?? Are there any shocks that you can
do this with??? I have read a lot of the install articles for the RE lift
and they say install upside down. I cant imagine them driving theirs if it
acts anything like mine does. PLEASE HELP THIS IS SOOOOOO ANNOYING>
ERIC
6214 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 8:33pm
Subject: shocks. and the tj
Not sure about the Pro Comps, but many shocks work equally well upside
down.
The Pro Comps tend to be on the stiff side, though.
As to the Tera relocators, they run about $40 and can be purchased from any
Tera dealer.
BTW, even w/ the relocators, you'll likely need for the rears to be can up.
Doug
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <AphroDsyak@a...>
> To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>
> Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 9:15 PM
> Subject: [az_vjc] shocks. and the tj
>
>
> I have a question. I saw the tera shock relocators. Does anyone know
> what
> they run?? and what about that maco part what is it?? Same thing?? Where
> can
> I get one? The big thing is I Reinstalled my shocks can up to prevent
> them
> from smacking the perch. The *** end of my tj bounces horribly now???
Do
> shocks not work upside down?? I am looking to go from the procomp 3000
> to a
> ranch 9000 but do they all have to be can down??? I don't know much
> about
> shocks but I know some use oil. Would that cause them not to work well
or
> at
> all?? till the get seriously compressed?? Are there any shocks that you
> can
> do this with??? I have read a lot of the install articles for the RE
lift
> and they say install upside down. I cant imagine them driving theirs if
> it
> acts anything like mine does. PLEASE HELP THIS IS SOOOOOO ANNOYING>
>
> ERIC
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com:
> http://click.egroups.com/1/2130/4/_/1966/_/952316179/
>
> -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> -- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/az_vjc/?m=1
>
>
>
6215 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 8:51pm
Subject: Re: shocks. and the tj
The Tera shock brackets are not yet available. They are still printing up
instructions and should be ready some time in the next week.
----- Original Message -----
From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
To: Jeep AzVJC <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 9:33 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] shocks. and the tj
> Not sure about the Pro Comps, but many shocks work equally well upside
> down.
> The Pro Comps tend to be on the stiff side, though.
>
> As to the Tera relocators, they run about $40 and can be purchased from
any
> Tera dealer.
>
> BTW, even w/ the relocators, you'll likely need for the rears to be can
up.
>
> Doug
>
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <AphroDsyak@a...>
> > To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 9:15 PM
> > Subject: [az_vjc] shocks. and the tj
> >
> >
> > I have a question. I saw the tera shock relocators. Does anyone know
> > what
> > they run?? and what about that maco part what is it?? Same thing??
Where
> > can
> > I get one? The big thing is I Reinstalled my shocks can up to prevent
> > them
> > from smacking the perch. The *** end of my tj bounces horribly now???
> Do
> > shocks not work upside down?? I am looking to go from the procomp 3000
> > to a
> > ranch 9000 but do they all have to be can down??? I don't know much
> > about
> > shocks but I know some use oil. Would that cause them not to work well
> or
> > at
> > all?? till the get seriously compressed?? Are there any shocks that
you
> > can
> > do this with??? I have read a lot of the install articles for the RE
> lift
> > and they say install upside down. I cant imagine them driving theirs
if
> > it
> > acts anything like mine does. PLEASE HELP THIS IS SOOOOOO ANNOYING>
> >
> > ERIC
> >
>
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> >
> > -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> > -- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/az_vjc/?m=1
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> you can save up to $550 a year if you own a car, and thousands
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6216 From: Jeff Chapman <jkchapman@u...>
Date: Sun Mar 5, 2000 8:57pm
Subject: Opinion/Wheels
Hey everyone.I'm gonna be gettin' my wheels & tires this week,:D
Been looking real serious at the centerline "Hellcats",but some say
they are hard to keep clean.Anyone running these?Your opinion is greatly
appreciated! 99TJ