blooddrive
01-02-2004, 07:13 PM
5891-5915 of 96466 | Previous | Next [ First | Last ] Msg # Date | Thread
5891 From: Tim Naylor <tim.naylor@w...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 8:27pm
Subject: TJ body lift question
To help satisfy my nagging upgrade additicion, I want to have a 1 inch body
lift installed on my 97 TJ. I have been told by 2 different 4 wheel shops in
Tucson, that would rather not do the work because it involves difficult
modifications to the air conditioning connections. Does anyone out there
know what has to be done the air conditioning that is so difficult?
I have a Tereflex Belly Up skid plate I want to put on my TJ. The salesman
said "easy, no brainer install" The instructions have an ominous warning
that it might cause drive line viberations, it requires 1/2 inch shims under
the motor mounts, and says that you will have to relocate some of the exaust
system or install a 1 inch body lift. Does that sound like a "no brainer"
install to you.?
I may go to 35 inch tires later so I decided I may as well do the body lift.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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5892 From: Chip Jones <twogun@c...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 8:46pm
Subject: Re: Lift Kit
I lucked out. The vibrations are minimal. I've just got the shims that came with
the kit.
Chip
BA914@a... wrote:
> Chip
>
> How did you get rid of the vibration in the driveline? I have tried a taller
> shim on the rear axle. but this did nothing. Any suggestions?
>
> Steve
5893 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 9:00pm
Subject: Re: SOA brakeline length?
I have a set of 4" lift CJ brake lines you can use for ramping purposes....
that is if you cant find any definitive answer first.
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: Ross Skinner <rskinner@s...>
To: azvjc <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 7:23 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: SOA brakeline length?
> Good questions Jeff. I am getting ready to do spring over on
> my 84 CJ. I will let you know on any brilliant findings. I
> am not going with Wrangler axles but it should be close
> otherwise.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Jeff Meade <jeffm@d...>
> To: <az_vjc@eGroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 7:09 PM
> Subject: [az_vjc] SOA brakeline length?
>
>
> > Hi VJers --
> >
> > I'm looking for approximate front brake line length for a
> CJ SOA setup.
> > I could guess, but if someone has widetrack axles with
> Wrangler
> > springs, a ballpark measurement would be appreciated.
> Without
> > brakes/dshafts, my CJ is in no position to run up a ramp
> to get a good
> > measurement. Also, I could use any recommendations on a
> place to find
> > decent prices.
> >
> > Another question ... Are the steel braided lines worth the
> $$$? I only
> > want to do brake lines once.
> >
> > TIA,
> > Jeff
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> --------------
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5894 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 9:00pm
Subject: Re: FW: Directions to Broken Arrow
Tom,
I figured the snow & rain pucker factor would be the type of thing you were
looking for :) Although it appears Saturday will be a sunny day instead. Im
sure there will be people interested in finding some play areas after the
main trail is finished.
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: tom le <tomle_85024@y...>
To: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>; Arizona Virtual Jeep Club (E-mail)
<AZ_VJC@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2000 9:04 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: FW: Directions to Broken Arrow
> Larry,
> Count me in and it would not bother me at all if there
> is snow or rain present on that day. Oh, besure to
> bring your camera since I'll be doing a lot of crazy
> things, just kidding.
> Tom
>
> --- Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...> wrote:
> > Tom,
> >
> > It would be good to have you along. This coming
> > saturday it is. Meeting at
> > carefree & I17 and departing at 8:30am. If there is
> > rain or snow on the
> > ground it could add to the pucker factor.
> >
> > Larry
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: tom le <tomle_85024@y...>
> > To: <herring@u...>; Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
> > (E-mail)
> > <AZ_VJC@egroups.com>
> > Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 8:07 PM
> > Subject: [az_vjc] Re: FW: Directions to Broken Arrow
> >
> >
> > > I am thinking about joining you guys on this run
> > but
> > > don't recall which day is it on. Is it going to
> > be
> > > the upcoming Saturday (2/26)? Please advise.
> > > Thanks,
> > > Tom
> > >
> > > --- Eric Herring <herring@u...> wrote:
> > > > Getting to the trail is easy, just get off of
> > I17 on
> > > > the first Sedona exit
> > > > and go West until you see the broken arrow sign
> > on
> > > > the right. Turn at the
> > > > sign and follow the road to a dirt parking lot
> > at
> > > > the end. I may just meet
> > > > everyone at the trail head But let me know if
> > anyone
> > > > is planning a convoy.
> > > > Does anyone mind some non-Jeeps tagging along?
> > Do we
> > > > have a meeting time
> > > > yet?
> > > >
> > > > See you there,
> > > > Eric Herring 92XJ
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: James A Langdon
> > [mailto:yucca-man@j...]
> > > > Sent: Sunday, February 20, 2000 1:37 AM
> > > > To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> > > > Subject: [az_vjc] Directions to Broken Arrow
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Okay,
> > > >
> > > > One of the new members pointed out that I am not
> > > > keeping up with the
> > > > website with a 30-minute turnaround on updates.
> > <G>
> > > > One run that I have
> > > > listed as upcoming is a Feb 26 run to Broken
> > Arrow,
> > > > but I have (again)
> > > > lost the directions. Who is leading this run,
> > and
> > > > what are the
> > > > directions for Broken Arrow and for the meeting
> > > > spot? Is there any
> > > > interest in having a convoy from the East
> > Valley?
> > > >
> > > > Jim Yucca-man@j...
> > > > Dirty 1/2 dozen - Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
> > > > http://azvjc.web.com
> > > > 89 Cherokee (RIP) 73 CJ5 (RIP)
> > > >
> > > > When they took the Fourth Amendment, I was quiet
> > > > because I didn't deal
> > > > drugs.
> > > > When they took the Fifth Amendment, I was quiet
> > > > because I was innocent.
> > > > When they took the Second Amendment, I was quiet
> > > > because I didn't own a
> > > > gun.
> > > > Now they've taken the First Amendment and I
> > can't
> > > > say anything.
> > > >
> > >
> >
> __________________________________________________ ______________
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5895 From: <dirtdog@u...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 9:41pm
Subject: Re: Lift Kit
TJ,
I ran the Pro comp springs up front for about 1-1/2 years and the set I had was nice and squishy, maybe it was because they were mounted on backwards, (because of the shackle reversal that I have, I do not recommend this unless you like your tires rubbing of the rear of the fender openings the change it is not worth the hassles of trimming fender and 5-6" long bump stops.)
The Pro Comp springs flexed so much the I broke them just past the clamp that holds them together. Off-Road Unlimited replaced them with no hassles. One of the spring shops here in town told me that the clamps that just have up rights with bolts through them are much better for serious four wheeling, and do not put the stress on the leaves where the clamps are.
I also don't recommend the drop pitman arms most of the lift kit companies sell. They are about 1" shorter from hole to hole and this will really hurt your turning radius especially if your locked up up front. Go down to 4 Wheelers Supply and have Randy or Rob over on the Dark Side (FAB shop) put your tie rod ends on top of the knuckles, and if you have the cash upgrade to the chrome molly drag link and tie rods.
PS. I am running YJ 3.5 super lift springs of the rear of my CJ-7 and they seem to work pretty well. If you go down to 4 Wheelers Supply this week you can check out what they (Randy and Rob) are trying on a friend of mine's CJ-7 to get it to flex better, I think they are putting Ranch 2.5" YJ front springs up front and XJ 2.5" rear springs on the rear. It is supposedly flexing really well.
Good luck
Bernie
Ken Unterriner wrote:
I put this lift on mine and took it back off because it rode
terrible.Very rough ride.I bought rancho springs and put them on and it
was a lot better.
Ken U
84 cj7
"t.j. gill" wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=5879
> Hi all....I was wondering if anyone knows anything about the explorer
> pro comp lift kit....I was quoted $450 for one at Off-Road Unlimited
in
> Mesa....the price is in my range since they said they would install it
> for $200 (which would free up my weekend :).......I had never heard
of
> this make so was wondering if it was any good....I want to get it into
> the shop this week so any feedback would be appreciated...thanx in
> advance....
>
> TJ
> 75 CJ5 (The Money Pit)
>
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5896 From: James A Langdon <yucca-man@j...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 8:38pm
Subject: Re: Lift Kit
Then again, on a vehicle with an 84" wheelbase, anything except an air
cushion can be a rough ride. I had (have) a 2.5" Rancho on my 73 CJ5,
and it was not a pleasant experience on some highways. Over trails, it
doesn't matter, but on the road your kidneys nac take a beating. Need to
get that puppy back up and running again to enjoy that experience...
Jim Yucca-man@j...
Dirty 1/2 dozen - Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
http://azvjc.web.com
89 Cherokee (RIP) 73 CJ5 (RIP)
On Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:12:23 -0700 Dave Reinken <daver@c...>
writes:
> Don't know anything about that specific kit, but I've heard that
> ProComp
> leaf springs tend to be a bit on the stiff side.
>
> "T.J. Gill" wrote:
> >
> > Hi all....I was wondering if anyone knows anything about the
> explorer
> > pro comp lift kit....I was quoted $450 for one at Off-Road
> Unlimited in
> > Mesa....the price is in my range since they said they would
> install it
> > for $200 (which would free up my weekend :).......I had never
> heard of
> > this make so was wondering if it was any good....I want to get it
> into
> > the shop this week so any feedback would be appreciated...thanx in
> > advance....
> >
> > TJ
> > 75 CJ5 (The Money Pit)
__________________________________________________ ______________
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5897 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 1:13am
Subject: Re: Coves Cleanup/ Spreading the word
here is a copy of the letter I sent to Dave Pratt of 98KUPD hopefully he
will help spread the word to all his 4x4 listners..
Dave (azxj)
Dave,
I have been a loyal listner to your morning show for over 10yrs now. I have
heard you on occasion speak of a guy who made 4x4 maps of Arizona. Well I am
writing to you to ask if you will help rally your 4x4 driving listeners to
help The Arizona Virtual Jeep club conduct a clean up of the Coves/rolls Off
highway vehicle area at Saguaro Lake. I know Every year you do the tubing on
the Salt river and love it just as much as everyone else. I certinally do. I
also enjoy 4 wheeling in the same area. But we are running the risk of
loosing our playgrounds due to trash and misuse of the lands and rivers..
There are people out there trying to close these areas and others down to
our (All Arizonans) use. Please help us keep our lands open by spreading the
word too all.
Saturday March 4th Saguaro Lake, Butcher Jones parking lot, 9am Start point
is the Green Cattle gate.
everyone will meet there. take I10 to SR60 East. Exit at Power Road and go
North. Power merges with Bush Highway. Continue on Bush Highway past Saguaro
Lake Marina turnoff to Butcher Jones Park - a right hand turn. pass through
the Fee stop area (not needed unless you plan to park at the park)
Thanks for you help
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Loveless [mailto:jal@c...]
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 9:15 AM
To: BigFlatFuzzyCows@a...; az_vjc@egroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Coves Cleanup
From Tucson, take I10 to SR60 East. Exit at Power Line Road and go North.
PowerLine merges with Bush Highway. Continue on Bush Highway past Saguaro
Lake Marina turnoff to Butcher Jones Park - a right hand turn. Go to
Butcher Jones - pass through the Fee stop area (not needed unless you plan
to park at the park) go around the parking areas and near the end you will
see a Green Ccattle Gate. We meet on the park side of the Green gate to air
down and disconnect. Then we go through the gate to the Coves.
We are really glad to have your help all the way from Tucson. It will be a
fun day and there is some great off roading and camping there as well. If
you plan to stay over I think there will be several people camping at one
or more of the Coves.
At 10:01 AM 2/21/00 -0500, you wrote:
>We're coming from Tucson. :)
>
>Christi and Ken =)
=================
Jon Loveless
Convenient P&C Group
(610) 521-6066
=================
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5898 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:23am
Subject: Re: TJ body lift question
A 1" body lift if fairly straight forward, and requires little modification
if done in conjunction with a 1" motor mount lift. Anything over a 1" B/L
does require some of the mods mentioned in your post (a/c lines, etc). But a
1" is no big deal.
I'm not familiar w/ the skid plate you mentioned, but my guess is it raises
the tranny/t-case, which would affect your drive line angles. The tranny has
a mount that cantilevers back under the t-case and attaches to the skid.
Just a guess, but you may find this skid isn't worth the problems associated
w/ your drive angles. Just a thought.
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: Tim Naylor <tim.naylor@w...>
To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2000 9:27 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] TJ body lift question
> To help satisfy my nagging upgrade additicion, I want to have a 1 inch
body
> lift installed on my 97 TJ. I have been told by 2 different 4 wheel shops
in
> Tucson, that would rather not do the work because it involves difficult
> modifications to the air conditioning connections. Does anyone out there
> know what has to be done the air conditioning that is so difficult?
>
> I have a Tereflex Belly Up skid plate I want to put on my TJ. The salesman
> said "easy, no brainer install" The instructions have an ominous warning
> that it might cause drive line viberations, it requires 1/2 inch shims
under
> the motor mounts, and says that you will have to relocate some of the
exaust
> system or install a 1 inch body lift. Does that sound like a "no brainer"
> install to you.?
> I may go to 35 inch tires later so I decided I may as well do the body
lift.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get what you deserve with NextCard Visa! ZERO! Rates as low as
> 0.0% Intro APR, online balance transfers, Rewards Points, no
> hidden fees, and much more! Get NextCard today and get the credit
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5899 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 4:21am
Subject: XJ update
Well I got her fixed today at GoodYear service center on 67th ave and
Peoria. 920.09 grand total
Well at least I got some kind of warrantie. Plus 50.00 bucks to have it
towed to the shop. I just couldn't finish it by my self and my Buddy that
helped me last time was really busy so I had to eat it on this one agian...
Ho well!! it's only money (yea right) It is running great now and shifts
like a dream.. Almost doesn't seem like my rig. (lol) I will not be
attending the Broken Arrow run this weekend. I want to let everything seat
before I got beating her up agian. Just in case... I will also be installing
my 2in lift that I had bought just before the Slave cyl. went out.. Thanks
to all for the helpful comments. Oh by the way. All the parts are new Mopar
items and they even used Mopar fluid... Clutch/Pressure plate/and Slave
cylinder. I will comment on the shop in a few weeks when I am positive that
everything is stable...
Dave (AZXJ)
5900 From: Linda Luik <p14175@e...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 8:54am
Subject: [Fwd: Citibank confirms anti-gun stance]
Not exactly 4x4 related, but it is interesting that certain financial
institutions are acting like this.
I plan on cancelling my Citibank based visa card.
Linda
Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 09:24:06 MST
From: Steve Graham Steve.Graham@f...
Subject: Citibank confirms anti-gun stance
To: Linda Luik minihummer@w... , "Linda Luik (p14175)" p14175@e...
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/bluesky_dougherty/20000223_xnjdo_citibank_c.shtml
Attachment: vcard [not shown]
5901 From: Dave Reinken <daver@c...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 9:32am
Subject: [Fwd: FR 18-Red Creek Road]
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: FR 18-Red Creek Road
Date: 23 Feb 00 10:02:24 -0700
From: Terry Heslin <theslin@p...>
Reply-To: Terry Heslin <theslin@p...>
To: Blind *Copy <theslin@p...>
Outdoor Enthusiasts:
Public comments are due very soon--3/3/00--on the Red Creek Grazing
Allotment Environmental Assessment (EA), Cave Creek District, Tonto
National Forest.
Please send all comments to:
Delvin R. Lopez
District Ranger
Cave Creek Ranger District
40202 N. Cave Creek Road
Scottsdale, AZ 85262
e-mail to:
dlopez/r3_tonto@f...
Cc to: rsteinke/r3_tonto@f...
Bazan_Charles/r3_tonto@f...
It is advisable to print a hardcopy of your e-mail and send it to the
address above.
RED CREEK ROAD:
>From page 35 of the EA
3.7 Recreation
FR 18
FR 18, from its intersection with FR 269 to the Verde River is
designated as an open road in the Forest Resource Access Travel
Management Plan. FR 18 is also listed in the Matazal Wilderness
Implementation Plan as a Wilderness Access Road which provides access to
the 11 trail and the 269 trail. The entire length of FR 18 is
approximately 6 miles. The last 3.6 miles is mostly in the bottom of
Red Creek and is very difficult to negotiate in a four wheel drive
vehicle.
FR 18 provides the only motorized access to the Verde River from Childs
Power Plant south to Sheep Bridge. The road is very unique in that it
provides technical challenge, spectacular scenery and the Verde River as
a destination. The road provides a level of technical challenge sought
by many 4-wheel drive enthusiasts. There are at least 6 dispersed camp
sites along the way. The terminus of FR 18 at the Verde River is a
wilderness access point, launch and take-out point for rafters, and
canoeists, and a prime fishing location.
In alternatives B-F, (alternative A is "no action"), limiting access or
closure of FR 18 would eliminate recreational opportunity for outdoor
enthusiasts and reduce access along Red Creek and the Verde River.
Motorized access to the Verde River could only be achieved through the
Childs Power Plant area upstream or Sheeps Bridge downstream. Rafters
and canoeists would no longer have a wilderness access point to launch
and take-out their watercraft in the vicinity. Fisherman, hikers and
campers would have to hike in four miles to reach access to the Verde
River.
3.6 Fisheries
(from an excerpt about FR 18)
Presently, the amount of impact to fisheries from FR 18 is masked or
overwhelmed by cattle grazing. Direct hoof impact on streambanks and
utilization of riparian vegetation is the primary factor destabilizing
stream banks and causing the channel to widen.
End excerpt from the EA.
Given the information above, it is unfortunate that the Forest Service
proposes to close FR 18 under every alternative but A--no action (it is
very rare for this alternative to be chosen as the "preferred
alternative"). Each of the other alternatives calls for a reduction or
elimination of access via FR 18.
Since the amount of impact to fisheries is not known, a modified
alternative should be developed that would relocate all or parts of the
road, or stabilize all or parts of the road. Additionally, the forest
service should monitor the direct effects of the road from vehicle
travel before they eliminate access based on assumptions of adverse
effects to fisheries and the environment.
5902 From: Linda Luik <p14175@e...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 9:35am
Subject: [Fwd: FR 18-Red Creek Road]
FYI.
Linda
Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 10:07:41 MST
From: Terry Heslin theslin@p...
Subject: FR 18-Red Creek Road
To: Blind *Copy theslin@p...
Apparently-To: "Linda_Luik-P14175@email" p14175@msgphx8
Outdoor Enthusiasts:
Public comments are due very soon--3/3/00--on the Red Creek Grazing Allotment Environmental Assessment (EA), Cave Creek District, Tonto National Forest.
Please send all comments to:
Delvin R. Lopez
District Ranger
Cave Creek Ranger District
40202 N. Cave Creek Road
Scottsdale, AZ 85262
e-mail to:
dlopez/r3_tonto@fs.fed.us
Cc to: rsteinke/r3_tonto@fs.fed.us
Bazan_Charles/r3_tonto@fs.fed.us
It is advisable to print a hardcopy of your e-mail and send it to the address above.
RED CREEK ROAD:
From page 35 of the EA
3.7 Recreation
FR 18
FR 18, from its intersection with FR 269 to the Verde River is designated as an open road in the Forest Resource Access Travel Management Plan. FR 18 is also listed in the Matazal Wilderness Implementation Plan as a Wilderness Access Road which provides access to the 11 trail and the 269 trail. The entire length of FR 18 is approximately 6 miles. The last 3.6 miles is mostly in the bottom of Red Creek and is very difficult to negotiate in a four wheel drive vehicle.
FR 18 provides the only motorized access to the Verde River from Childs Power Plant south to Sheep Bridge. The road is very unique in that it provides technical challenge, spectacular scenery and the Verde River as a destination. The road provides a level of technical challenge sought by many 4-wheel drive enthusiasts. There are at least 6 dispersed camp sites along the way. The terminus of FR 18 at the Verde River is a wilderness access point, launch and take-out point for rafters, and canoeists, and a prime fishing location.
In alternatives B-F, (alternative A is "no action"), limiting access or closure of FR 18 would eliminate recreational opportunity for outdoor enthusiasts and reduce access along Red Creek and the Verde River. Motorized access to the Verde River could only be achieved through the Childs Power Plant area upstream or Sheeps Bridge downstream. Rafters and canoeists would no longer have a wilderness access point to launch and take-out their watercraft in the vicinity. Fisherman, hikers and campers would have to hike in four miles to reach access to the Verde River.
3.6 Fisheries
(from an excerpt about FR 18)
Presently, the amount of impact to fisheries from FR 18 is masked or overwhelmed by cattle grazing. Direct hoof impact on streambanks and utilization of riparian vegetation is the primary factor destabilizing stream banks and causing the channel to widen.
End excerpt from the EA.
Given the information above, it is unfortunate that the Forest Service proposes to close FR 18 under every alternative but A--no action (it is very rare for this alternative to be chosen as the "preferred alternative"). Each of the other alternatives calls for a reduction or elimination of access via FR 18.
Since the amount of impact to fisheries is not known, a modified alternative should be developed that would relocate all or parts of the road, or stabilize all or parts of the road. Additionally, the forest service should monitor the direct effects of the road from vehicle travel before they eliminate access based on assumptions of adverse effects to fisheries and the environment.
Attachment: vcard [not shown]
5903 From: <clinttravis@s...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 11:07am
Subject: Building TJ with 35s
To anyone with advise,
I have a stock '97 TJ Sahara (5speed) and want eventually to make an
excellent off road rig with a second goal of having decent on road
drivability.
I plan on using 35x12.5 (on offset rims), air lockers, 4to1 kit, 4:56
gears, rear drive shaft conversion kit.
My question is what is smallest lift that would clear those tires? I
hear that the 4" tera flex will work, but for me that is all hear say.
Also, what tires and offsets should I use?
I would REALLY like to talk to someone who has a similar setup, and has
been through this, so I don't have to make the same mistakes.
Thanks ahead of time for any advise. I really do appreciate it.
Clint Travis '97 TJ (480) 777-0665
5904 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 10:15am
Subject: Re: [Fwd: FR 18-Red Creek Road]
Dave,
I have requested a copy of the EA from Mr. Lopez but he has ignored my
letter to him.
Perhaps you could check on something for me in the EA?
>(from an excerpt about FR 18)
>
>Presently, the amount of impact to fisheries from FR 18 is masked or
>overwhelmed by cattle grazing. Direct hoof impact on streambanks and
>utilization of riparian vegetation is the primary factor destabilizing
>stream banks and causing the channel to widen.
>
>End excerpt from the EA.
The EA states that cattle grazing is destablizing the stream banks and
causing the channel to widen. Was there any mention of this happening as a
result of vehicle use? If not, then closing the creek to vehicle traffic is
not required.
In my "unprofessional" opinion, the most destablizing element in Red Creek
is the flash floods that roar down the creek, as evidencded by natrual
derbis being lodged some 6'+ up in the tree branches. One flash flood would
completely remove any evidence of a cow or Jeep ever being in the creek
area. It would also radically alter the channel of the creek and it would
no doubt become narrower or wider, depending on whatever Mother Nature
decided to do that day!
>amount of impact to fisheries from FR 18 is masked or
>overwhelmed by cattle grazing
Note the careful wording here....the impact is masked or overwhelmed....in
other words, the impact can not be determined....good or bad. I also asked
Mr. Lopez for the data that was gathered to support the EA impact statements
and he is again ignoring my request. (I am sure there is not data to
support most of the "findings" in the EA. OK, I will give them the fact
that there are hoof prints in the stream bank.)
Folks.....send in your comments to Mr. Lopez. As Dave suggested, e-mail
him, print a copy, and send it via regular mail too!
God, I hope we don't lose this trail!
Stu
Stu Olson N7QJP
Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
http://www.users.uswest.net/~solson8
http://home.off-road.com/~stu
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Dave Reinken [mailto:daver@c...]
>Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 10:32
>To: az_vjc
>Subject: [az_vjc] [Fwd: FR 18-Red Creek Road]
>
>
>
>
>-------- Original Message --------
>Subject: FR 18-Red Creek Road
>Date: 23 Feb 00 10:02:24 -0700
>From: Terry Heslin <theslin@p...>
>Reply-To: Terry Heslin <theslin@p...>
>To: Blind *Copy <theslin@p...>
>
>Outdoor Enthusiasts:
>
>Public comments are due very soon--3/3/00--on the Red Creek Grazing
>Allotment Environmental Assessment (EA), Cave Creek District, Tonto
>National Forest.
>Please send all comments to:
>
>Delvin R. Lopez
>District Ranger
>Cave Creek Ranger District
>40202 N. Cave Creek Road
>Scottsdale, AZ 85262
>
>e-mail to:
>dlopez/r3_tonto@f...
>
>Cc to: rsteinke/r3_tonto@f...
>Bazan_Charles/r3_tonto@f...
>
>It is advisable to print a hardcopy of your e-mail and send it to the
>address above.
>RED CREEK ROAD:
>>From page 35 of the EA
>
>3.7 Recreation
>
>FR 18
>
>FR 18, from its intersection with FR 269 to the Verde River is
>designated as an open road in the Forest Resource Access Travel
>Management Plan. FR 18 is also listed in the Matazal Wilderness
>Implementation Plan as a Wilderness Access Road which provides access to
>the 11 trail and the 269 trail. The entire length of FR 18 is
>approximately 6 miles. The last 3.6 miles is mostly in the bottom of
>Red Creek and is very difficult to negotiate in a four wheel drive
>vehicle.
>
>FR 18 provides the only motorized access to the Verde River from Childs
>Power Plant south to Sheep Bridge. The road is very unique in that it
>provides technical challenge, spectacular scenery and the Verde River as
>a destination. The road provides a level of technical challenge sought
>by many 4-wheel drive enthusiasts. There are at least 6 dispersed camp
>sites along the way. The terminus of FR 18 at the Verde River is a
>wilderness access point, launch and take-out point for rafters, and
>canoeists, and a prime fishing location.
>
>In alternatives B-F, (alternative A is "no action"), limiting access or
>closure of FR 18 would eliminate recreational opportunity for outdoor
>enthusiasts and reduce access along Red Creek and the Verde River.
>Motorized access to the Verde River could only be achieved through the
>Childs Power Plant area upstream or Sheeps Bridge downstream. Rafters
>and canoeists would no longer have a wilderness access point to launch
>and take-out their watercraft in the vicinity. Fisherman, hikers and
>campers would have to hike in four miles to reach access to the Verde
>River.
>
>3.6 Fisheries
>
>(from an excerpt about FR 18)
>
>Presently, the amount of impact to fisheries from FR 18 is masked or
>overwhelmed by cattle grazing. Direct hoof impact on streambanks and
>utilization of riparian vegetation is the primary factor destabilizing
>stream banks and causing the channel to widen.
>
>End excerpt from the EA.
>
>Given the information above, it is unfortunate that the Forest Service
>proposes to close FR 18 under every alternative but A--no action (it is
>very rare for this alternative to be chosen as the "preferred
>alternative"). Each of the other alternatives calls for a reduction or
>elimination of access via FR 18.
>Since the amount of impact to fisheries is not known, a modified
>alternative should be developed that would relocate all or parts of the
>road, or stabilize all or parts of the road. Additionally, the forest
>service should monitor the direct effects of the road from vehicle
>travel before they eliminate access based on assumptions of adverse
>effects to fisheries and the environment.
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Get what you deserve with NextCard Visa! ZERO! Rates as low as 0.0%
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>
>
>
5905 From: Linda Luik <p14175@e...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 11:22am
Subject: Re: [Fwd: FR 18-Red Creek Road]
Stu,
I totally agree with your statements.
Linda
Attachment: vcard [not shown]
5906 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 11:31am
Subject: Red Creek
Dear Mr. Lopez:
Thank you for having sent me the EA on Red Creek. I urge you not to close
FR18. This is the only trail into the Verde for many miles, and is really
quite lightly used.
I am a founding member of AzVJC (Arizona Virtual Jeep Club), an Internet
based 4x4 club, which is now the largest 4x4 club in the state (over 200
members). We would be happy to adopt this trail and help maintain it and
keep impacts to a minimum. Please feel free to contact me, should this be of
any interest to you.
In summary, I urge you to please keep FR18 open.
If you would like to contact me for any reason, my snail mail is:
Doug Ballard
1891 W. Honeysuckle Ln.
Chandler, Az. 85248
Thanks.
Doug
azjeep@h...
5907 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 11:33am
Subject: Re: Building TJ with 35s
The 4" lift with a 1" body lift will do it for 35's
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: <clinttravis@s...>
To: <az_vjc@eGroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 12:07 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Building TJ with 35s
> To anyone with advise,
>
> I have a stock '97 TJ Sahara (5speed) and want eventually to make an
> excellent off road rig with a second goal of having decent on road
> drivability.
>
> I plan on using 35x12.5 (on offset rims), air lockers, 4to1 kit, 4:56
> gears, rear drive shaft conversion kit.
>
> My question is what is smallest lift that would clear those tires? I
> hear that the 4" tera flex will work, but for me that is all hear say.
> Also, what tires and offsets should I use?
>
> I would REALLY like to talk to someone who has a similar setup, and has
> been through this, so I don't have to make the same mistakes.
>
> Thanks ahead of time for any advise. I really do appreciate it.
>
> Clint Travis '97 TJ (480) 777-0665
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as 2.9%
> Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW!
> http://click.egroups.com/1/915/4/_/1966/_/951332856/
>
> -- Create a poll/survey for your group!
> -- http://www.egroups.com/vote?listname=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
5908 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 1:28pm
Subject: FR 18-Red Creek Road
Dear Mr. Lopez,
I recently sent you a letter requesting a copy of the Red Creek EA so that I
could better respond during the public comment period. I have not yet
received the copy and since the deadline for comment is drawing near, I am
forced to comment again, without the benefit of the EA. If you are without
funding to supply me with this document, I understand.
My reference to the EA, in this letter, comes from another person who
obtained a copy and was kind enough to provide me with a small bit of
information.
I understand that the EA, section 3.6, contains the statement:
"Direct hoof impact on stream banks and utilization of riparian vegetation
is the primary factor destabilizing stream banks and causing the channel to
widen."
I visited Red Creek two times last year, once in July and again in December.
I could find no direct evidence that cattle were causing a destabilization
of the stream bank and a resultant widening of the channel. In both cases,
the creek was running about 4' to 5' wide and a couple of inches in depth.
Neither the cattle tracks, deer tracks, mountain lion tracks, or other small
animal tracks seemed to have any effect on where the water was flowing.
What I did notice during my two trips was the vast amount of natural debris
that was lodged some 6' up in the tree limbs. This was obviously the direct
results of flash floods that occur in Red Creek. These no doubt make major
changes to the creek channel and certainly destabilize the creek bank, to
the point of either washing it away or depositing a new one where the
current slows down.
I was also glad to see that section 3.6 does not point to vehicle traffic as
a contributing factor to the stream bank destabilization.
While traveling the creek bed itself, I found no evidence of "off trail"
vehicle traffic causing damage to the creek or impacting the creek bed
itself. In many places, it is impossible to drive off the trail because of
the heavy brush or the canyon rock walls. In several instances, I found
myself having to stop just so I could properly determine where the trail
actually ran. Certainly this level of use is not impacting the area.
As I had stated in my previous letter to you, I ask that you do not mix
cattle grazing impacts with vehicle use of the trail. As I said, I can see
no impact to the creek resulting because of cattle getting a drink of water.
I ask that you don't close this trail to 4x4 vehicle travel because cattle
are leaving tracks on the stream bank.
As a member of the Arizona Virtual Jeep Club, I strongly urge you to
consider leaving FR18 open for the vehicle traffic it currently supports.
Closing FR18 and eliminating access to that part of the Verde River would be
a great loss to all of us. I would gladly support an adopt-a-trail program
if you would consider this in regards to helping keep Red Creek open.
Sincerely,
Stu Olson
You may contact me at:
Stuart Olson
6625 W. Coolidge St.
Phoenix, AZ 85033
5909 From: Leah Eliscu <eliscu@m...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 1:49pm
Subject: FR 18-Red Creek Road
My personal letter is in the mail.
I also made some copies to hand out on the Tequila
Tank run this weekend. If you show up for my run,
please return them to me after you sign them. I'll
send them to Mr. Lopez.
Leah
5910 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 1:49pm
Subject: bad e-mail address for Red Creek
The e-mail address for Forest Ranger Lopez bounced. I have it as:
dlopez/r3_tonto@f...
Does anyone else have a valid one? I got this one from Dave Reinken's
e-mail notice about Red Creek.
Thanks.......Stu
Stu Olson N7QJP
Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
http://www.users.uswest.net/~solson8
http://home.off-road.com/~stu
5911 From: Sullivan, Len <LSULLIV@C...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:02pm
Subject: Coves cleanup - spreading the word
Hi all
Here is a copy of the announcement I posted on our company bulletin board
today. I'm also going to draft a letter similar to the one Dave sent to
KUPD and send it to KZZP and KMLE - both of which happen to be in the same
building where I work. :-)
Len
************************************************** ************************
The Arizona Virtual Jeep Club http://azvjc.web.com/ is sponsoring the Second
Annual Saguaro Lake Clean-up Run on March 4th and 5th. The Coves area north
of Saguaro Lake is used by hikers, campers, and off-road vehicle enthusiasts
year round, but unfortunately not all of them take their trash home with
them. The Arizona Virtual Jeep Club is working to keep our state clean and
to keep our public lands open for all outdoor enthusiasts by adopting the
Coves and keeping the area clean on a volunteer basis.
All outdoor enthusiasts are welcome to participate in this event......come
out and enjoy the fresh air, sunshine, beautiful scenery, and the
satisfaction of helping to keep our state beautiful.
For more information on the Coves recreational area, go to
http://members.aol.com/Revolvr/az_lake.htm
For more information on this event, contact Len Sullivan at
mailto:kermit@c...
We did not inherit the Earth from our ancestors,
We are borrowing it from our children.
************************************************
Len Sullivan
Vendor Direct Transmissions
and Faxstar Operations Coordinator
CSK Automotive, Inc.
602.631.7845
mailto:lsulliv@c...
5912 From: <clinttravis@s...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:19pm
Subject: Tera Flex or Rubicon Express or other
Who makes the best 4" to 5"lift kit for a TJ
Tera Flex, Rubicon Express or another company?
5913 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:53pm
Subject: Re: Tera Flex or Rubicon Express or other
The new RE kit looks like it's going to be tough to beat... for awhile
anyway.
Check it out...
http://www.outdoorwire.com/4x4/jeep/news/retj6lift/
----- Original Message -----
From: <clinttravis@s...>
To: <az_vjc@eGroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 4:19 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Tera Flex or Rubicon Express or other
> Who makes the best 4" to 5"lift kit for a TJ
>
> Tera Flex, Rubicon Express or another company?
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> WANT FREE MAGAZINES?
> Sample over 500 magazines in 30 categories-- all for FREE at
> FreeShop.com, your source for thousands of free and trial offers!
> http://click.egroups.com/1/1610/4/_/1966/_/951348000/
>
> -- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar!
> -- http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
>
5914 From: Matt Barker <azjeeps@f...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:53pm
Subject: See the Article
Did anyone happen to catch the article on the Charleau Gap in the April edition of 4wd and Sport Utility? Just figured some folks would be interested. Check it out on page 32.
Matt B.
94 YJ
http://azjeeps.web.com
Range Riders 4 Wheelers
Arizonal Virtual Jeep Club
5915 From: Matt Barker <azjeeps@f...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:54pm
Subject: FINALLY!!!
Well, after 6 years of owning my YJ, today I finally received my 4.5" Extreme Duty Rubicon Express lift. Hopefully I can get it put on this weekend and try it out. I am sooooooo excited. You can't imagine how long I have been waiting for this moment! Of course, this isn't the end of it....
Matt B.
94 YJ
http://azjeeps.web.com
Range Riders 4 Wheelers
Arizonal Virtual Jeep Club
5891 From: Tim Naylor <tim.naylor@w...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 8:27pm
Subject: TJ body lift question
To help satisfy my nagging upgrade additicion, I want to have a 1 inch body
lift installed on my 97 TJ. I have been told by 2 different 4 wheel shops in
Tucson, that would rather not do the work because it involves difficult
modifications to the air conditioning connections. Does anyone out there
know what has to be done the air conditioning that is so difficult?
I have a Tereflex Belly Up skid plate I want to put on my TJ. The salesman
said "easy, no brainer install" The instructions have an ominous warning
that it might cause drive line viberations, it requires 1/2 inch shims under
the motor mounts, and says that you will have to relocate some of the exaust
system or install a 1 inch body lift. Does that sound like a "no brainer"
install to you.?
I may go to 35 inch tires later so I decided I may as well do the body lift.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ADVERTISEMENT
5892 From: Chip Jones <twogun@c...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 8:46pm
Subject: Re: Lift Kit
I lucked out. The vibrations are minimal. I've just got the shims that came with
the kit.
Chip
BA914@a... wrote:
> Chip
>
> How did you get rid of the vibration in the driveline? I have tried a taller
> shim on the rear axle. but this did nothing. Any suggestions?
>
> Steve
5893 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 9:00pm
Subject: Re: SOA brakeline length?
I have a set of 4" lift CJ brake lines you can use for ramping purposes....
that is if you cant find any definitive answer first.
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: Ross Skinner <rskinner@s...>
To: azvjc <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 7:23 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: SOA brakeline length?
> Good questions Jeff. I am getting ready to do spring over on
> my 84 CJ. I will let you know on any brilliant findings. I
> am not going with Wrangler axles but it should be close
> otherwise.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Jeff Meade <jeffm@d...>
> To: <az_vjc@eGroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 7:09 PM
> Subject: [az_vjc] SOA brakeline length?
>
>
> > Hi VJers --
> >
> > I'm looking for approximate front brake line length for a
> CJ SOA setup.
> > I could guess, but if someone has widetrack axles with
> Wrangler
> > springs, a ballpark measurement would be appreciated.
> Without
> > brakes/dshafts, my CJ is in no position to run up a ramp
> to get a good
> > measurement. Also, I could use any recommendations on a
> place to find
> > decent prices.
> >
> > Another question ... Are the steel braided lines worth the
> $$$? I only
> > want to do brake lines once.
> >
> > TIA,
> > Jeff
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> --------------
> > GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as
> 2.9%
> > Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW!
> > http://click.egroups.com/1/915/4/_/1966/_/951185435/
> >
> > -- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group
> calendar!
> > -- http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=az_vjc&m=1
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates
> as low as 0.0% Intro APR and no hidden fees.
> Apply NOW!
> http://click.egroups.com/1/967/4/_/1966/_/951186377/
>
> -- Talk to your group with your own voice!
> -- http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=az_vjc&m=1
>
>
>
5894 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 9:00pm
Subject: Re: FW: Directions to Broken Arrow
Tom,
I figured the snow & rain pucker factor would be the type of thing you were
looking for :) Although it appears Saturday will be a sunny day instead. Im
sure there will be people interested in finding some play areas after the
main trail is finished.
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: tom le <tomle_85024@y...>
To: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>; Arizona Virtual Jeep Club (E-mail)
<AZ_VJC@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2000 9:04 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: FW: Directions to Broken Arrow
> Larry,
> Count me in and it would not bother me at all if there
> is snow or rain present on that day. Oh, besure to
> bring your camera since I'll be doing a lot of crazy
> things, just kidding.
> Tom
>
> --- Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...> wrote:
> > Tom,
> >
> > It would be good to have you along. This coming
> > saturday it is. Meeting at
> > carefree & I17 and departing at 8:30am. If there is
> > rain or snow on the
> > ground it could add to the pucker factor.
> >
> > Larry
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: tom le <tomle_85024@y...>
> > To: <herring@u...>; Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
> > (E-mail)
> > <AZ_VJC@egroups.com>
> > Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 8:07 PM
> > Subject: [az_vjc] Re: FW: Directions to Broken Arrow
> >
> >
> > > I am thinking about joining you guys on this run
> > but
> > > don't recall which day is it on. Is it going to
> > be
> > > the upcoming Saturday (2/26)? Please advise.
> > > Thanks,
> > > Tom
> > >
> > > --- Eric Herring <herring@u...> wrote:
> > > > Getting to the trail is easy, just get off of
> > I17 on
> > > > the first Sedona exit
> > > > and go West until you see the broken arrow sign
> > on
> > > > the right. Turn at the
> > > > sign and follow the road to a dirt parking lot
> > at
> > > > the end. I may just meet
> > > > everyone at the trail head But let me know if
> > anyone
> > > > is planning a convoy.
> > > > Does anyone mind some non-Jeeps tagging along?
> > Do we
> > > > have a meeting time
> > > > yet?
> > > >
> > > > See you there,
> > > > Eric Herring 92XJ
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: James A Langdon
> > [mailto:yucca-man@j...]
> > > > Sent: Sunday, February 20, 2000 1:37 AM
> > > > To: az_vjc@egroups.com
> > > > Subject: [az_vjc] Directions to Broken Arrow
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Okay,
> > > >
> > > > One of the new members pointed out that I am not
> > > > keeping up with the
> > > > website with a 30-minute turnaround on updates.
> > <G>
> > > > One run that I have
> > > > listed as upcoming is a Feb 26 run to Broken
> > Arrow,
> > > > but I have (again)
> > > > lost the directions. Who is leading this run,
> > and
> > > > what are the
> > > > directions for Broken Arrow and for the meeting
> > > > spot? Is there any
> > > > interest in having a convoy from the East
> > Valley?
> > > >
> > > > Jim Yucca-man@j...
> > > > Dirty 1/2 dozen - Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
> > > > http://azvjc.web.com
> > > > 89 Cherokee (RIP) 73 CJ5 (RIP)
> > > >
> > > > When they took the Fourth Amendment, I was quiet
> > > > because I didn't deal
> > > > drugs.
> > > > When they took the Fifth Amendment, I was quiet
> > > > because I was innocent.
> > > > When they took the Second Amendment, I was quiet
> > > > because I didn't own a
> > > > gun.
> > > > Now they've taken the First Amendment and I
> > can't
> > > > say anything.
> > > >
> > >
> >
> __________________________________________________ ______________
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5895 From: <dirtdog@u...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 9:41pm
Subject: Re: Lift Kit
TJ,
I ran the Pro comp springs up front for about 1-1/2 years and the set I had was nice and squishy, maybe it was because they were mounted on backwards, (because of the shackle reversal that I have, I do not recommend this unless you like your tires rubbing of the rear of the fender openings the change it is not worth the hassles of trimming fender and 5-6" long bump stops.)
The Pro Comp springs flexed so much the I broke them just past the clamp that holds them together. Off-Road Unlimited replaced them with no hassles. One of the spring shops here in town told me that the clamps that just have up rights with bolts through them are much better for serious four wheeling, and do not put the stress on the leaves where the clamps are.
I also don't recommend the drop pitman arms most of the lift kit companies sell. They are about 1" shorter from hole to hole and this will really hurt your turning radius especially if your locked up up front. Go down to 4 Wheelers Supply and have Randy or Rob over on the Dark Side (FAB shop) put your tie rod ends on top of the knuckles, and if you have the cash upgrade to the chrome molly drag link and tie rods.
PS. I am running YJ 3.5 super lift springs of the rear of my CJ-7 and they seem to work pretty well. If you go down to 4 Wheelers Supply this week you can check out what they (Randy and Rob) are trying on a friend of mine's CJ-7 to get it to flex better, I think they are putting Ranch 2.5" YJ front springs up front and XJ 2.5" rear springs on the rear. It is supposedly flexing really well.
Good luck
Bernie
Ken Unterriner wrote:
I put this lift on mine and took it back off because it rode
terrible.Very rough ride.I bought rancho springs and put them on and it
was a lot better.
Ken U
84 cj7
"t.j. gill" wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/az_vjc/?start=5879
> Hi all....I was wondering if anyone knows anything about the explorer
> pro comp lift kit....I was quoted $450 for one at Off-Road Unlimited
in
> Mesa....the price is in my range since they said they would install it
> for $200 (which would free up my weekend :).......I had never heard
of
> this make so was wondering if it was any good....I want to get it into
> the shop this week so any feedback would be appreciated...thanx in
> advance....
>
> TJ
> 75 CJ5 (The Money Pit)
>
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5896 From: James A Langdon <yucca-man@j...>
Date: Tue Feb 22, 2000 8:38pm
Subject: Re: Lift Kit
Then again, on a vehicle with an 84" wheelbase, anything except an air
cushion can be a rough ride. I had (have) a 2.5" Rancho on my 73 CJ5,
and it was not a pleasant experience on some highways. Over trails, it
doesn't matter, but on the road your kidneys nac take a beating. Need to
get that puppy back up and running again to enjoy that experience...
Jim Yucca-man@j...
Dirty 1/2 dozen - Arizona Virtual Jeep Club
http://azvjc.web.com
89 Cherokee (RIP) 73 CJ5 (RIP)
On Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:12:23 -0700 Dave Reinken <daver@c...>
writes:
> Don't know anything about that specific kit, but I've heard that
> ProComp
> leaf springs tend to be a bit on the stiff side.
>
> "T.J. Gill" wrote:
> >
> > Hi all....I was wondering if anyone knows anything about the
> explorer
> > pro comp lift kit....I was quoted $450 for one at Off-Road
> Unlimited in
> > Mesa....the price is in my range since they said they would
> install it
> > for $200 (which would free up my weekend :).......I had never
> heard of
> > this make so was wondering if it was any good....I want to get it
> into
> > the shop this week so any feedback would be appreciated...thanx in
> > advance....
> >
> > TJ
> > 75 CJ5 (The Money Pit)
__________________________________________________ ______________
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5897 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 1:13am
Subject: Re: Coves Cleanup/ Spreading the word
here is a copy of the letter I sent to Dave Pratt of 98KUPD hopefully he
will help spread the word to all his 4x4 listners..
Dave (azxj)
Dave,
I have been a loyal listner to your morning show for over 10yrs now. I have
heard you on occasion speak of a guy who made 4x4 maps of Arizona. Well I am
writing to you to ask if you will help rally your 4x4 driving listeners to
help The Arizona Virtual Jeep club conduct a clean up of the Coves/rolls Off
highway vehicle area at Saguaro Lake. I know Every year you do the tubing on
the Salt river and love it just as much as everyone else. I certinally do. I
also enjoy 4 wheeling in the same area. But we are running the risk of
loosing our playgrounds due to trash and misuse of the lands and rivers..
There are people out there trying to close these areas and others down to
our (All Arizonans) use. Please help us keep our lands open by spreading the
word too all.
Saturday March 4th Saguaro Lake, Butcher Jones parking lot, 9am Start point
is the Green Cattle gate.
everyone will meet there. take I10 to SR60 East. Exit at Power Road and go
North. Power merges with Bush Highway. Continue on Bush Highway past Saguaro
Lake Marina turnoff to Butcher Jones Park - a right hand turn. pass through
the Fee stop area (not needed unless you plan to park at the park)
Thanks for you help
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Loveless [mailto:jal@c...]
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 9:15 AM
To: BigFlatFuzzyCows@a...; az_vjc@egroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Coves Cleanup
From Tucson, take I10 to SR60 East. Exit at Power Line Road and go North.
PowerLine merges with Bush Highway. Continue on Bush Highway past Saguaro
Lake Marina turnoff to Butcher Jones Park - a right hand turn. Go to
Butcher Jones - pass through the Fee stop area (not needed unless you plan
to park at the park) go around the parking areas and near the end you will
see a Green Ccattle Gate. We meet on the park side of the Green gate to air
down and disconnect. Then we go through the gate to the Coves.
We are really glad to have your help all the way from Tucson. It will be a
fun day and there is some great off roading and camping there as well. If
you plan to stay over I think there will be several people camping at one
or more of the Coves.
At 10:01 AM 2/21/00 -0500, you wrote:
>We're coming from Tucson. :)
>
>Christi and Ken =)
=================
Jon Loveless
Convenient P&C Group
(610) 521-6066
=================
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5898 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:23am
Subject: Re: TJ body lift question
A 1" body lift if fairly straight forward, and requires little modification
if done in conjunction with a 1" motor mount lift. Anything over a 1" B/L
does require some of the mods mentioned in your post (a/c lines, etc). But a
1" is no big deal.
I'm not familiar w/ the skid plate you mentioned, but my guess is it raises
the tranny/t-case, which would affect your drive line angles. The tranny has
a mount that cantilevers back under the t-case and attaches to the skid.
Just a guess, but you may find this skid isn't worth the problems associated
w/ your drive angles. Just a thought.
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: Tim Naylor <tim.naylor@w...>
To: <az_vjc@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2000 9:27 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] TJ body lift question
> To help satisfy my nagging upgrade additicion, I want to have a 1 inch
body
> lift installed on my 97 TJ. I have been told by 2 different 4 wheel shops
in
> Tucson, that would rather not do the work because it involves difficult
> modifications to the air conditioning connections. Does anyone out there
> know what has to be done the air conditioning that is so difficult?
>
> I have a Tereflex Belly Up skid plate I want to put on my TJ. The salesman
> said "easy, no brainer install" The instructions have an ominous warning
> that it might cause drive line viberations, it requires 1/2 inch shims
under
> the motor mounts, and says that you will have to relocate some of the
exaust
> system or install a 1 inch body lift. Does that sound like a "no brainer"
> install to you.?
> I may go to 35 inch tires later so I decided I may as well do the body
lift.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get what you deserve with NextCard Visa! ZERO! Rates as low as
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5899 From: O'Boyle, David <David.OBoyle@b...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 4:21am
Subject: XJ update
Well I got her fixed today at GoodYear service center on 67th ave and
Peoria. 920.09 grand total
Well at least I got some kind of warrantie. Plus 50.00 bucks to have it
towed to the shop. I just couldn't finish it by my self and my Buddy that
helped me last time was really busy so I had to eat it on this one agian...
Ho well!! it's only money (yea right) It is running great now and shifts
like a dream.. Almost doesn't seem like my rig. (lol) I will not be
attending the Broken Arrow run this weekend. I want to let everything seat
before I got beating her up agian. Just in case... I will also be installing
my 2in lift that I had bought just before the Slave cyl. went out.. Thanks
to all for the helpful comments. Oh by the way. All the parts are new Mopar
items and they even used Mopar fluid... Clutch/Pressure plate/and Slave
cylinder. I will comment on the shop in a few weeks when I am positive that
everything is stable...
Dave (AZXJ)
5900 From: Linda Luik <p14175@e...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 8:54am
Subject: [Fwd: Citibank confirms anti-gun stance]
Not exactly 4x4 related, but it is interesting that certain financial
institutions are acting like this.
I plan on cancelling my Citibank based visa card.
Linda
Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 09:24:06 MST
From: Steve Graham Steve.Graham@f...
Subject: Citibank confirms anti-gun stance
To: Linda Luik minihummer@w... , "Linda Luik (p14175)" p14175@e...
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/bluesky_dougherty/20000223_xnjdo_citibank_c.shtml
Attachment: vcard [not shown]
5901 From: Dave Reinken <daver@c...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 9:32am
Subject: [Fwd: FR 18-Red Creek Road]
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: FR 18-Red Creek Road
Date: 23 Feb 00 10:02:24 -0700
From: Terry Heslin <theslin@p...>
Reply-To: Terry Heslin <theslin@p...>
To: Blind *Copy <theslin@p...>
Outdoor Enthusiasts:
Public comments are due very soon--3/3/00--on the Red Creek Grazing
Allotment Environmental Assessment (EA), Cave Creek District, Tonto
National Forest.
Please send all comments to:
Delvin R. Lopez
District Ranger
Cave Creek Ranger District
40202 N. Cave Creek Road
Scottsdale, AZ 85262
e-mail to:
dlopez/r3_tonto@f...
Cc to: rsteinke/r3_tonto@f...
Bazan_Charles/r3_tonto@f...
It is advisable to print a hardcopy of your e-mail and send it to the
address above.
RED CREEK ROAD:
>From page 35 of the EA
3.7 Recreation
FR 18
FR 18, from its intersection with FR 269 to the Verde River is
designated as an open road in the Forest Resource Access Travel
Management Plan. FR 18 is also listed in the Matazal Wilderness
Implementation Plan as a Wilderness Access Road which provides access to
the 11 trail and the 269 trail. The entire length of FR 18 is
approximately 6 miles. The last 3.6 miles is mostly in the bottom of
Red Creek and is very difficult to negotiate in a four wheel drive
vehicle.
FR 18 provides the only motorized access to the Verde River from Childs
Power Plant south to Sheep Bridge. The road is very unique in that it
provides technical challenge, spectacular scenery and the Verde River as
a destination. The road provides a level of technical challenge sought
by many 4-wheel drive enthusiasts. There are at least 6 dispersed camp
sites along the way. The terminus of FR 18 at the Verde River is a
wilderness access point, launch and take-out point for rafters, and
canoeists, and a prime fishing location.
In alternatives B-F, (alternative A is "no action"), limiting access or
closure of FR 18 would eliminate recreational opportunity for outdoor
enthusiasts and reduce access along Red Creek and the Verde River.
Motorized access to the Verde River could only be achieved through the
Childs Power Plant area upstream or Sheeps Bridge downstream. Rafters
and canoeists would no longer have a wilderness access point to launch
and take-out their watercraft in the vicinity. Fisherman, hikers and
campers would have to hike in four miles to reach access to the Verde
River.
3.6 Fisheries
(from an excerpt about FR 18)
Presently, the amount of impact to fisheries from FR 18 is masked or
overwhelmed by cattle grazing. Direct hoof impact on streambanks and
utilization of riparian vegetation is the primary factor destabilizing
stream banks and causing the channel to widen.
End excerpt from the EA.
Given the information above, it is unfortunate that the Forest Service
proposes to close FR 18 under every alternative but A--no action (it is
very rare for this alternative to be chosen as the "preferred
alternative"). Each of the other alternatives calls for a reduction or
elimination of access via FR 18.
Since the amount of impact to fisheries is not known, a modified
alternative should be developed that would relocate all or parts of the
road, or stabilize all or parts of the road. Additionally, the forest
service should monitor the direct effects of the road from vehicle
travel before they eliminate access based on assumptions of adverse
effects to fisheries and the environment.
5902 From: Linda Luik <p14175@e...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 9:35am
Subject: [Fwd: FR 18-Red Creek Road]
FYI.
Linda
Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 10:07:41 MST
From: Terry Heslin theslin@p...
Subject: FR 18-Red Creek Road
To: Blind *Copy theslin@p...
Apparently-To: "Linda_Luik-P14175@email" p14175@msgphx8
Outdoor Enthusiasts:
Public comments are due very soon--3/3/00--on the Red Creek Grazing Allotment Environmental Assessment (EA), Cave Creek District, Tonto National Forest.
Please send all comments to:
Delvin R. Lopez
District Ranger
Cave Creek Ranger District
40202 N. Cave Creek Road
Scottsdale, AZ 85262
e-mail to:
dlopez/r3_tonto@fs.fed.us
Cc to: rsteinke/r3_tonto@fs.fed.us
Bazan_Charles/r3_tonto@fs.fed.us
It is advisable to print a hardcopy of your e-mail and send it to the address above.
RED CREEK ROAD:
From page 35 of the EA
3.7 Recreation
FR 18
FR 18, from its intersection with FR 269 to the Verde River is designated as an open road in the Forest Resource Access Travel Management Plan. FR 18 is also listed in the Matazal Wilderness Implementation Plan as a Wilderness Access Road which provides access to the 11 trail and the 269 trail. The entire length of FR 18 is approximately 6 miles. The last 3.6 miles is mostly in the bottom of Red Creek and is very difficult to negotiate in a four wheel drive vehicle.
FR 18 provides the only motorized access to the Verde River from Childs Power Plant south to Sheep Bridge. The road is very unique in that it provides technical challenge, spectacular scenery and the Verde River as a destination. The road provides a level of technical challenge sought by many 4-wheel drive enthusiasts. There are at least 6 dispersed camp sites along the way. The terminus of FR 18 at the Verde River is a wilderness access point, launch and take-out point for rafters, and canoeists, and a prime fishing location.
In alternatives B-F, (alternative A is "no action"), limiting access or closure of FR 18 would eliminate recreational opportunity for outdoor enthusiasts and reduce access along Red Creek and the Verde River. Motorized access to the Verde River could only be achieved through the Childs Power Plant area upstream or Sheeps Bridge downstream. Rafters and canoeists would no longer have a wilderness access point to launch and take-out their watercraft in the vicinity. Fisherman, hikers and campers would have to hike in four miles to reach access to the Verde River.
3.6 Fisheries
(from an excerpt about FR 18)
Presently, the amount of impact to fisheries from FR 18 is masked or overwhelmed by cattle grazing. Direct hoof impact on streambanks and utilization of riparian vegetation is the primary factor destabilizing stream banks and causing the channel to widen.
End excerpt from the EA.
Given the information above, it is unfortunate that the Forest Service proposes to close FR 18 under every alternative but A--no action (it is very rare for this alternative to be chosen as the "preferred alternative"). Each of the other alternatives calls for a reduction or elimination of access via FR 18.
Since the amount of impact to fisheries is not known, a modified alternative should be developed that would relocate all or parts of the road, or stabilize all or parts of the road. Additionally, the forest service should monitor the direct effects of the road from vehicle travel before they eliminate access based on assumptions of adverse effects to fisheries and the environment.
Attachment: vcard [not shown]
5903 From: <clinttravis@s...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 11:07am
Subject: Building TJ with 35s
To anyone with advise,
I have a stock '97 TJ Sahara (5speed) and want eventually to make an
excellent off road rig with a second goal of having decent on road
drivability.
I plan on using 35x12.5 (on offset rims), air lockers, 4to1 kit, 4:56
gears, rear drive shaft conversion kit.
My question is what is smallest lift that would clear those tires? I
hear that the 4" tera flex will work, but for me that is all hear say.
Also, what tires and offsets should I use?
I would REALLY like to talk to someone who has a similar setup, and has
been through this, so I don't have to make the same mistakes.
Thanks ahead of time for any advise. I really do appreciate it.
Clint Travis '97 TJ (480) 777-0665
5904 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 10:15am
Subject: Re: [Fwd: FR 18-Red Creek Road]
Dave,
I have requested a copy of the EA from Mr. Lopez but he has ignored my
letter to him.
Perhaps you could check on something for me in the EA?
>(from an excerpt about FR 18)
>
>Presently, the amount of impact to fisheries from FR 18 is masked or
>overwhelmed by cattle grazing. Direct hoof impact on streambanks and
>utilization of riparian vegetation is the primary factor destabilizing
>stream banks and causing the channel to widen.
>
>End excerpt from the EA.
The EA states that cattle grazing is destablizing the stream banks and
causing the channel to widen. Was there any mention of this happening as a
result of vehicle use? If not, then closing the creek to vehicle traffic is
not required.
In my "unprofessional" opinion, the most destablizing element in Red Creek
is the flash floods that roar down the creek, as evidencded by natrual
derbis being lodged some 6'+ up in the tree branches. One flash flood would
completely remove any evidence of a cow or Jeep ever being in the creek
area. It would also radically alter the channel of the creek and it would
no doubt become narrower or wider, depending on whatever Mother Nature
decided to do that day!
>amount of impact to fisheries from FR 18 is masked or
>overwhelmed by cattle grazing
Note the careful wording here....the impact is masked or overwhelmed....in
other words, the impact can not be determined....good or bad. I also asked
Mr. Lopez for the data that was gathered to support the EA impact statements
and he is again ignoring my request. (I am sure there is not data to
support most of the "findings" in the EA. OK, I will give them the fact
that there are hoof prints in the stream bank.)
Folks.....send in your comments to Mr. Lopez. As Dave suggested, e-mail
him, print a copy, and send it via regular mail too!
God, I hope we don't lose this trail!
Stu
Stu Olson N7QJP
Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
http://www.users.uswest.net/~solson8
http://home.off-road.com/~stu
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Dave Reinken [mailto:daver@c...]
>Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 10:32
>To: az_vjc
>Subject: [az_vjc] [Fwd: FR 18-Red Creek Road]
>
>
>
>
>-------- Original Message --------
>Subject: FR 18-Red Creek Road
>Date: 23 Feb 00 10:02:24 -0700
>From: Terry Heslin <theslin@p...>
>Reply-To: Terry Heslin <theslin@p...>
>To: Blind *Copy <theslin@p...>
>
>Outdoor Enthusiasts:
>
>Public comments are due very soon--3/3/00--on the Red Creek Grazing
>Allotment Environmental Assessment (EA), Cave Creek District, Tonto
>National Forest.
>Please send all comments to:
>
>Delvin R. Lopez
>District Ranger
>Cave Creek Ranger District
>40202 N. Cave Creek Road
>Scottsdale, AZ 85262
>
>e-mail to:
>dlopez/r3_tonto@f...
>
>Cc to: rsteinke/r3_tonto@f...
>Bazan_Charles/r3_tonto@f...
>
>It is advisable to print a hardcopy of your e-mail and send it to the
>address above.
>RED CREEK ROAD:
>>From page 35 of the EA
>
>3.7 Recreation
>
>FR 18
>
>FR 18, from its intersection with FR 269 to the Verde River is
>designated as an open road in the Forest Resource Access Travel
>Management Plan. FR 18 is also listed in the Matazal Wilderness
>Implementation Plan as a Wilderness Access Road which provides access to
>the 11 trail and the 269 trail. The entire length of FR 18 is
>approximately 6 miles. The last 3.6 miles is mostly in the bottom of
>Red Creek and is very difficult to negotiate in a four wheel drive
>vehicle.
>
>FR 18 provides the only motorized access to the Verde River from Childs
>Power Plant south to Sheep Bridge. The road is very unique in that it
>provides technical challenge, spectacular scenery and the Verde River as
>a destination. The road provides a level of technical challenge sought
>by many 4-wheel drive enthusiasts. There are at least 6 dispersed camp
>sites along the way. The terminus of FR 18 at the Verde River is a
>wilderness access point, launch and take-out point for rafters, and
>canoeists, and a prime fishing location.
>
>In alternatives B-F, (alternative A is "no action"), limiting access or
>closure of FR 18 would eliminate recreational opportunity for outdoor
>enthusiasts and reduce access along Red Creek and the Verde River.
>Motorized access to the Verde River could only be achieved through the
>Childs Power Plant area upstream or Sheeps Bridge downstream. Rafters
>and canoeists would no longer have a wilderness access point to launch
>and take-out their watercraft in the vicinity. Fisherman, hikers and
>campers would have to hike in four miles to reach access to the Verde
>River.
>
>3.6 Fisheries
>
>(from an excerpt about FR 18)
>
>Presently, the amount of impact to fisheries from FR 18 is masked or
>overwhelmed by cattle grazing. Direct hoof impact on streambanks and
>utilization of riparian vegetation is the primary factor destabilizing
>stream banks and causing the channel to widen.
>
>End excerpt from the EA.
>
>Given the information above, it is unfortunate that the Forest Service
>proposes to close FR 18 under every alternative but A--no action (it is
>very rare for this alternative to be chosen as the "preferred
>alternative"). Each of the other alternatives calls for a reduction or
>elimination of access via FR 18.
>Since the amount of impact to fisheries is not known, a modified
>alternative should be developed that would relocate all or parts of the
>road, or stabilize all or parts of the road. Additionally, the forest
>service should monitor the direct effects of the road from vehicle
>travel before they eliminate access based on assumptions of adverse
>effects to fisheries and the environment.
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
>
>
5905 From: Linda Luik <p14175@e...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 11:22am
Subject: Re: [Fwd: FR 18-Red Creek Road]
Stu,
I totally agree with your statements.
Linda
Attachment: vcard [not shown]
5906 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 11:31am
Subject: Red Creek
Dear Mr. Lopez:
Thank you for having sent me the EA on Red Creek. I urge you not to close
FR18. This is the only trail into the Verde for many miles, and is really
quite lightly used.
I am a founding member of AzVJC (Arizona Virtual Jeep Club), an Internet
based 4x4 club, which is now the largest 4x4 club in the state (over 200
members). We would be happy to adopt this trail and help maintain it and
keep impacts to a minimum. Please feel free to contact me, should this be of
any interest to you.
In summary, I urge you to please keep FR18 open.
If you would like to contact me for any reason, my snail mail is:
Doug Ballard
1891 W. Honeysuckle Ln.
Chandler, Az. 85248
Thanks.
Doug
azjeep@h...
5907 From: DougB <azjeep@h...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 11:33am
Subject: Re: Building TJ with 35s
The 4" lift with a 1" body lift will do it for 35's
Doug
----- Original Message -----
From: <clinttravis@s...>
To: <az_vjc@eGroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 12:07 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Building TJ with 35s
> To anyone with advise,
>
> I have a stock '97 TJ Sahara (5speed) and want eventually to make an
> excellent off road rig with a second goal of having decent on road
> drivability.
>
> I plan on using 35x12.5 (on offset rims), air lockers, 4to1 kit, 4:56
> gears, rear drive shaft conversion kit.
>
> My question is what is smallest lift that would clear those tires? I
> hear that the 4" tera flex will work, but for me that is all hear say.
> Also, what tires and offsets should I use?
>
> I would REALLY like to talk to someone who has a similar setup, and has
> been through this, so I don't have to make the same mistakes.
>
> Thanks ahead of time for any advise. I really do appreciate it.
>
> Clint Travis '97 TJ (480) 777-0665
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW!
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>
> -- Create a poll/survey for your group!
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>
>
5908 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 1:28pm
Subject: FR 18-Red Creek Road
Dear Mr. Lopez,
I recently sent you a letter requesting a copy of the Red Creek EA so that I
could better respond during the public comment period. I have not yet
received the copy and since the deadline for comment is drawing near, I am
forced to comment again, without the benefit of the EA. If you are without
funding to supply me with this document, I understand.
My reference to the EA, in this letter, comes from another person who
obtained a copy and was kind enough to provide me with a small bit of
information.
I understand that the EA, section 3.6, contains the statement:
"Direct hoof impact on stream banks and utilization of riparian vegetation
is the primary factor destabilizing stream banks and causing the channel to
widen."
I visited Red Creek two times last year, once in July and again in December.
I could find no direct evidence that cattle were causing a destabilization
of the stream bank and a resultant widening of the channel. In both cases,
the creek was running about 4' to 5' wide and a couple of inches in depth.
Neither the cattle tracks, deer tracks, mountain lion tracks, or other small
animal tracks seemed to have any effect on where the water was flowing.
What I did notice during my two trips was the vast amount of natural debris
that was lodged some 6' up in the tree limbs. This was obviously the direct
results of flash floods that occur in Red Creek. These no doubt make major
changes to the creek channel and certainly destabilize the creek bank, to
the point of either washing it away or depositing a new one where the
current slows down.
I was also glad to see that section 3.6 does not point to vehicle traffic as
a contributing factor to the stream bank destabilization.
While traveling the creek bed itself, I found no evidence of "off trail"
vehicle traffic causing damage to the creek or impacting the creek bed
itself. In many places, it is impossible to drive off the trail because of
the heavy brush or the canyon rock walls. In several instances, I found
myself having to stop just so I could properly determine where the trail
actually ran. Certainly this level of use is not impacting the area.
As I had stated in my previous letter to you, I ask that you do not mix
cattle grazing impacts with vehicle use of the trail. As I said, I can see
no impact to the creek resulting because of cattle getting a drink of water.
I ask that you don't close this trail to 4x4 vehicle travel because cattle
are leaving tracks on the stream bank.
As a member of the Arizona Virtual Jeep Club, I strongly urge you to
consider leaving FR18 open for the vehicle traffic it currently supports.
Closing FR18 and eliminating access to that part of the Verde River would be
a great loss to all of us. I would gladly support an adopt-a-trail program
if you would consider this in regards to helping keep Red Creek open.
Sincerely,
Stu Olson
You may contact me at:
Stuart Olson
6625 W. Coolidge St.
Phoenix, AZ 85033
5909 From: Leah Eliscu <eliscu@m...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 1:49pm
Subject: FR 18-Red Creek Road
My personal letter is in the mail.
I also made some copies to hand out on the Tequila
Tank run this weekend. If you show up for my run,
please return them to me after you sign them. I'll
send them to Mr. Lopez.
Leah
5910 From: Stu Olson <solson8@u...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 1:49pm
Subject: bad e-mail address for Red Creek
The e-mail address for Forest Ranger Lopez bounced. I have it as:
dlopez/r3_tonto@f...
Does anyone else have a valid one? I got this one from Dave Reinken's
e-mail notice about Red Creek.
Thanks.......Stu
Stu Olson N7QJP
Phoenix, AZ DM33vm
http://www.users.uswest.net/~solson8
http://home.off-road.com/~stu
5911 From: Sullivan, Len <LSULLIV@C...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:02pm
Subject: Coves cleanup - spreading the word
Hi all
Here is a copy of the announcement I posted on our company bulletin board
today. I'm also going to draft a letter similar to the one Dave sent to
KUPD and send it to KZZP and KMLE - both of which happen to be in the same
building where I work. :-)
Len
************************************************** ************************
The Arizona Virtual Jeep Club http://azvjc.web.com/ is sponsoring the Second
Annual Saguaro Lake Clean-up Run on March 4th and 5th. The Coves area north
of Saguaro Lake is used by hikers, campers, and off-road vehicle enthusiasts
year round, but unfortunately not all of them take their trash home with
them. The Arizona Virtual Jeep Club is working to keep our state clean and
to keep our public lands open for all outdoor enthusiasts by adopting the
Coves and keeping the area clean on a volunteer basis.
All outdoor enthusiasts are welcome to participate in this event......come
out and enjoy the fresh air, sunshine, beautiful scenery, and the
satisfaction of helping to keep our state beautiful.
For more information on the Coves recreational area, go to
http://members.aol.com/Revolvr/az_lake.htm
For more information on this event, contact Len Sullivan at
mailto:kermit@c...
We did not inherit the Earth from our ancestors,
We are borrowing it from our children.
************************************************
Len Sullivan
Vendor Direct Transmissions
and Faxstar Operations Coordinator
CSK Automotive, Inc.
602.631.7845
mailto:lsulliv@c...
5912 From: <clinttravis@s...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:19pm
Subject: Tera Flex or Rubicon Express or other
Who makes the best 4" to 5"lift kit for a TJ
Tera Flex, Rubicon Express or another company?
5913 From: Larry Maggio <lmaggio@p...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:53pm
Subject: Re: Tera Flex or Rubicon Express or other
The new RE kit looks like it's going to be tough to beat... for awhile
anyway.
Check it out...
http://www.outdoorwire.com/4x4/jeep/news/retj6lift/
----- Original Message -----
From: <clinttravis@s...>
To: <az_vjc@eGroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 4:19 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Tera Flex or Rubicon Express or other
> Who makes the best 4" to 5"lift kit for a TJ
>
> Tera Flex, Rubicon Express or another company?
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
5914 From: Matt Barker <azjeeps@f...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:53pm
Subject: See the Article
Did anyone happen to catch the article on the Charleau Gap in the April edition of 4wd and Sport Utility? Just figured some folks would be interested. Check it out on page 32.
Matt B.
94 YJ
http://azjeeps.web.com
Range Riders 4 Wheelers
Arizonal Virtual Jeep Club
5915 From: Matt Barker <azjeeps@f...>
Date: Wed Feb 23, 2000 3:54pm
Subject: FINALLY!!!
Well, after 6 years of owning my YJ, today I finally received my 4.5" Extreme Duty Rubicon Express lift. Hopefully I can get it put on this weekend and try it out. I am sooooooo excited. You can't imagine how long I have been waiting for this moment! Of course, this isn't the end of it....
Matt B.
94 YJ
http://azjeeps.web.com
Range Riders 4 Wheelers
Arizonal Virtual Jeep Club