blooddrive
01-02-2004, 07:15 PM
5966-5990 of 96466 | Previous | Next [ First | Last ] Msg # Date | Thread
5966 From: Leonard K. Pennock <leonardpennock@h...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 7:28pm
Subject: Re: No Subject
It is really pretty easy. The only really hard part is getting to the
rear bolt on the exhaust manifold.
Make sure you get the reseal kit for the quick disconnects on the fuel
line so you can just disconnect the kit and then replace the o-rings
when you put it back together.
linda luik wrote:
>
> Do you have any handy hints?
>
> I have needed a new one for a few months and am still debating whether I
> want to do it myself or just take it to a shop.
>
> Linda
>
> Lon wrote:
>
> > Myself, I would spend the extra for the Borla. Piece of cake
> > installation, takes about 3 hrs with hand tools. Lon
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: .
> > To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> > Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2000 7:35 PM
> > Subject: [az_vjc] No Subject
> >
> >
>
> I have a 97 tj unfortunately with the common problem of broken exhaust
> manifold I just checked with the dealer unfortunately that is not covered
> under emissions warranty since I have 50,000 miles on it I saw an add for
> pacesetter headers in a magazine for the 4.0 the header is only $190 was
> wondering if anybody heard anything about pacesetter the prices are very
> low makes me wonder about the quality.
>
> > -------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
> > www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
> >
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
> > www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Shop the web for great deals. Save on Computers,
> electronics, Home furnishings and more.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/1559/4/_/1966/_/951448555/
>
> eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/
> http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
--
Leonard K. Pennock
Those who walk bravely through life, unafraid of loss or failure,
find that they very rarely lose or fail.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ADVERTISEMENT
5967 From: Jay Eller <four_by_nut@n...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 7:25pm
Subject: Re: decisions, decisions....
No question about it. KEEP THE CHEROKEE!!!! Going to a 4 cylinder from the 6 is
a step backwards!!!! Take the Cherokee, purchase an RE lift and stuff 33's under
it, lock both ends, and go have some fun on the trails. Believe me, you will be
soooooo sorry you ever went to a 4 cylinder, Wrangler or not!! IMHO
--
Jay-Bird (www.goodnet.com/~eller)
'83 CJ7
__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
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5968 From: Jay Eller <four_by_nut@n...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 7:32pm
Subject: Re: THANX FOR THE HELP
> I do have another question or two.....what is this I keep reading about
> "off sets" for wheels????....I plan on putting 33"x12.5 tires after the
> lift....is this off set thing something I should be concerned
> about???....ALSO....Bernie mentioned something about a drop pitman arm
> for my lift...is this also something I need (the Money Pit loves my
> money)???....thanx in advance for the additional help....
You won't have any need to run an offset wheel with 33X12.50's. Go with the
stock offset. You may get a little rubbing at full lock between the tire
and the spring, but it won't hurt a thing. I run 33X14" Boggers on 10"
wheels and don't have any problems. Do yourself a favor and stay away from
wheel offsets/spacers and all of the other problems such as quick bearing
failure and increased load on steering components. With reguards to your
drop pitman arm, check the center to center distance when compared to your
stock one. I would put money on the dropped pitman arm being about an inch
shorter than your stocker which would greatly hurt your turning abilities.
I stuck with the stock pitman arm and was able to keep the excellent turning
radius given by a Dana30 (which I think yours has????). It might effect
your alignment, but an alignment shop should be able to fix that.
--
Jay-Bird (www.goodnet.com/~eller)
'83 CJ7
__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
5969 From: linda luik <minihummer@w...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 7:55pm
Subject: Re: No Subject
Thanks for advice. There's plenty of room on the exhaust side in a ZJ once you take
out the airbox. My problem right now is that I don't have a second vehicle if
additional parts are needed. It is just more of a hassle than anything else.
Linda
5970 From: r larson <rlarson730@a...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 7:59pm
Subject: TJ Wheel Backspacing
I going to switch tire and wheels on my TJ, currently using 15x10 on
33's, with 4 1/2" backspacing. Considering 15x8 with 3 1/2" backspacing
on 35's with 6" lift. Has anyone setup this combo, if so would
appreciate your comments.
Thanks
5971 From: Leonard K. Pennock <leonardpennock@h...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 8:20pm
Subject: Re: No Subject
Didn't say to take the fuel rails off. Just disconnecting the feed and
return so you can set the manifold out of the way. I was talking about
the quick disconnects on the feed and return lines to the rail.
"." wrote:
>
> I didn;t know you had to take the fuel rails off thought they could be worked around?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leonard K. Pennock [SMTP:leonardpennock@h...]
> Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2000 7:28 PM
> To: minihummer@w...
> Cc: az_vjc@egroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Re: No Subject
>
> It is really pretty easy. The only really hard part is getting to the
> rear bolt on the exhaust manifold.
>
> Make sure you get the reseal kit for the quick disconnects on the fuel
> line so you can just disconnect the kit and then replace the o-rings
> when you put it back together.
>
> linda luik wrote:
> >
> > Do you have any handy hints?
> >
> > I have needed a new one for a few months and am still debating whether I
> > want to do it myself or just take it to a shop.
> >
> > Linda
> >
> > Lon wrote:
> >
> > > Myself, I would spend the extra for the Borla. Piece of cake
> > > installation, takes about 3 hrs with hand tools. Lon
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: .
> > > To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> > > Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2000 7:35 PM
> > > Subject: [az_vjc] No Subject
> > >
> > >
> >
> > I have a 97 tj unfortunately with the common problem of broken exhaust
> > manifold I just checked with the dealer unfortunately that is not covered
> > under emissions warranty since I have 50,000 miles on it I saw an add for
> > pacesetter headers in a magazine for the 4.0 the header is only $190 was
> > wondering if anybody heard anything about pacesetter the prices are very
> > low makes me wonder about the quality.
> >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
> > > www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
> > >
> > > -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
> > > www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Shop the web for great deals. Save on Computers,
> > electronics, Home furnishings and more.
> > http://click.egroups.com/1/1559/4/_/1966/_/951448555/
> >
> > eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/
> > http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>
> --
> Leonard K. Pennock
>
> Those who walk bravely through life, unafraid of loss or failure,
> find that they very rarely lose or fail.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> FREE ADVICE FROM REAL PEOPLE! Xpertsite has thousands of experts who
> are willing to answer your questions for FREE. Go to Xpertsite today and
> put your mind to rest.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/1404/4/_/1966/_/951449324/
>
> -- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar!
> -- http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=az_vjc&m=1
--
Leonard K. Pennock
Those who walk bravely through life, unafraid of loss or failure,
find that they very rarely lose or fail.
5972 From: joey <monosyllabicguy@w...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 9:01pm
Subject: Re: THANX FOR THE HELP
Jay, if youre talking about your 83 CJ, i think that year
had widetrack axles(correct me if im wrong)which are about
4 inches wider than the pre 76 CJ you were discussing. so
he may have problems. i have a 78 and i rubbed with 33s
and i figured "it cant hurt". years later im replacing the
knuckle cuz the tie rod end reamed the tapered hole for
it. im figuring that when the tire hit the springs, it put
strain and pulled on the tie rod end which caused this. so
after i replaced the knuckle, i just adjusted the steering
stops. now it doesnt hit the springs, even with 35s that i
have on now. but ive lost the turning radius that i had.
ive been thinking about getting a one to a one and a half
offset so i can open my steering back up. anyways hope
this helps someone.
Joey
jay eller <four_by_nu-@n...> wrote:
original
article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=5968
> > I do have another question or two.....what is this I
keep reading about
> > "off sets" for wheels????....I plan on putting
33"x12.5 tires after the
> > lift....is this off set thing something I should be
concerned
> > about???....ALSO....Bernie mentioned something about a
drop pitman arm
> > for my lift...is this also something I need (the Money
Pit loves my
> > money)???....thanx in advance for the additional
help....
>
> You won't have any need to run an offset wheel with
33X12.50's. Go with the
> stock offset. You may get a little rubbing at full lock
between the tire
> and the spring, but it won't hurt a thing. I run 33X14"
Boggers on 10"
> wheels and don't have any problems. Do yourself a favor
and stay away from
> wheel offsets/spacers and all of the other problems such
as quick bearing
> failure and increased load on steering components. With
reguards to your
> drop pitman arm, check the center to center distance
when compared to your
> stock one. I would put money on the dropped pitman arm
being about an inch
> shorter than your stocker which would greatly hurt your
turning abilities.
> I stuck with the stock pitman arm and was able to keep
the excellent turning
> radius given by a Dana30 (which I think yours has????).
It might effect
> your alignment, but an alignment shop should be able to
fix that.
> --
> Jay-Bird (www.goodnet.com/~eller)
> '83 CJ7
>
>
> __________________________________________
> NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
> Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
> http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
5973 From: Jeff Meade <jeffm@d...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 9:16pm
Subject: Dana 20 tcase disassembly question
I'm trying to disassemble my Dana 20 transfer case and I've run into a
snag. I've nearly completed disassembly but I can't remove the front
shaft front bearing retainer because the shift rods won't slide free of
the bearing retainer. The manuals I have (Chiltons and Haynes) say to
rotate the rear shift rod counterclockwise 1/4" and slide the rod from
the housing. Problem is, the shift rod doesn't want to rotate at all,
and I'm afraid I'm going to break the case if I use any more force (I
did remove the set screw holding the shift fork onto the shift rod). I
gather that the front shift rod is supposed to stay in the case when
the bearing retainer comes off.
Is there some 'secret sauce' trick to removing these shiftrods from the
front bearing retainer? It shouldn't be this hard ...
TIA,
Jeff (jeffm @ desertwave.com)
5974 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 9:57pm
Subject: Re: broken arrow sat
The head count so far....
Myself, Erin, Tom Le, Eric & friends plus two other Jeepers from
JeepsUnlimited's bbs (Steve & John both in Cherokees).
5975 From: Len Sullivan <kermit@c...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 4:32am
Subject: camping during Coves clean up
Hi all
Is anybody else planning on camping out at the Coves during the cleanup
weekend? My family and one other family will be there.........just
wondering about how many to fix dinner for :-)
Len
5976 From: James A Langdon <yucca-man@j...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 3:19pm
Subject: Re: Run Mon. 2/28
We use a basic 5 system here as well. More info (barely can be found
through the Tech links from http://azvjc.web.com, or go directly to the
ratings at http://www.inficad.com/~jimlangdon/tech/ratings.htm
Hope that helps!
Jim Yucca-man@j...
Dirty 1/2 dozen - Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
http://azvjc.web.com
89 Cherokee (Resurrected?) 73 CJ5 (RIP)
When they took the Fourth Amendment, I was quiet because I didn't deal
drugs.
When they took the Fifth Amendment, I was quiet because I was innocent.
When they took the Second Amendment, I was quiet because I didn't own a
gun.
Now they've taken the First Amendment and I can't say anything.
On Thu, 24 Feb 2000 12:30:53 -0700 "Stu Olson" <solson8@u...>
writes:
> I need to calibrate myself. I use the Moab trail rating system where
> a 5
> stops any and every vehicle from going on.
>
> What rating system is used here by the VJC? (ie., the range of the
> scale)
>
> Stu
__________________________________________________ ______________
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5977 From: <CoyotEddie@a...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 8:40pm
Subject: Re: THANX FOR THE HELP
Just some advice on the drop pitman arm. When I had my 4" lift put on my 79
CJ5 they talked me into a drop pitman arm $60 the problem is all the droped
arms are 1-1/2" shorter than the stock ones. Cause and Effect lesson; you
lose significant turning radious. So I put a stock unit back on and modified
the drag link aranggment
<A HREF="http://res3.geocities.com/~atheena/Maidens/Totems/coyote.html">The
Coyote</A>
5978 From: Jon Loveless <jal@c...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 4:01am
Subject: Coves sponsor
Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few in
the group. Here is my proposal:
1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility to
keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves. Nothing
imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even if
they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am confident
that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
coves looking decent.
3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster there.
We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
(now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing, it
is just a joke)
4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe we
could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean, have
some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true effort
to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there - this
would just get others in the group to join in.
I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and I
don't want it closed.
Jon
=================
Jon Loveless
Convenient P&C Group
(610) 521-6066
=================
5979 From: Dave Reinken <daver@c...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 5:02am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
This sounds like a great idea for the club.
Thank you very much for taking the initiative and making this happen
Jon.
Jon Loveless wrote:
>
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves. Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing, it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean, have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there - this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
> =================
> Jon Loveless
> Convenient P&C Group
> (610) 521-6066
> =================
5980 From: Art Malone <art@a...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 6:23am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
hmm, what about plastering the cans with some AZ_VJC stickers, or is anyone
artistic enough to paint a larger version?
-----------------------------
Art Malone
AM CADD Services, Inc
5981 From: Dale M. Schuler <dsoutwest@e...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 6:44am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Sounds good to me, Jon.
Dale
On Fri, 25 Feb 2000 07:01:15 -0500, Jon Loveless wrote:
>
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few
in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility
to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves.
Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even
if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am
confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster
there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing,
it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe
we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean,
have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true
effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there -
this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and
I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
> =================
> Jon Loveless
> Convenient P&C Group
> (610) 521-6066
> =================
>
>
> << File Attachment Removed: "text/html" >>
Dale M Schuler
2000 Green TJ (Stock)
__________________________________________________ _____
Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite
Visit http://freeworld.excite.com
5982 From: Jay Eller <four_by_nut@n...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 6:44am
Subject: Re: THANX FOR THE HELP
Yes, mine is the wide track. But isn't the frame and therefore the springs
closer in on his narrow track CJ5? I once had a '74 CJ5 with 33X12.50's and
stock backspacing. I never rubbed a tire on the springs under full lock. I
assumed that was because the springs were further in due to the narrow
track, but I could be wrong (which is often the case).
--
-Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
----------------------------------------------------------
83 CJ7
Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
(Not to be confused with how it looks...)
joey wrote:
> Jay, if youre talking about your 83 CJ, i think that year
> had widetrack axles(correct me if im wrong)which are about
> 4 inches wider than the pre 76 CJ you were discussing. so
> he may have problems. i have a 78 and i rubbed with 33s
> and i figured "it cant hurt". years later im replacing the
> knuckle cuz the tie rod end reamed the tapered hole for
> it. im figuring that when the tire hit the springs, it put
> strain and pulled on the tie rod end which caused this. so
> after i replaced the knuckle, i just adjusted the steering
> stops. now it doesnt hit the springs, even with 35s that i
> have on now. but ive lost the turning radius that i had.
> ive been thinking about getting a one to a one and a half
> offset so i can open my steering back up. anyways hope
> this helps someone.
>
> Joey
5983 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 6:59am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Sounds like a fine idea...but my suggestion would be to not put out any
trash containers. My reasons are that they'd be full after 1 weekend; and
more importantly, would give people the idea that it's ok not to pack out
what you pack in. Boaters and offroaders need to be educated (if possible)
to pack out their junk - and not leave it behind for others to clean up for
them. People that might otherwise remove there stuff will leave it behind in
a pile by the overflowing can...thinking it's ok...someone will take care of
it.
Perhaps signs about packing your junk out would be more helpful.
Just some thoughts.
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: Jon Loveless <jal@c...>
To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Friday, February 25, 2000 5:01 AM
Subject: [az_vjc] Coves sponsor
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few
in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves.
Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even
if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster
there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing,
it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean,
have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true
effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there - this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and
I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
> =================
> Jon Loveless
> Convenient P&C Group
> (610) 521-6066
> =================
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Learn more with SmartPlanet. It's a new way of learning online.
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5984 From: Nnote <nnote@n...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:04am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Ya'll know that putting trash barrels out at the coves will just result in
bullet holed trash barrels. Or pontooned trash barrels. Or no where to be
found barrels. Basicly, Trashed barrels. No, I don't have an answer...
Nick
5985 From: Nnote <nnote@n...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 6:59am
Subject: Re: Photos of Red Creek 2-00
Oh ya, good point about the boulders keeping out the rif raf. I wonder how
much more trashed the coves became after the front moguls were removed...
I'm thinking of taking my shovel out this weekend to a few trails and making
some rif raf filters....
Nick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stu Olson" <solson8@u...>
To: <DavidHouk@w...>; <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2000 2:03 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Photos of Red Creek 2-00
> David,
>
> Your photo album makes a very strong statement about the condition of Red
> Creek. Impact, impact, where the hell is the impact on this fragile
> ecosystem?
>
> Everyone needs to look at this and see the tremendous lack of green grass
> that the crazed AZ range cattle are gobbling up at a tremendous rate! (oh
> yeah, don't forget the ba-zillion hoof marks that are widening the creek
> channel!)
>
> One should also note that the fish are all gone (of course, I can't
imagine
> too many fish that would like to live in a 2" deep creek when they have
the
> entire Verde River to play in.
>
> Did you notice the nasty ruts the off-roaders have carved into the
airstrip?
>
> All the fun aside, I believe that the reason Red Creek looks as good as it
> does is because of that first group of boulders about a 1/4 mile down Red
> Creek. The non-serious 4x4 SUV owners probably turn around and go back
> home, and with them their trash, graffiti, beer cans, car parts, etc. In
my
> general observations of off-roaders that have a vehicle that can easily do
> Red Creek with out thinking twice about it, these folks are NOT the ones
> that are giving us a bad name! Hence, Red Creek has a trail down it that
> looks like it has very little traffic compared to so many other easily
> accessible places.
>
> Thanks for letting me rant and rave!
>
>
> Stu
>
>
> Stu Olson N7QJP
> Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
> http://www.users.uswest.net/~solson8
> http://home.off-road.com/~stu
>
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: DavidHouk@w... [mailto:DavidHouk@w...]
> >Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2000 13:12
> >To: solson8@u...; az_vjc@egroups.com
> >Subject: Photos of Red Creek 2-00
> >
> >
> >Greetings!
> >
> >David Houk has an album of photos for you to
> >see using the FREE PhotoPoint photo sharing service.
> >
> >Here is a message describing the photos:
> >---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >These pictures of Red Creek Trail were taken less than 2 weeks
> >ago. Please send your letter today to help keep the trail open for
> >vehicles. Thank you
> >
> >Send letters to:
> >
> >Delvin Lopez
> >District Ranger
> >Tonto National Forest Cave
> >Creek Ranger District
> >40202 N. Cave Creek Rd.
> >Scottsdale, AZ. 85262
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Simply click on the link below to go directly to their photo album
> >area on the PhotoPoint web site, where you can see all the photos
> >that they have prepared for you.
> >
> >Photo Album:
> > http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=27047&pw=god&a=1884049
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
5986 From: Linda Luik <p14175@e...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:07am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Sounds like a great idea. Can the Mesa District Ranger's Office provide
information about other groups that have cleanups in the coves? I know that
there is a boy scout troop and a scuba diving club that also do cleanups out
there. Are there any boating clubs that perform cleanups? Can the coves
cleanup be included in the annual Salt River Recreation Area cleanup? It
would be great to work out a schedule with groups like these so that the coves
can get cleaned up more than four times a year.
Linda
Jon Loveless wrote:
>
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves. Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing, it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean, have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there - this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
Attachment: vcard [not shown]
5987 From: Tom Quinn <tquinn@u...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:10am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Excellent! I'll have to agree with DougB on the trash containers
though. It sounds like a great idea, but may result in more trash
being left there. Perhaps an accessible dumpster right next to the
green gate would be most helpful.
Is this sort of thing something that could/should be sponsored by
ASA4WDC? And get all the other member clubs involved? The more
exposure this type of effort gets the better I'd think.
Great effort, Jon! Hopefully the public will see that we're not all
bad.
I'm hoping to be there March 4 and/or 5th. I have to get my sister to
the airport in the AM but hope to be out afterwards. I've passed on
the word to some co-workers with quads and they said they'll come help
out too.
Tom
jon loveless <ja-@c...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=5978
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the
Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a
few in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the
responsibility to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers
(50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves.
Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash.
Even if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control
that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am
confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep
the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they
simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster
there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords
;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better'
thing, it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking
some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading
a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway
and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I
believe we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it
clean, have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true
effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there -
this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by
and I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
> =================
> Jon Loveless
> Convenient P&C Group
> (610) 521-6066
> =================
>
5988 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:37am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
One additional thought - try to hook up a joint effort w/ the boating
community. Boater's actually are responsible for a good portion of the junk
at the coves themselves. This may be difficult, since I doubt there's much
in the way of a boating club out there, but I know that there was an
organized clean up of the coves that boaters have done in the past. Perhaps
the Ranger has info on who to contact.
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: Jon Loveless <jal@c...>
To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Friday, February 25, 2000 5:01 AM
Subject: [az_vjc] Coves sponsor
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few
in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves.
Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even
if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster
there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing,
it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean,
have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true
effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there - this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and
I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
> =================
> Jon Loveless
> Convenient P&C Group
> (610) 521-6066
> =================
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Learn more with SmartPlanet. It's a new way of learning online.
> SmartPlanet offers hundreds of courses to take on your time,
> in your space. Join for FREE today!
> http://click.egroups.com/1/1700/4/_/1966/_/951480079/
>
> -- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar!
> -- http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
5989 From: Linda Luik <p14175@e...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:36am
Subject: Exploratory Trip on Sunday 02/27
Hi all,
I am thinking about another exploratory trip. This time, I want to see if I
can find the trail my boyfriend and I did about 5 years ago on the north side
of US60, north of the Boyce Thompson Arboretum. I have been thinking that this
one would be a great family trail for the Jamboree (rating somewhere between
2.0-3.0). It's been a while, but I recall the trail had some short and long
steep hills, light rock crawling, off camber, and a side trail that goes up
either a really big hill or a small mountain. I think this is a marked trail
in the Tonto National Forest, but not sure. I know it comes close to Bear Canyon.
It's been a long time since I have been out that way, but it sounds like a
nice way to spend Sunday.
Let me know if anyone is interested. Other wise, let's meet at the Texaco on
US60 east of Florence Junction at 8:30am, CB Channel 4.
Linda
Attachment: vcard [not shown]
5990 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:51am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Jon, your plan sounds very reasonable and should be workable with the
resources/membership of the club.
As I've never been to the Coves, what is the logistics involved with getting
the trash from the furthest coves (I thinks #4 and #5) out to where the
dumpster is? I ask this because if there is a 55 gallon drum at each area,
and it is full, would one want to empty the drum contents into multiple
trash bags and take the bags to the dumpster, or would one need to take the
drum, empty it, and return it to the cove? Granted, someone with a open bed
pickup could haul a 55 gal drum in the bed, but I certainly could not put it
in my hardtop TJ.
Just wondering...
Stu
Stu Olson N7QJP
Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
http://www.users.uswest.net/~solson8
http://home.off-road.com/~stu
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Dale M. Schuler [mailto:dsoutwest@e...]
>Sent: Friday, February 25, 2000 07:45
>To: Jon Loveless; az_vjc@egroups.com
>Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Coves sponsor
>
>
>
>Sounds good to me, Jon.
>
>Dale
>
>
>On Fri, 25 Feb 2000 07:01:15 -0500, Jon Loveless wrote:
>
>>
>> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of
>the Coves.
>> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few
>in
>> the group. Here is my proposal:
>> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility
>to
>> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
>> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash
>containers (50
>> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves.
>Nothing
>> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even
>if
>> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to
>control that) it
>
>> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am
>confident
>> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier
>to keep the
>
>> coves looking decent.
>> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
>> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster
>there.
>> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and
>fords ;-)
>> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing,
>it
>> is just a joke)
>> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
>> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include
>picking some
>
>> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
>> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
>> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
>> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>>
>> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
>> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe
>we
>> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean,
>have
>> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true
>effort
>> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there -
>this
>> would just get others in the group to join in.
>>
>> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
>> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
>> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so
>close by and
>I
>> don't want it closed.
>>
>> Jon
>> =================
>> Jon Loveless
>> Convenient P&C Group
>> (610) 521-6066
>> =================
>>
>>
>> << File Attachment Removed: "text/html" >>
>
>
>Dale M Schuler
>2000 Green TJ (Stock)
>
>
>
>
>
>__________________________________________________ _____
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>
5966 From: Leonard K. Pennock <leonardpennock@h...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 7:28pm
Subject: Re: No Subject
It is really pretty easy. The only really hard part is getting to the
rear bolt on the exhaust manifold.
Make sure you get the reseal kit for the quick disconnects on the fuel
line so you can just disconnect the kit and then replace the o-rings
when you put it back together.
linda luik wrote:
>
> Do you have any handy hints?
>
> I have needed a new one for a few months and am still debating whether I
> want to do it myself or just take it to a shop.
>
> Linda
>
> Lon wrote:
>
> > Myself, I would spend the extra for the Borla. Piece of cake
> > installation, takes about 3 hrs with hand tools. Lon
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: .
> > To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> > Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2000 7:35 PM
> > Subject: [az_vjc] No Subject
> >
> >
>
> I have a 97 tj unfortunately with the common problem of broken exhaust
> manifold I just checked with the dealer unfortunately that is not covered
> under emissions warranty since I have 50,000 miles on it I saw an add for
> pacesetter headers in a magazine for the 4.0 the header is only $190 was
> wondering if anybody heard anything about pacesetter the prices are very
> low makes me wonder about the quality.
>
> > -------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
> > www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
> >
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
> > www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Shop the web for great deals. Save on Computers,
> electronics, Home furnishings and more.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/1559/4/_/1966/_/951448555/
>
> eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/
> http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
--
Leonard K. Pennock
Those who walk bravely through life, unafraid of loss or failure,
find that they very rarely lose or fail.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ADVERTISEMENT
5967 From: Jay Eller <four_by_nut@n...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 7:25pm
Subject: Re: decisions, decisions....
No question about it. KEEP THE CHEROKEE!!!! Going to a 4 cylinder from the 6 is
a step backwards!!!! Take the Cherokee, purchase an RE lift and stuff 33's under
it, lock both ends, and go have some fun on the trails. Believe me, you will be
soooooo sorry you ever went to a 4 cylinder, Wrangler or not!! IMHO
--
Jay-Bird (www.goodnet.com/~eller)
'83 CJ7
__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
5968 From: Jay Eller <four_by_nut@n...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 7:32pm
Subject: Re: THANX FOR THE HELP
> I do have another question or two.....what is this I keep reading about
> "off sets" for wheels????....I plan on putting 33"x12.5 tires after the
> lift....is this off set thing something I should be concerned
> about???....ALSO....Bernie mentioned something about a drop pitman arm
> for my lift...is this also something I need (the Money Pit loves my
> money)???....thanx in advance for the additional help....
You won't have any need to run an offset wheel with 33X12.50's. Go with the
stock offset. You may get a little rubbing at full lock between the tire
and the spring, but it won't hurt a thing. I run 33X14" Boggers on 10"
wheels and don't have any problems. Do yourself a favor and stay away from
wheel offsets/spacers and all of the other problems such as quick bearing
failure and increased load on steering components. With reguards to your
drop pitman arm, check the center to center distance when compared to your
stock one. I would put money on the dropped pitman arm being about an inch
shorter than your stocker which would greatly hurt your turning abilities.
I stuck with the stock pitman arm and was able to keep the excellent turning
radius given by a Dana30 (which I think yours has????). It might effect
your alignment, but an alignment shop should be able to fix that.
--
Jay-Bird (www.goodnet.com/~eller)
'83 CJ7
__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
5969 From: linda luik <minihummer@w...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 7:55pm
Subject: Re: No Subject
Thanks for advice. There's plenty of room on the exhaust side in a ZJ once you take
out the airbox. My problem right now is that I don't have a second vehicle if
additional parts are needed. It is just more of a hassle than anything else.
Linda
5970 From: r larson <rlarson730@a...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 7:59pm
Subject: TJ Wheel Backspacing
I going to switch tire and wheels on my TJ, currently using 15x10 on
33's, with 4 1/2" backspacing. Considering 15x8 with 3 1/2" backspacing
on 35's with 6" lift. Has anyone setup this combo, if so would
appreciate your comments.
Thanks
5971 From: Leonard K. Pennock <leonardpennock@h...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 8:20pm
Subject: Re: No Subject
Didn't say to take the fuel rails off. Just disconnecting the feed and
return so you can set the manifold out of the way. I was talking about
the quick disconnects on the feed and return lines to the rail.
"." wrote:
>
> I didn;t know you had to take the fuel rails off thought they could be worked around?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leonard K. Pennock [SMTP:leonardpennock@h...]
> Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2000 7:28 PM
> To: minihummer@w...
> Cc: az_vjc@egroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Re: No Subject
>
> It is really pretty easy. The only really hard part is getting to the
> rear bolt on the exhaust manifold.
>
> Make sure you get the reseal kit for the quick disconnects on the fuel
> line so you can just disconnect the kit and then replace the o-rings
> when you put it back together.
>
> linda luik wrote:
> >
> > Do you have any handy hints?
> >
> > I have needed a new one for a few months and am still debating whether I
> > want to do it myself or just take it to a shop.
> >
> > Linda
> >
> > Lon wrote:
> >
> > > Myself, I would spend the extra for the Borla. Piece of cake
> > > installation, takes about 3 hrs with hand tools. Lon
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: .
> > > To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> > > Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2000 7:35 PM
> > > Subject: [az_vjc] No Subject
> > >
> > >
> >
> > I have a 97 tj unfortunately with the common problem of broken exhaust
> > manifold I just checked with the dealer unfortunately that is not covered
> > under emissions warranty since I have 50,000 miles on it I saw an add for
> > pacesetter headers in a magazine for the 4.0 the header is only $190 was
> > wondering if anybody heard anything about pacesetter the prices are very
> > low makes me wonder about the quality.
> >
> > > -------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
> > > www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
> > >
> > > -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc
> > > www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Shop the web for great deals. Save on Computers,
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>
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> find that they very rarely lose or fail.
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--
Leonard K. Pennock
Those who walk bravely through life, unafraid of loss or failure,
find that they very rarely lose or fail.
5972 From: joey <monosyllabicguy@w...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 9:01pm
Subject: Re: THANX FOR THE HELP
Jay, if youre talking about your 83 CJ, i think that year
had widetrack axles(correct me if im wrong)which are about
4 inches wider than the pre 76 CJ you were discussing. so
he may have problems. i have a 78 and i rubbed with 33s
and i figured "it cant hurt". years later im replacing the
knuckle cuz the tie rod end reamed the tapered hole for
it. im figuring that when the tire hit the springs, it put
strain and pulled on the tie rod end which caused this. so
after i replaced the knuckle, i just adjusted the steering
stops. now it doesnt hit the springs, even with 35s that i
have on now. but ive lost the turning radius that i had.
ive been thinking about getting a one to a one and a half
offset so i can open my steering back up. anyways hope
this helps someone.
Joey
jay eller <four_by_nu-@n...> wrote:
original
article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=5968
> > I do have another question or two.....what is this I
keep reading about
> > "off sets" for wheels????....I plan on putting
33"x12.5 tires after the
> > lift....is this off set thing something I should be
concerned
> > about???....ALSO....Bernie mentioned something about a
drop pitman arm
> > for my lift...is this also something I need (the Money
Pit loves my
> > money)???....thanx in advance for the additional
help....
>
> You won't have any need to run an offset wheel with
33X12.50's. Go with the
> stock offset. You may get a little rubbing at full lock
between the tire
> and the spring, but it won't hurt a thing. I run 33X14"
Boggers on 10"
> wheels and don't have any problems. Do yourself a favor
and stay away from
> wheel offsets/spacers and all of the other problems such
as quick bearing
> failure and increased load on steering components. With
reguards to your
> drop pitman arm, check the center to center distance
when compared to your
> stock one. I would put money on the dropped pitman arm
being about an inch
> shorter than your stocker which would greatly hurt your
turning abilities.
> I stuck with the stock pitman arm and was able to keep
the excellent turning
> radius given by a Dana30 (which I think yours has????).
It might effect
> your alignment, but an alignment shop should be able to
fix that.
> --
> Jay-Bird (www.goodnet.com/~eller)
> '83 CJ7
>
>
> __________________________________________
> NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
> Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
> http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
5973 From: Jeff Meade <jeffm@d...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 9:16pm
Subject: Dana 20 tcase disassembly question
I'm trying to disassemble my Dana 20 transfer case and I've run into a
snag. I've nearly completed disassembly but I can't remove the front
shaft front bearing retainer because the shift rods won't slide free of
the bearing retainer. The manuals I have (Chiltons and Haynes) say to
rotate the rear shift rod counterclockwise 1/4" and slide the rod from
the housing. Problem is, the shift rod doesn't want to rotate at all,
and I'm afraid I'm going to break the case if I use any more force (I
did remove the set screw holding the shift fork onto the shift rod). I
gather that the front shift rod is supposed to stay in the case when
the bearing retainer comes off.
Is there some 'secret sauce' trick to removing these shiftrods from the
front bearing retainer? It shouldn't be this hard ...
TIA,
Jeff (jeffm @ desertwave.com)
5974 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 9:57pm
Subject: Re: broken arrow sat
The head count so far....
Myself, Erin, Tom Le, Eric & friends plus two other Jeepers from
JeepsUnlimited's bbs (Steve & John both in Cherokees).
5975 From: Len Sullivan <kermit@c...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 4:32am
Subject: camping during Coves clean up
Hi all
Is anybody else planning on camping out at the Coves during the cleanup
weekend? My family and one other family will be there.........just
wondering about how many to fix dinner for :-)
Len
5976 From: James A Langdon <yucca-man@j...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 3:19pm
Subject: Re: Run Mon. 2/28
We use a basic 5 system here as well. More info (barely can be found
through the Tech links from http://azvjc.web.com, or go directly to the
ratings at http://www.inficad.com/~jimlangdon/tech/ratings.htm
Hope that helps!
Jim Yucca-man@j...
Dirty 1/2 dozen - Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
http://azvjc.web.com
89 Cherokee (Resurrected?) 73 CJ5 (RIP)
When they took the Fourth Amendment, I was quiet because I didn't deal
drugs.
When they took the Fifth Amendment, I was quiet because I was innocent.
When they took the Second Amendment, I was quiet because I didn't own a
gun.
Now they've taken the First Amendment and I can't say anything.
On Thu, 24 Feb 2000 12:30:53 -0700 "Stu Olson" <solson8@u...>
writes:
> I need to calibrate myself. I use the Moab trail rating system where
> a 5
> stops any and every vehicle from going on.
>
> What rating system is used here by the VJC? (ie., the range of the
> scale)
>
> Stu
__________________________________________________ ______________
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5977 From: <CoyotEddie@a...>
Date: Thu Feb 24, 2000 8:40pm
Subject: Re: THANX FOR THE HELP
Just some advice on the drop pitman arm. When I had my 4" lift put on my 79
CJ5 they talked me into a drop pitman arm $60 the problem is all the droped
arms are 1-1/2" shorter than the stock ones. Cause and Effect lesson; you
lose significant turning radious. So I put a stock unit back on and modified
the drag link aranggment
<A HREF="http://res3.geocities.com/~atheena/Maidens/Totems/coyote.html">The
Coyote</A>
5978 From: Jon Loveless <jal@c...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 4:01am
Subject: Coves sponsor
Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few in
the group. Here is my proposal:
1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility to
keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves. Nothing
imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even if
they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am confident
that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
coves looking decent.
3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster there.
We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
(now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing, it
is just a joke)
4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe we
could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean, have
some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true effort
to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there - this
would just get others in the group to join in.
I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and I
don't want it closed.
Jon
=================
Jon Loveless
Convenient P&C Group
(610) 521-6066
=================
5979 From: Dave Reinken <daver@c...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 5:02am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
This sounds like a great idea for the club.
Thank you very much for taking the initiative and making this happen
Jon.
Jon Loveless wrote:
>
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves. Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing, it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean, have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there - this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
> =================
> Jon Loveless
> Convenient P&C Group
> (610) 521-6066
> =================
5980 From: Art Malone <art@a...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 6:23am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
hmm, what about plastering the cans with some AZ_VJC stickers, or is anyone
artistic enough to paint a larger version?
-----------------------------
Art Malone
AM CADD Services, Inc
5981 From: Dale M. Schuler <dsoutwest@e...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 6:44am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Sounds good to me, Jon.
Dale
On Fri, 25 Feb 2000 07:01:15 -0500, Jon Loveless wrote:
>
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few
in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility
to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves.
Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even
if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am
confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster
there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing,
it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe
we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean,
have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true
effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there -
this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and
I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
> =================
> Jon Loveless
> Convenient P&C Group
> (610) 521-6066
> =================
>
>
> << File Attachment Removed: "text/html" >>
Dale M Schuler
2000 Green TJ (Stock)
__________________________________________________ _____
Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite
Visit http://freeworld.excite.com
5982 From: Jay Eller <four_by_nut@n...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 6:44am
Subject: Re: THANX FOR THE HELP
Yes, mine is the wide track. But isn't the frame and therefore the springs
closer in on his narrow track CJ5? I once had a '74 CJ5 with 33X12.50's and
stock backspacing. I never rubbed a tire on the springs under full lock. I
assumed that was because the springs were further in due to the narrow
track, but I could be wrong (which is often the case).
--
-Jay-Bird (http://www.goodnet.com/~eller)
----------------------------------------------------------
83 CJ7
Part Chevy / Part Jeep >>>>> CHEEP!!
(Not to be confused with how it looks...)
joey wrote:
> Jay, if youre talking about your 83 CJ, i think that year
> had widetrack axles(correct me if im wrong)which are about
> 4 inches wider than the pre 76 CJ you were discussing. so
> he may have problems. i have a 78 and i rubbed with 33s
> and i figured "it cant hurt". years later im replacing the
> knuckle cuz the tie rod end reamed the tapered hole for
> it. im figuring that when the tire hit the springs, it put
> strain and pulled on the tie rod end which caused this. so
> after i replaced the knuckle, i just adjusted the steering
> stops. now it doesnt hit the springs, even with 35s that i
> have on now. but ive lost the turning radius that i had.
> ive been thinking about getting a one to a one and a half
> offset so i can open my steering back up. anyways hope
> this helps someone.
>
> Joey
5983 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 6:59am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Sounds like a fine idea...but my suggestion would be to not put out any
trash containers. My reasons are that they'd be full after 1 weekend; and
more importantly, would give people the idea that it's ok not to pack out
what you pack in. Boaters and offroaders need to be educated (if possible)
to pack out their junk - and not leave it behind for others to clean up for
them. People that might otherwise remove there stuff will leave it behind in
a pile by the overflowing can...thinking it's ok...someone will take care of
it.
Perhaps signs about packing your junk out would be more helpful.
Just some thoughts.
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: Jon Loveless <jal@c...>
To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Friday, February 25, 2000 5:01 AM
Subject: [az_vjc] Coves sponsor
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few
in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves.
Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even
if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster
there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing,
it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean,
have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true
effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there - this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and
I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
> =================
> Jon Loveless
> Convenient P&C Group
> (610) 521-6066
> =================
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Learn more with SmartPlanet. It's a new way of learning online.
> SmartPlanet offers hundreds of courses to take on your time,
> in your space. Join for FREE today!
> http://click.egroups.com/1/1700/4/_/1966/_/951480079/
>
> -- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar!
> -- http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
5984 From: Nnote <nnote@n...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:04am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Ya'll know that putting trash barrels out at the coves will just result in
bullet holed trash barrels. Or pontooned trash barrels. Or no where to be
found barrels. Basicly, Trashed barrels. No, I don't have an answer...
Nick
5985 From: Nnote <nnote@n...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 6:59am
Subject: Re: Photos of Red Creek 2-00
Oh ya, good point about the boulders keeping out the rif raf. I wonder how
much more trashed the coves became after the front moguls were removed...
I'm thinking of taking my shovel out this weekend to a few trails and making
some rif raf filters....
Nick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stu Olson" <solson8@u...>
To: <DavidHouk@w...>; <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2000 2:03 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Photos of Red Creek 2-00
> David,
>
> Your photo album makes a very strong statement about the condition of Red
> Creek. Impact, impact, where the hell is the impact on this fragile
> ecosystem?
>
> Everyone needs to look at this and see the tremendous lack of green grass
> that the crazed AZ range cattle are gobbling up at a tremendous rate! (oh
> yeah, don't forget the ba-zillion hoof marks that are widening the creek
> channel!)
>
> One should also note that the fish are all gone (of course, I can't
imagine
> too many fish that would like to live in a 2" deep creek when they have
the
> entire Verde River to play in.
>
> Did you notice the nasty ruts the off-roaders have carved into the
airstrip?
>
> All the fun aside, I believe that the reason Red Creek looks as good as it
> does is because of that first group of boulders about a 1/4 mile down Red
> Creek. The non-serious 4x4 SUV owners probably turn around and go back
> home, and with them their trash, graffiti, beer cans, car parts, etc. In
my
> general observations of off-roaders that have a vehicle that can easily do
> Red Creek with out thinking twice about it, these folks are NOT the ones
> that are giving us a bad name! Hence, Red Creek has a trail down it that
> looks like it has very little traffic compared to so many other easily
> accessible places.
>
> Thanks for letting me rant and rave!
>
>
> Stu
>
>
> Stu Olson N7QJP
> Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
> http://www.users.uswest.net/~solson8
> http://home.off-road.com/~stu
>
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: DavidHouk@w... [mailto:DavidHouk@w...]
> >Sent: Thursday, February 24, 2000 13:12
> >To: solson8@u...; az_vjc@egroups.com
> >Subject: Photos of Red Creek 2-00
> >
> >
> >Greetings!
> >
> >David Houk has an album of photos for you to
> >see using the FREE PhotoPoint photo sharing service.
> >
> >Here is a message describing the photos:
> >---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >These pictures of Red Creek Trail were taken less than 2 weeks
> >ago. Please send your letter today to help keep the trail open for
> >vehicles. Thank you
> >
> >Send letters to:
> >
> >Delvin Lopez
> >District Ranger
> >Tonto National Forest Cave
> >Creek Ranger District
> >40202 N. Cave Creek Rd.
> >Scottsdale, AZ. 85262
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Simply click on the link below to go directly to their photo album
> >area on the PhotoPoint web site, where you can see all the photos
> >that they have prepared for you.
> >
> >Photo Album:
> > http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=27047&pw=god&a=1884049
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as 0.0%
> Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW!
> http://click.egroups.com/1/911/4/_/1966/_/951426587/
>
> -- Check out your group's private Chat room
> -- http://www.egroups.com/ChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
>
5986 From: Linda Luik <p14175@e...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:07am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Sounds like a great idea. Can the Mesa District Ranger's Office provide
information about other groups that have cleanups in the coves? I know that
there is a boy scout troop and a scuba diving club that also do cleanups out
there. Are there any boating clubs that perform cleanups? Can the coves
cleanup be included in the annual Salt River Recreation Area cleanup? It
would be great to work out a schedule with groups like these so that the coves
can get cleaned up more than four times a year.
Linda
Jon Loveless wrote:
>
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves. Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing, it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean, have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there - this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
Attachment: vcard [not shown]
5987 From: Tom Quinn <tquinn@u...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:10am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Excellent! I'll have to agree with DougB on the trash containers
though. It sounds like a great idea, but may result in more trash
being left there. Perhaps an accessible dumpster right next to the
green gate would be most helpful.
Is this sort of thing something that could/should be sponsored by
ASA4WDC? And get all the other member clubs involved? The more
exposure this type of effort gets the better I'd think.
Great effort, Jon! Hopefully the public will see that we're not all
bad.
I'm hoping to be there March 4 and/or 5th. I have to get my sister to
the airport in the AM but hope to be out afterwards. I've passed on
the word to some co-workers with quads and they said they'll come help
out too.
Tom
jon loveless <ja-@c...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=5978
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the
Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a
few in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the
responsibility to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers
(50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves.
Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash.
Even if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control
that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am
confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep
the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they
simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster
there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords
;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better'
thing, it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking
some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading
a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway
and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I
believe we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it
clean, have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true
effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there -
this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by
and I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
> =================
> Jon Loveless
> Convenient P&C Group
> (610) 521-6066
> =================
>
5988 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:37am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
One additional thought - try to hook up a joint effort w/ the boating
community. Boater's actually are responsible for a good portion of the junk
at the coves themselves. This may be difficult, since I doubt there's much
in the way of a boating club out there, but I know that there was an
organized clean up of the coves that boaters have done in the past. Perhaps
the Ranger has info on who to contact.
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: Jon Loveless <jal@c...>
To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Friday, February 25, 2000 5:01 AM
Subject: [az_vjc] Coves sponsor
> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of the Coves.
> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few
in
> the group. Here is my proposal:
> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility to
> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash containers (50
> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves.
Nothing
> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even
if
> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to control that) it
> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am confident
> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier to keep the
> coves looking decent.
> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster
there.
> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and fords ;-)
> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing,
it
> is just a joke)
> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include picking some
> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>
> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe we
> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean,
have
> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true
effort
> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there - this
> would just get others in the group to join in.
>
> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so close by and
I
> don't want it closed.
>
> Jon
> =================
> Jon Loveless
> Convenient P&C Group
> (610) 521-6066
> =================
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
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> -- http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
5989 From: Linda Luik <p14175@e...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:36am
Subject: Exploratory Trip on Sunday 02/27
Hi all,
I am thinking about another exploratory trip. This time, I want to see if I
can find the trail my boyfriend and I did about 5 years ago on the north side
of US60, north of the Boyce Thompson Arboretum. I have been thinking that this
one would be a great family trail for the Jamboree (rating somewhere between
2.0-3.0). It's been a while, but I recall the trail had some short and long
steep hills, light rock crawling, off camber, and a side trail that goes up
either a really big hill or a small mountain. I think this is a marked trail
in the Tonto National Forest, but not sure. I know it comes close to Bear Canyon.
It's been a long time since I have been out that way, but it sounds like a
nice way to spend Sunday.
Let me know if anyone is interested. Other wise, let's meet at the Texaco on
US60 east of Florence Junction at 8:30am, CB Channel 4.
Linda
Attachment: vcard [not shown]
5990 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Fri Feb 25, 2000 7:51am
Subject: Re: Coves sponsor
Jon, your plan sounds very reasonable and should be workable with the
resources/membership of the club.
As I've never been to the Coves, what is the logistics involved with getting
the trash from the furthest coves (I thinks #4 and #5) out to where the
dumpster is? I ask this because if there is a 55 gallon drum at each area,
and it is full, would one want to empty the drum contents into multiple
trash bags and take the bags to the dumpster, or would one need to take the
drum, empty it, and return it to the cove? Granted, someone with a open bed
pickup could haul a 55 gal drum in the bed, but I certainly could not put it
in my hardtop TJ.
Just wondering...
Stu
Stu Olson N7QJP
Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
http://www.users.uswest.net/~solson8
http://home.off-road.com/~stu
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Dale M. Schuler [mailto:dsoutwest@e...]
>Sent: Friday, February 25, 2000 07:45
>To: Jon Loveless; az_vjc@egroups.com
>Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Coves sponsor
>
>
>
>Sounds good to me, Jon.
>
>Dale
>
>
>On Fri, 25 Feb 2000 07:01:15 -0500, Jon Loveless wrote:
>
>>
>> Terry Heslin has asked us (me) to consider being a sponsor of
>the Coves.
>> Before I talk with him I would like some guidance/concurrence from a few
>in
>> the group. Here is my proposal:
>> 1. we agree to sponsor the Coves 1-5, which includes the responsibility
>to
>> keep it clean. I am not sure yet what else is involved.
>> 2. We get the USDA - Forest Rangers to let us place trash
>containers (50
>> gallon drums that I believe I have access to) at each of the Coves.
>Nothing
>> imposing like a dumpster, but a place for coves users to put trash. Even
>if
>> they aren't used by visitors, and we wouldn't be able to
>control that) it
>
>> would be a place for us to put stuff when we are out there. I am
>confident
>> that this kind of an effort would make it a great deal easier
>to keep the
>
>> coves looking decent.
>> 3. Whenever anyone from the group goes to one of the Coves, they simply
>> haul out what they can to Butcher Jones and deposit it in a dumpster
>there.
>> We should also be on the lookout for big trash like chevys and
>fords ;-)
>> (now, don't take offense anyone - this isn't a 'Jeeps are better' thing,
>it
>> is just a joke)
>> 4. We plan at least a quarterly run to the Coves with an objective of
>> having some fun and returning with trash. That would include
>picking some
>
>> stuff up off the trails to the coves as well.
>> 5. I would be happy to take on this responsibility, including leading a
>> quarterly mini-clean run - I go out there almost that often anyway and
>> would absolutely love a good solid excuse to go.
>>
>> All this would take would be a general agreement from the group to
>> participate whenever anyone goes out there. Organized or not. I believe
>we
>> could get some press for this, have a lasting effort to keep it clean,
>have
>> some fun, and have a clean(er) place to visit and show off as a true
>effort
>> to keep the trails open. I often pickup up junk when I go out there -
>this
>> would just get others in the group to join in.
>>
>> I would appreciate comments, thoughts or ideas before I talk to Terry
>> Heslin next week. If the group doesn't want to get behind this I may
>> sponsor it myself. The Coves is/are a great place to have so
>close by and
>I
>> don't want it closed.
>>
>> Jon
>> =================
>> Jon Loveless
>> Convenient P&C Group
>> (610) 521-6066
>> =================
>>
>>
>> << File Attachment Removed: "text/html" >>
>
>
>Dale M Schuler
>2000 Green TJ (Stock)
>
>
>
>
>
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