blooddrive
01-08-2004, 08:59 PM
88074-88098
88074 From: Kevin Gallagher <GIThunder81@c...>
Date: Wed Jul 23, 2003 11:08pm
Subject: RE: Rubicon or sport
If you have the money then I would get the Rubicon. Dana 44 front and
rear and lockers already installed. However if you do go sport buy one
from someone selling it privately this way you don't have to pay sales
tax and things like that. You figure lockers front and rear on a
wrangler sport with a 44 in the rear is going to run you over 2 grand
with installation and maybe even more. And with the Rubicon you get the
extra bonus of having a 44 in the front as well. Just a thought........
-----Original Message-----
From: rbales77 [mailto:rbales77@y...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 10:19 AM
To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Rubicon or sport
I have to agree that if the Jeep came with Lora Croft I would have to
buy that one to. The big question is. Is it better to get a Jeep
that has no upgrades on it or to get a Rubicon which has everything
that I would get. The only thing that I would think about changing
is the lift. Any suggestions
Rob
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ADVERTISEMENT
88075 From: Kevin Gallagher <GIThunder81@c...>
Date: Wed Jul 23, 2003 11:18pm
Subject: RE: Need Paint Work
I know a guy out here in buckeye, he does excellent work and very cheap.
I had him do some work for me and he charged 300 less than others
wanted. If you want his name let me know. He needs some favors from me
so I might be abloe to get a discount if other members of the AZVJC are
interested as well, let me know what you want done and I can get ya and
apprx price
-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Williams [mailto:g_rob_williams@y...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 3:25 PM
To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Need Paint Work
I need someone to touch up/fix some paint issues. Is there anyone in
the club that can do this, or know where to go to have it done. I am
pretty much just looking for a decent job at a good price. E-mail me
off list if you can help me out. -Rob
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
88076 From: AzVJC Website <azvjc@a...>
Date: Wed Jul 23, 2003 11:37pm
Subject: [TR] Lake Pleasant to Crown King - Saturday, August 16, 2003
Hello All,Kevin Carr is leading a Lake Pleasant to Crown King trail run on Saturday, August 16, 2003.<br><br>When: Saturday, August 16, 10AM
Where: Meet at S.E. Corner of Carefree Highway and I-17 by 10AM.
Rating: 3.0-
Length: All Day or Stay Over
CB Channel:
Some of us in our group will be staying over to camp out on top of the mountains under the stars and may run the trail backwards on Sunday.
The Lake Pleasang to Crown King trail is a local favorite. On any given weekend, there will be numerous groups of four wheelers, ATV's and motorcycles heading to and from Crown King. It is a fun and scenic trail into the cooler pines of the Bradshaws. <a href="../Main/History.asp">This trail was the first trip ever done by AzVJC.</a>
The trail takes off from the Castle Hotsprings Rd and travels through the foot hills and up the side of the mountain, giving nice views of Lake Pleasant and the Valley. There are some tougher optional sections that can make it interesting.
The trail goes through the old ghost towns of Fort Misery and Oro Belle, both of which are remnants of the Mining era of the Bradshaw Mountains. All that remains now, are foundations and a few crumbling walls. Fort Misery makes a nice place to stop and eat lunch as the small creek usually has running water and there are trees to provide shade.
In the winter months, the trail from Fort Misery through Oro Belle to Crown King will often have snow and/or ice. In the summer, an early start is necessary to stay ahead of the rising temperatures.
Once on top of the mountain, the trail runs through the cool pines and into Crown King. In Crown King there are places to eat and have a drink, and a general store that sells some excellent fudge.
There are campgrounds on top of the mountain near Crown King for those wishing to stay overnight. The fastest way down is via the main road which leads through Cleator and toward Bumble Bee. You can split off and go through Cordes Junction, which will get you to the Freeway quicker, or keep going strait and go through the little town of Bumble Bee.
Alternatively, you can take the Senator Highway toward Prescott or Mayer, this can be a very interesting trail during snow season. If you have the time, follow Towers Mountain rd through Crown King and up to the top of Towers Mountain, there are some excellent views and you can join back up with the Senator Highway afterward.
Have fun, remember to bring water and your camera.
Enjoy, and remember to TREAD Lightly!
http://www.azvjc.org/default.asp?A=1&ID=964
Click the link above To Add Your Name to the Sign Up List
Thank You,
- The AzVJC Website
88077 From: Casper <casper@c...>
Date: Wed Jul 23, 2003 11:15pm
Subject: Help/Reply
Hello Gang,
Recently I have had a few email responses telling me that in trying to send me an e-mail that they got an "error domain" type message. They could not send me any email due to my side having problems????? I have done all I know, and have found nothing wrong. Could I please ask you to try and send me a test email so as to confirm that the problem is not on my end.. I would appreciate this help very much.
Thank you in Advance,
Casper
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
88078 From: Kevin Gallagher <GIThunder81@c...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 1:29am
Subject: RE: Need Paint Work
Well that is the thing. Number one the guy is really inexpensive and he
does great work. I run a grocery store and have had a few incidents with
stockers hitting cars with carts and I have sent them over to Pete's
(Paint by Pete) and all of the customers said he did a great job. I am
sure If I can get enough people lined up he will hook me up. I was
stationed in Germany and I have contacts over there that are getting me
parts for pete so myselkf and him kinda made an arrangement. He does a
lot of custom work for a VW club out here and they are all happy. Let me
know what you7 need done Obviously the trailer let me know the
diomensions and I will talk to pete and see what I kin get fer ya.
Regardless of a group discount he is still really inexpensive but I will
work with him and see what I can get for you just give me the dimensions
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Hooven [mailto:whooven@c...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 11:59 PM
To: Kevin Gallagher
Subject: Re: [az_vjc] Need Paint Work
Kevin,
I need a 1/t ton offroad trailer painted, too. Not right away but within
the
next couple of months would be nice. If we're getting a group discount
of
some kind, I might be interested.
Thanks,
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Gallagher" <GIThunder81@c...>
To: "'Rob Williams'" <g_rob_williams@y...>
Cc: "Yahoo VJC Group" <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 11:18 PM
Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Need Paint Work
> I know a guy out here in buckeye, he does excellent work and very
cheap.
> I had him do some work for me and he charged 300 less than others
> wanted. If you want his name let me know. He needs some favors from me
> so I might be abloe to get a discount if other members of the AZVJC
are
> interested as well, let me know what you want done and I can get ya
and
> apprx price
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rob Williams [mailto:g_rob_williams@y...]
> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 3:25 PM
> To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Need Paint Work
>
> I need someone to touch up/fix some paint issues. Is there anyone in
> the club that can do this, or know where to go to have it done. I am
> pretty much just looking for a decent job at a good price. E-mail me
> off list if you can help me out. -Rob
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
88079 From: Casper <casper@c...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 2:36am
Subject: On board air compressor help?
Help! I was given a air compressor (12v DC), which is a Thomas air compressor. I have never set one up before. I was hoping that some of you could look at the specs for this compressor and tell me if it would work for an on board unit. Not necessary for a hard core unit, but just something to use to air up tires after trail runs...... I would really appreciate any help and suggestions you all could give me... I attached the specs........oops we can't do that anymore.....
Well here is the web address: http://www.thomaspumps.com/products/oem/pdf/315.pdf
it is the 315CDC56/12
Thank you,
Casper
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
88080 From: steven.campbell <steven.campbell@c...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 6:01am
Subject: Re: Help/Reply (Test email)
Okay, here is your test email.
Steven Campbell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Casper" <casper@c...>
To: <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 11:15 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Help/Reply
> Hello Gang,
> Recently I have had a few email responses telling me that in trying to
send me an e-mail that they got an "error domain" type message. They could
not send me any email due to my side having problems????? I have done all I
know, and have found nothing wrong. Could I please ask you to try and send
me a test email so as to confirm that the problem is not on my end.. I would
appreciate this help very much.
> Thank you in Advance,
>
> Casper
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
88081 From: TODD MCCULLEN <desertfab@m...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 6:05am
Subject: Az workshop
Chris,
With a attitude like this, is why we lose land to public use. It does not
matter if you are a individual user or part of a group. It does matter if
you let your self be heard. Do you think the greenies would be where they
are if they did not say anything and ignore thier issues. They are annoying
because thier numbers are so big.and they let themselfs be heard. Yes they
are on a mission, Maybe we as off-road users should be on a mission also, if
we are a individual user or part of a group.
Yes there is alot of politics involved, which I have no patiants for, but
that's the way it is. Personally I think we all should be more aggressive on
issues and not play the politics game. ( Ruffle certain key people
feathers.) I think if we ruffle more feathers the greenies will take a step
back, they do not take a step back now because people ignore them and they
get what they want. When we ignore them, the image is we do not care if we
lose our land so they win.
Todd
Message: 7
Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 22:51:40 -0700
From: "Chris Lindsey" <azrubi@a...>
Subject: RE: Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
Please don't misunderstand me... This is not an attack.
The reality is that the majority of "users" consider
themselves "individuals". They're not part of a group. They don't
consider themselves as a "Jeeper", "Quader", "Motorcyclist" or whatever.
They're people wanting to go out and have a good time and enjoy
the "outdoors".
"WE" are never going to make the "greenies" take a step back, cuz, they
don't give a sh!t about what "we" want. They're on a mission and we will
never be able to mount a united front to repel them by trying to assemble
people that are just trying to make a living and have a little fun.
So, I ignore them. And I ignore most of you. I know it doesn't seem to
make sense, but if I don't give them or you any special consideration,
then your point of view isn't relevant.
I'm putting on my asbestos underwear, as I assume I'm going to receive
some flames over this. But, the bottom line, in my mind, is that if you
don't take them serious, no one else will. Or, if I'm completely wrong,
we're screwed anyway as the only options and alternatives I've seen
coming out of the OHV community for the last 20 years is concessions. I
for one, am tired of giving "it" up to make other people feel like I'm a
nice guy.
My .02 YMMV
Take care,
Chris
__________________________________________________ _______________
Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
88082 From: nathanielaz <nathanielaz@y...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 6:11am
Subject: Re: Need Paint Work
I need a 93 Grand Cherokee limited (body cladding is painted)
repainted from white with some chipping to orange
Nathaniel
--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin Gallagher" <GIThunder81@c...>
wrote:
> Well that is the thing. Number one the guy is really inexpensive
and he
> does great work. I run a grocery store and have had a few
incidents with
> stockers hitting cars with carts and I have sent them over to
Pete's
> (Paint by Pete) and all of the customers said he did a great job.
I am
> sure If I can get enough people lined up he will hook me up. I was
> stationed in Germany and I have contacts over there that are
getting me
> parts for pete so myselkf and him kinda made an arrangement. He
does a
> lot of custom work for a VW club out here and they are all happy.
Let me
> know what you7 need done Obviously the trailer let me know the
> diomensions and I will talk to pete and see what I kin get fer ya.
> Regardless of a group discount he is still really inexpensive but
I will
> work with him and see what I can get for you just give me the
dimensions
>
> >
88083 From: Paul Tenniswood <rockjeep76@y...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 6:37am
Subject: Saturday wheeling???
Hello all... is there anyone that would like to wheel in the Florance
area on saturday...Vince, Steve, and I are probably going to abandon
the Axle Alley run but are undecided on where to run from there...
any suggestions please e-mail me... thank you
Paul 76 CJ
88084 From: Daver <daver@i...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 7:04am
Subject: RE: Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
Not a flame, but a couple comments...
I'm not sure what your point is here. You discuss seeing 20 years of
"concessions." Meaning closures. If you have seen these 20 years of
closures occur, how can you help but to take them seriously? The vast
majority of this was not "conceded" or "comprised" to closure...it was just
_closed_, one way or another. Some of it was fought for, some of it went
quietly. I have been involved in off road motorized recreation for 25 years
now, and I have yet to see something "open up." Just fewer places to ride.
More closures. Not concessions, not compromises, just closures, plain and
simple. I fail to see how ignoring closures will help reduce them. Ignoring
them will engender more, not less. You can "don't take them serious," but
I'll tell you what, when there are no more places left to ride, then their
point of view will be "relevant" to you, and serious as a heart attack.
Plus, FYI, I'm not a nice guy about this. Neither are most of the people
that I've met in relation to land use issues over the years. Nice guys
finish last. Maybe you are not interested in fighting them, for various
reasons. I can respect that, and don't have a lot of problem with it. Some
people do. Failing to see that _someone_ needs to fight them is your error.
Unfortunately what happens when we "don't take them serious" is _NOT_ that
"no one else will." History shows us that what happens when we "don't take
them serious" is that land closes. Laws and regulations shift against those
of us that enjoy outdoor recreation. There are fewer places to ride, and
more regulations to obey in the places left. If the last 20 years doesn't
show you that, I'm not sure what can.
At 10:51 PM 7/23/2003 -0700, Chris Lindsey wrote:
>Please don't misunderstand me... This is not an attack.
>
>The reality is that the majority of "users" consider
>themselves "individuals". They're not part of a group. They don't
>consider themselves as a "Jeeper", "Quader", "Motorcyclist" or whatever.
>They're people wanting to go out and have a good time and enjoy
>the "outdoors".
>
>"WE" are never going to make the "greenies" take a step back, cuz, they
>don't give a sh!t about what "we" want. They're on a mission and we will
>never be able to mount a united front to repel them by trying to assemble
>people that are just trying to make a living and have a little fun.
>
>So, I ignore them. And I ignore most of you. I know it doesn't seem to
>make sense, but if I don't give them or you any special consideration,
>then your point of view isn't relevant.
>
>I'm putting on my asbestos underwear, as I assume I'm going to receive
>some flames over this. But, the bottom line, in my mind, is that if you
>don't take them serious, no one else will. Or, if I'm completely wrong,
>we're screwed anyway as the only options and alternatives I've seen
>coming out of the OHV community for the last 20 years is concessions. I
>for one, am tired of giving "it" up to make other people feel like I'm a
>nice guy.
>
>My .02 YMMV
>
>Take care,
>Chris
> >>>----------------------->
>Christopher Lindsey
>Union Planters Mortgage
>8700 E. Via de Ventura
>Suite 150
>Scottsdale, AZ 85258
>http://www.ChrisLindsey.com
>480-951-1422 Ext. 300 Main
>623-742-9911 FAX Direct
>602-577-5988 Cell
> >>>------------------------>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: "Hackle" <hackle@q...>
>To: "tomas2691" <tomasr@a...>, az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
>Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 17:12:56 -0700
>Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
>
> > Roger you are missing a large part of the group that will help us
> > while we
> > help them. Last time I checked not everyone that is into OHV drives a
> > 4-wheel drive. If we rely on only 4 wheel drive owners we are screwed.
> > OHV
> > covers all the Quads, Motorcycles, buggies, bronco's, Toys, Suzuki,
> > sand,
> > mud, plus the numerous other SUV's that at least camp. These are the
> > type of
> > numbers we need to get involved to start making the greenies take a
> > step
> > back. This is what I mean by one voice and a larger community. Jim F.
> >
> > "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member"
> > Groucho
> > Marx
> > Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: tomas2691 [mailto:tomasr@a...]
> > Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 4:01 PM
> > To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
> >
> >
> > Any idea how this "organization" would relate to the ASA4WDC? I
> > though the ASA4WDC was going to try to become that single, state-wide
> > voice. Am I missing something?
> >
> > -Roger
> >
> > --- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "Hackle" <hackle@q...> wrote:
> > > I have sent my registration in (again) This is well worth
> > your time on a
> > > weekend. If we get a good organization set up the entire OHV
> > community would
> > > speak with one voice and have the numbers behind it to make it
> > stick. I urge
> > > everyone that gets involved in the Land Use Meetings and even those
> > that do
> > > not to join in. I do not know how to make everyone understand how
> > important
> > > this could be if we put in the effort to get it started. OK off the
> > soap
> > > box. Jim F. aka Hackle
> > >
> > > "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member"
> > Groucho
> > > Marx
> > > Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> > > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
----------
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.502 / Virus Database: 300 - Release Date: 7/18/2003
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
88085 From: Dan Dennis <dannpegg@c...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 7:39am
Subject: Re: Which is better YJ or TJ AC
Correct me if I'm wrong, guys and gals...
If I remember correctly, YJs only blow at your feet (at least early
YJs do). TJs have dash vents, as well as the floor vents. It's a huge
difference here in AZ. I'd suggest a TJ with a six cylinder.
AZ Treadhead (AKA BRUZR's Daddy)
97 TJ with A/C (BRUZR) in Lake Havasu City, AZ
--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "bk83gold" <bk83@j...> wrote:
> I am looking at buying a nother jeep and I want to know if there is
a
> real difference in the YJ and TJ ac. I know the TJ is an overall
> better jeep but I have heard that the TJ's air is as good as a
car's
> ac. Is there any truth to this, or are people just talking bull.
>
> Thanks guys happy wheeling,
> Brandon
88086 From: FredTJ <fredtj@c...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 8:00am
Subject: Re: Re: Which is better YJ or TJ AC
Rob, you may wish you have the A/C in your Jeep checked..
Not only do I have a soft top, but I also have the Bestop 2 piece soft
doors, that really, really leak..
Even with the windows only 2/3's zipped up, I seldom have to turn the A/C
above the low setting, just sometimes going to the middle setting.. On the
highest setting, mine will almost produce ice inside ;)
'98 TJ, BTW.
Best,
Fred
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Williams" <g_rob_williams@y...>
To: <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 10:09 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Which is better YJ or TJ AC
> The AC works pretty well in a TJ with the soft top. In the summer
> you can make it comfortable, but I have found that it isn't near as
> good as a car. In a car, after 15 minutes or so you can turn the air
> down to the lower settings, but the TJ you need to keep it on hi.
> Makes sense though since you are loosing your cold air through the
> fabric and zippers. If you have to choose... I second the TJ with a
> D44 rear. -Rob
>
>
> --- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "bk83gold" <bk83@j...> wrote:
> > I am looking at buying a nother jeep and I want to know if there
> is a
> > real difference in the YJ and TJ ac. I know the TJ is an overall
> > better jeep but I have heard that the TJ's air is as good as a
> car's
> > ac. Is there any truth to this, or are people just talking bull.
> >
> > Thanks guys happy wheeling,
> > Brandon
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
88087 From: Chris Lindsey <azrubi@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 9:48am
Subject: Re: Az workshop
Hi Todd,
I can't necessarily disagree with you completely. But, if you'd like to
show up at their meetings and instead of providing them a "sea" of red
shirts that legitimize their position, they saw a "sea" of OHVs, campers,
bikers, etc. all standing outside in the parking lot with pitch forks.
I'd be happy to attend, and I believe it would have a much bigger and
more benificial (for us) impact. :-)
Take care,
Chris
>>>----------------------->
Christopher Lindsey
Union Planters Mortgage
8700 E. Via de Ventura
Suite 150
Scottsdale, AZ 85258
http://www.ChrisLindsey.com
480-951-1422 Ext. 300 Main
623-742-9911 FAX Direct
602-577-5988 Cell
>>>------------------------>
-----Original Message-----
From: "TODD MCCULLEN" <desertfab@m...>
To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2003 13:05:20 +0000
Subject: [az_vjc] Az workshop
> Chris,
>
> With a attitude like this, is why we lose land to public use. It does
> not
> matter if you are a individual user or part of a group. It does matter
> if
> you let your self be heard. Do you think the greenies would be where
> they
> are if they did not say anything and ignore thier issues. They are
> annoying
> because thier numbers are so big.and they let themselfs be heard. Yes
> they
> are on a mission, Maybe we as off-road users should be on a mission
> also, if
> we are a individual user or part of a group.
> Yes there is alot of politics involved, which I have no patiants for,
> but
> that's the way it is. Personally I think we all should be more
> aggressive on
> issues and not play the politics game. ( Ruffle certain key people
> feathers.) I think if we ruffle more feathers the greenies will take a
> step
> back, they do not take a step back now because people ignore them and
> they
> get what they want. When we ignore them, the image is we do not care if
> we
> lose our land so they win.
>
> Todd
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 22:51:40 -0700
> From: "Chris Lindsey" <azrubi@a...>
> Subject: RE: Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
>
> Please don't misunderstand me... This is not an attack.
>
> The reality is that the majority of "users" consider
> themselves "individuals". They're not part of a group. They don't
> consider themselves as a "Jeeper", "Quader", "Motorcyclist" or
> whatever.
> They're people wanting to go out and have a good time and enjoy
> the "outdoors".
>
> "WE" are never going to make the "greenies" take a step back, cuz, they
> don't give a sh!t about what "we" want. They're on a mission and we
> will
> never be able to mount a united front to repel them by trying to
> assemble
> people that are just trying to make a living and have a little fun.
>
> So, I ignore them. And I ignore most of you. I know it doesn't seem
> to
> make sense, but if I don't give them or you any special consideration,
> then your point of view isn't relevant.
>
> I'm putting on my asbestos underwear, as I assume I'm going to receive
> some flames over this. But, the bottom line, in my mind, is that if
> you
> don't take them serious, no one else will. Or, if I'm completely
> wrong,
> we're screwed anyway as the only options and alternatives I've seen
> coming out of the OHV community for the last 20 years is concessions.
> I
> for one, am tired of giving "it" up to make other people feel like I'm
> a
> nice guy.
>
> My .02 YMMV
>
> Take care,
> Chris
>
> __________________________________________________ _______________
> Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
88088 From: DesertJeep <joey@d...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 9:50am
Subject: RE: Crown King run Options
To those camping prepare for monsoon rains. It can pour 5" of rain in an
hour up there and really get things wet.
Joey K
93YJ
-----Original Message-----
From: Hackle [mailto:hackle@q...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 3:42 PM
To: DesertJeep; az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Crown King run Options
Joey many of our group the RockRats are taking the kids (yes
Storm is
going) and camping out. We may even return down the same trail on
Sunday.
Jim F.
"I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member" Groucho
Marx
Member of the original dirty half dozen.
http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
-----Original Message-----
From: DesertJeep [mailto:joey@d...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 3:34 PM
To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Crown King run Options
Anyone thought about taking a run with their children?
Is anyone camping overnight?
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
88089 From: Bill Warner <wwarner@d...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:13am
Subject: Re: Re: Rubicon or sport
On Wed, 2003-07-23 at 17:50, Kent Warner wrote:
> That's true, but she wouldn't need a lift. But can she lock up front
> and back at the flip of a switch?
nope just once a month
>
> KurtASinger wrote:
>
> >If you think maintaining a jeep is bad...Think what it would take to
> >keep her happy?
> >
> >
> >--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "BADAZXJ XJArizona" <BadAZXJ@m...>
> >wrote:
> >
> >
> >>I will trade my jeep for angelina jolie....straight across...... :)
> >>
> >>
> >>Frank
> >>http://groups.msn.com/BadAzXJ
> >>http://groups.msn.com/badazxj/arizonaundertakers.msnw
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>From: "rbales77" <rbales77@y...>
> >>>To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> >>>Subject: [az_vjc] Rubicon or sport
> >>>Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 17:19:00 -0000
> >>>
> >>>I have to agree that if the Jeep came with Lora Croft I would have
> >>>
> >>>
> >to
> >
> >
> >>>buy that one to. The big question is. Is it better to get a Jeep
> >>>that has no upgrades on it or to get a Rubicon which has everything
> >>>that I would get. The only thing that I would think about changing
> >>>is the lift. Any suggestions
> >>>
> >>>Rob
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> >>>
> >>>
> >http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >>>
> >>>
> >>__________________________________________________ _______________
> >>Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE*
> >>http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
--
Bill Warner <wwarner@d...>
Direct Alliance
88090 From: Chris Lindsey <azrubi@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:15am
Subject: RE: Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
Hi Daver,
I understand what you're saying. But, I believe you've made my point.
It doesn't matter what we say or do, they close the areas anyway. Our
participation in the process only legitimizes their actions.
They "accepted" public comment. The had "open" forums. The "people"
were represented in the decision making process. The outcome? Exactly
what they intended in the first place.
I'm going to back off this thread, as it's not my intent to rain on
anyone else's parade. With our years of involvement in this, we've just
drawn different conclusions. I appreciate yours and the positions of
others that fight the good fight.
I'm sure within this group there have been hundreds of thousands of man
hours expended on this issue. I commend all of the individuals that
pursue it. I don't want to advocate any change in others positions. I
just "vented" my frustration and stated my point of view. I'm just tired
of the people I pay to cut my lawn, telling me to keep off the grass.
Sorry for the noise.
Best wishes,
Chris
>>>----------------------->
Christopher Lindsey
Union Planters Mortgage
8700 E. Via de Ventura
Suite 150
Scottsdale, AZ 85258
http://www.ChrisLindsey.com
480-951-1422 Ext. 300 Main
623-742-9911 FAX Direct
602-577-5988 Cell
>>>------------------------>
-----Original Message-----
From: Daver <daver@I...>
To: "Chris Lindsey" <azrubi@a...>,"Hackle"
<hackle@q...>, "tomas2691" <tomasr@a...>,az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2003 07:04:11 -0700
Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
> Not a flame, but a couple comments...
>
> I'm not sure what your point is here. You discuss seeing 20 years of
> "concessions." Meaning closures. If you have seen these 20 years of
> closures occur, how can you help but to take them seriously? The vast
> majority of this was not "conceded" or "comprised" to closure...it was
> just
> _closed_, one way or another. Some of it was fought for, some of it
> went
> quietly. I have been involved in off road motorized recreation for 25
> years
> now, and I have yet to see something "open up." Just fewer places to
> ride.
> More closures. Not concessions, not compromises, just closures, plain
> and
> simple. I fail to see how ignoring closures will help reduce them.
> Ignoring
> them will engender more, not less. You can "don't take them serious,"
> but
> I'll tell you what, when there are no more places left to ride, then
> their
> point of view will be "relevant" to you, and serious as a heart attack.
>
> Plus, FYI, I'm not a nice guy about this. Neither are most of the
> people
> that I've met in relation to land use issues over the years. Nice guys
> finish last. Maybe you are not interested in fighting them, for various
> reasons. I can respect that, and don't have a lot of problem with it.
> Some
> people do. Failing to see that _someone_ needs to fight them is your
> error.
> Unfortunately what happens when we "don't take them serious" is _NOT_
> that
> "no one else will." History shows us that what happens when we "don't
> take
> them serious" is that land closes. Laws and regulations shift against
> those
> of us that enjoy outdoor recreation. There are fewer places to ride,
> and
> more regulations to obey in the places left. If the last 20 years
> doesn't
> show you that, I'm not sure what can.
>
> At 10:51 PM 7/23/2003 -0700, Chris Lindsey wrote:
>
> >Please don't misunderstand me... This is not an attack.
> >
> >The reality is that the majority of "users" consider
> >themselves "individuals". They're not part of a group. They don't
> >consider themselves as a "Jeeper", "Quader", "Motorcyclist" or
> whatever.
> >They're people wanting to go out and have a good time and enjoy
> >the "outdoors".
> >
> >"WE" are never going to make the "greenies" take a step back, cuz,
> they
> >don't give a sh!t about what "we" want. They're on a mission and we
> will
> >never be able to mount a united front to repel them by trying to
> assemble
> >people that are just trying to make a living and have a little fun.
> >
> >So, I ignore them. And I ignore most of you. I know it doesn't seem
> to
> >make sense, but if I don't give them or you any special consideration,
> >then your point of view isn't relevant.
> >
> >I'm putting on my asbestos underwear, as I assume I'm going to receive
> >some flames over this. But, the bottom line, in my mind, is that if
> you
> >don't take them serious, no one else will. Or, if I'm completely
> wrong,
> >we're screwed anyway as the only options and alternatives I've seen
> >coming out of the OHV community for the last 20 years is concessions.
> I
> >for one, am tired of giving "it" up to make other people feel like I'm
> a
> >nice guy.
> >
> >My .02 YMMV
> >
> >Take care,
> >Chris
> > >>>----------------------->
> >Christopher Lindsey
> >Union Planters Mortgage
> >8700 E. Via de Ventura
> >Suite 150
> >Scottsdale, AZ 85258
> >http://www.ChrisLindsey.com
> >480-951-1422 Ext. 300 Main
> >623-742-9911 FAX Direct
> >602-577-5988 Cell
> > >>>------------------------>
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: "Hackle" <hackle@q...>
> >To: "tomas2691" <tomasr@a...>, az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> >Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 17:12:56 -0700
> >Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
> >
> > > Roger you are missing a large part of the group that will
> help us
> > > while we
> > > help them. Last time I checked not everyone that is into OHV drives
> a
> > > 4-wheel drive. If we rely on only 4 wheel drive owners we are
> screwed.
> > > OHV
> > > covers all the Quads, Motorcycles, buggies, bronco's, Toys, Suzuki,
> > > sand,
> > > mud, plus the numerous other SUV's that at least camp. These are
> the
> > > type of
> > > numbers we need to get involved to start making the greenies take a
> > > step
> > > back. This is what I mean by one voice and a larger community. Jim
> F.
> > >
> > > "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member"
> > > Groucho
> > > Marx
> > > Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> > > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: tomas2691 [mailto:tomasr@a...]
> > > Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 4:01 PM
> > > To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
> > >
> > >
> > > Any idea how this "organization" would relate to the ASA4WDC? I
> > > though the ASA4WDC was going to try to become that single,
> state-wide
> > > voice. Am I missing something?
> > >
> > > -Roger
> > >
> > > --- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "Hackle" <hackle@q...> wrote:
> > > > I have sent my registration in (again) This is well worth
> > > your time on a
> > > > weekend. If we get a good organization set up the entire OHV
> > > community would
> > > > speak with one voice and have the numbers behind it to make it
> > > stick. I urge
> > > > everyone that gets involved in the Land Use Meetings and even
> those
> > > that do
> > > > not to join in. I do not know how to make everyone understand how
> > > important
> > > > this could be if we put in the effort to get it started. OK off
> the
> > > soap
> > > > box. Jim F. aka Hackle
> > > >
> > > > "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member"
> > > Groucho
> > > > Marx
> > > > Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> > > > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
>
88091 From: Craig Micek <micekc@e...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:15am
Subject: Re: On board air compressor help?
It looks like the output is really low. It would take you quite a while to
fill a tire at .5 cfm. You would probably burn it up. ( I didn't see any
duty cycle info.
Craig
----- Original Message -----
From: "Casper" <casper@c...>
To: <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2003 2:36 AM
Subject: [az_vjc] On board air compressor help?
> Help! I was given a air compressor (12v DC), which is a Thomas air
compressor. I have never set one up before. I was hoping that some of you
could look at the specs for this compressor and tell me if it would work
for an on board unit. Not necessary for a hard core unit, but just something
to use to air up tires after trail runs...... I would really appreciate any
help and suggestions you all could give me... I attached the
specs........oops we can't do that anymore.....
> Well here is the web address:
http://www.thomaspumps.com/products/oem/pdf/315.pdf
> it is the 315CDC56/12
>
> Thank you,
> Casper
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
88092 From: Craig Micek <micekc@e...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:23am
Subject: Re: On board air compressor help?
Whoops, duty cycle was there. 25% 10 minutes on and 30 minutes off. I
would say it will not work for very long.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig Micek" <micekc@e...>
To: "Casper" <casper@c...>; <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2003 10:15 AM
Subject: Re: [az_vjc] On board air compressor help?
> It looks like the output is really low. It would take you quite a while
to
> fill a tire at .5 cfm. You would probably burn it up. ( I didn't see
any
> duty cycle info.
>
> Craig
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Casper" <casper@c...>
> To: <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2003 2:36 AM
> Subject: [az_vjc] On board air compressor help?
>
>
> > Help! I was given a air compressor (12v DC), which is a Thomas air
> compressor. I have never set one up before. I was hoping that some of you
> could look at the specs for this compressor and tell me if it would work
> for an on board unit. Not necessary for a hard core unit, but just
something
> to use to air up tires after trail runs...... I would really appreciate
any
> help and suggestions you all could give me... I attached the
> specs........oops we can't do that anymore.....
> > Well here is the web address:
> http://www.thomaspumps.com/products/oem/pdf/315.pdf
> > it is the 315CDC56/12
> >
> > Thank you,
> > Casper
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
88093 From: JimSerio <jim@r...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:27am
Subject: Extended Warranties
I'm in the process of buying an extended warranty for my 2001 XJ. It
has 33K on it and a little under a year left on the original 3/36
warranty. I was considering buying on the Intertnet and so far have
found 2 places that offer the 7/100 ($50 deductable) for $2550. That
includes the additional charges for 4x4 and mileage/age of the
vehicle.
I decided I would call the local 5 star dealerships to see what
their cost was (read on Google Groups that someone did this in AZ a
few years ago). Only Pitre was willing to share his costs (and faxed
them to me). Howevere, even they seem high. It's 2K for the 7/100/
$50 plus $100 each for 4x4 and over/under 24/36 mileage. Plus he
added a $100 over that. So $2400. This seems a little high having
researched warranties on Google Groups. I recall many buying them
for around $900-$1600 (Maximum care.. same one as I'm looking at).
Does anyone here know if these costs are about right? I'm tempted to
give me business to Pitre as the guy there (Joe) was pretty nice. He
said they they don't go for profit on the warranties, but customer
loyalty. I just want to make sure this is a good price.
Any advice or info would be appreciated.
Jim
88094 From: JimSerio <jim@r...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:30am
Subject: Dealership maintnence
Has anyone taken their Jeeps to any of the local dealers for the 30K
tune-up? What's the cost run on this and what does it include? I'm
leaning toward Darner since they get such good marks from this
group, but if anyone else has recommendations, I'd appreciate it.
BTW... I'm considering a dealer as opposed to a mom/pop shop as I've
read that some warranty work may require proof of regular
maintenence. Who better to have those records than a dealer.
Jim
88095 From: tomas2691 <tomasr@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:31am
Subject: Re: Which is better YJ or TJ AC
The TJ's A/C is much better than the YJ's A/C. The YJ's only came
with under-dash units that don't blow as much air as the TJ system
does.
-Roger
--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "bk83gold" <bk83@j...> wrote:
> I am looking at buying a nother jeep and I want to know if there is
a
> real difference in the YJ and TJ ac. I know the TJ is an overall
> better jeep but I have heard that the TJ's air is as good as a
car's
> ac. Is there any truth to this, or are people just talking bull.
>
> Thanks guys happy wheeling,
> Brandon
88096 From: tomas2691 <tomasr@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:40am
Subject: Re: Which is better YJ or TJ AC
I agree with most of what Doug said. However, I'll disagree with his
rationale for picking a 95 over other years. In my opinion, the fact
that the 95's came with 297 u-joints is relatively insignificant
because the axles that take those u-joints can be had new for about
$135 a side and they are completely interchangeable with the shafts
that take the smaller 260 u-joints.
The more important criteria - in my opinion - for selecting certain
years is the motors and trannies. The early YJ's came with
carbeurated 4.2L motors and Peugot trannies. Some also came with a
different t-case (207?). These are the ones to stay away from. What
you really want in a YJ is the 91 and later which gets you the fuel
injected 4.0HO motor and the AX15 tranny (and NP231 t-case). It also
gets you the later style roll cage which is good if you have
passengers in the rear seat.
-Roger
--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "DougB" <azjeep@c...> wrote:
> YJ's 94 and older have 260 axle joints (weak), whereas the 95 YJ
and all
> TJ's have 297 joints, which are much stronger. Also, most (if not
all YJ's)
> have the D35c rear axle. TJ's also have this axle, but also come
(as an
> option) w/ D44's.
>
> TJ's have a better ride (IMO) than YJ's, however, YJ's are easier
and
> cheaper to do axle upgrades.
>
> Both are extremely capable offroad.
>
> If interested in a YJ, I'd look at 95's.
>
> If interested in a TJ, get one with a D44.
>
> Doug
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "bk83gold" <bk83@j...>
> To: <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 9:50 PM
> Subject: [az_vjc] Which is better YJ or TJ AC
>
>
> > I am looking at buying a nother jeep and I want to know if there
is a
> > real difference in the YJ and TJ ac. I know the TJ is an overall
> > better jeep but I have heard that the TJ's air is as good as a
car's
> > ac. Is there any truth to this, or are people just talking bull.
> >
> > Thanks guys happy wheeling,
> > Brandon
88097 From: tomas2691 <tomasr@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:47am
Subject: Re: Crown King run Options
You mean like last year when I only had a bikini top on my Jeep?
(Good thing I had packed a tarp.)
-Roger
--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "DesertJeep" <joey@d...> wrote:
> To those camping prepare for monsoon rains. It can pour 5" of
> rain in an hour up there and really get things wet.
88098 From: Roger Tomas <tomasr@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 11:06am
Subject: Re: Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
Jim,
Thanks for the comments. I seem to recall reading something about the
ASA4WDC expanding to include quads, motorcycles, etc. based on
discussions at one of their latest meetings. That's why I asked my
question. But Sandee's point about the difficulty of pulling off something
like this with just volunteers is well-taken. Hopefully the NOHVCC will
be successful.
-Roger
Hackle wrote:
> Roger you are missing a large part of the group that will help us while we
> help them. Last time I checked not everyone that is into OHV drives a
> 4-wheel drive. If we rely on only 4 wheel drive owners we are screwed. OHV
> covers all the Quads, Motorcycles, buggies, bronco's, Toys, Suzuki, sand,
> mud, plus the numerous other SUV's that at least camp. These are the type of
> numbers we need to get involved to start making the greenies take a step
> back. This is what I mean by one voice and a larger community. Jim F.
>
> "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member" Groucho
> Marx
> Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tomas2691 [mailto:tomasr@a...]
> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 4:01 PM
> To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
>
> Any idea how this "organization" would relate to the ASA4WDC? I
> though the ASA4WDC was going to try to become that single, state-wide
> voice. Am I missing something?
>
> -Roger
>
> --- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "Hackle" <hackle@q...> wrote:
> > I have sent my registration in (again) This is well worth
> your time on a
> > weekend. If we get a good organization set up the entire OHV
> community would
> > speak with one voice and have the numbers behind it to make it
> stick. I urge
> > everyone that gets involved in the Land Use Meetings and even those
> that do
> > not to join in. I do not know how to make everyone understand how
> important
> > this could be if we put in the effort to get it started. OK off the
> soap
> > box. Jim F. aka Hackle
> >
> > "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member"
> Groucho
> > Marx
> > Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
88074 From: Kevin Gallagher <GIThunder81@c...>
Date: Wed Jul 23, 2003 11:08pm
Subject: RE: Rubicon or sport
If you have the money then I would get the Rubicon. Dana 44 front and
rear and lockers already installed. However if you do go sport buy one
from someone selling it privately this way you don't have to pay sales
tax and things like that. You figure lockers front and rear on a
wrangler sport with a 44 in the rear is going to run you over 2 grand
with installation and maybe even more. And with the Rubicon you get the
extra bonus of having a 44 in the front as well. Just a thought........
-----Original Message-----
From: rbales77 [mailto:rbales77@y...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 10:19 AM
To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Rubicon or sport
I have to agree that if the Jeep came with Lora Croft I would have to
buy that one to. The big question is. Is it better to get a Jeep
that has no upgrades on it or to get a Rubicon which has everything
that I would get. The only thing that I would think about changing
is the lift. Any suggestions
Rob
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ADVERTISEMENT
88075 From: Kevin Gallagher <GIThunder81@c...>
Date: Wed Jul 23, 2003 11:18pm
Subject: RE: Need Paint Work
I know a guy out here in buckeye, he does excellent work and very cheap.
I had him do some work for me and he charged 300 less than others
wanted. If you want his name let me know. He needs some favors from me
so I might be abloe to get a discount if other members of the AZVJC are
interested as well, let me know what you want done and I can get ya and
apprx price
-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Williams [mailto:g_rob_williams@y...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 3:25 PM
To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Need Paint Work
I need someone to touch up/fix some paint issues. Is there anyone in
the club that can do this, or know where to go to have it done. I am
pretty much just looking for a decent job at a good price. E-mail me
off list if you can help me out. -Rob
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
88076 From: AzVJC Website <azvjc@a...>
Date: Wed Jul 23, 2003 11:37pm
Subject: [TR] Lake Pleasant to Crown King - Saturday, August 16, 2003
Hello All,Kevin Carr is leading a Lake Pleasant to Crown King trail run on Saturday, August 16, 2003.<br><br>When: Saturday, August 16, 10AM
Where: Meet at S.E. Corner of Carefree Highway and I-17 by 10AM.
Rating: 3.0-
Length: All Day or Stay Over
CB Channel:
Some of us in our group will be staying over to camp out on top of the mountains under the stars and may run the trail backwards on Sunday.
The Lake Pleasang to Crown King trail is a local favorite. On any given weekend, there will be numerous groups of four wheelers, ATV's and motorcycles heading to and from Crown King. It is a fun and scenic trail into the cooler pines of the Bradshaws. <a href="../Main/History.asp">This trail was the first trip ever done by AzVJC.</a>
The trail takes off from the Castle Hotsprings Rd and travels through the foot hills and up the side of the mountain, giving nice views of Lake Pleasant and the Valley. There are some tougher optional sections that can make it interesting.
The trail goes through the old ghost towns of Fort Misery and Oro Belle, both of which are remnants of the Mining era of the Bradshaw Mountains. All that remains now, are foundations and a few crumbling walls. Fort Misery makes a nice place to stop and eat lunch as the small creek usually has running water and there are trees to provide shade.
In the winter months, the trail from Fort Misery through Oro Belle to Crown King will often have snow and/or ice. In the summer, an early start is necessary to stay ahead of the rising temperatures.
Once on top of the mountain, the trail runs through the cool pines and into Crown King. In Crown King there are places to eat and have a drink, and a general store that sells some excellent fudge.
There are campgrounds on top of the mountain near Crown King for those wishing to stay overnight. The fastest way down is via the main road which leads through Cleator and toward Bumble Bee. You can split off and go through Cordes Junction, which will get you to the Freeway quicker, or keep going strait and go through the little town of Bumble Bee.
Alternatively, you can take the Senator Highway toward Prescott or Mayer, this can be a very interesting trail during snow season. If you have the time, follow Towers Mountain rd through Crown King and up to the top of Towers Mountain, there are some excellent views and you can join back up with the Senator Highway afterward.
Have fun, remember to bring water and your camera.
Enjoy, and remember to TREAD Lightly!
http://www.azvjc.org/default.asp?A=1&ID=964
Click the link above To Add Your Name to the Sign Up List
Thank You,
- The AzVJC Website
88077 From: Casper <casper@c...>
Date: Wed Jul 23, 2003 11:15pm
Subject: Help/Reply
Hello Gang,
Recently I have had a few email responses telling me that in trying to send me an e-mail that they got an "error domain" type message. They could not send me any email due to my side having problems????? I have done all I know, and have found nothing wrong. Could I please ask you to try and send me a test email so as to confirm that the problem is not on my end.. I would appreciate this help very much.
Thank you in Advance,
Casper
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
88078 From: Kevin Gallagher <GIThunder81@c...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 1:29am
Subject: RE: Need Paint Work
Well that is the thing. Number one the guy is really inexpensive and he
does great work. I run a grocery store and have had a few incidents with
stockers hitting cars with carts and I have sent them over to Pete's
(Paint by Pete) and all of the customers said he did a great job. I am
sure If I can get enough people lined up he will hook me up. I was
stationed in Germany and I have contacts over there that are getting me
parts for pete so myselkf and him kinda made an arrangement. He does a
lot of custom work for a VW club out here and they are all happy. Let me
know what you7 need done Obviously the trailer let me know the
diomensions and I will talk to pete and see what I kin get fer ya.
Regardless of a group discount he is still really inexpensive but I will
work with him and see what I can get for you just give me the dimensions
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Hooven [mailto:whooven@c...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 11:59 PM
To: Kevin Gallagher
Subject: Re: [az_vjc] Need Paint Work
Kevin,
I need a 1/t ton offroad trailer painted, too. Not right away but within
the
next couple of months would be nice. If we're getting a group discount
of
some kind, I might be interested.
Thanks,
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Gallagher" <GIThunder81@c...>
To: "'Rob Williams'" <g_rob_williams@y...>
Cc: "Yahoo VJC Group" <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 11:18 PM
Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Need Paint Work
> I know a guy out here in buckeye, he does excellent work and very
cheap.
> I had him do some work for me and he charged 300 less than others
> wanted. If you want his name let me know. He needs some favors from me
> so I might be abloe to get a discount if other members of the AZVJC
are
> interested as well, let me know what you want done and I can get ya
and
> apprx price
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rob Williams [mailto:g_rob_williams@y...]
> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 3:25 PM
> To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Need Paint Work
>
> I need someone to touch up/fix some paint issues. Is there anyone in
> the club that can do this, or know where to go to have it done. I am
> pretty much just looking for a decent job at a good price. E-mail me
> off list if you can help me out. -Rob
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
88079 From: Casper <casper@c...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 2:36am
Subject: On board air compressor help?
Help! I was given a air compressor (12v DC), which is a Thomas air compressor. I have never set one up before. I was hoping that some of you could look at the specs for this compressor and tell me if it would work for an on board unit. Not necessary for a hard core unit, but just something to use to air up tires after trail runs...... I would really appreciate any help and suggestions you all could give me... I attached the specs........oops we can't do that anymore.....
Well here is the web address: http://www.thomaspumps.com/products/oem/pdf/315.pdf
it is the 315CDC56/12
Thank you,
Casper
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
88080 From: steven.campbell <steven.campbell@c...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 6:01am
Subject: Re: Help/Reply (Test email)
Okay, here is your test email.
Steven Campbell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Casper" <casper@c...>
To: <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 11:15 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Help/Reply
> Hello Gang,
> Recently I have had a few email responses telling me that in trying to
send me an e-mail that they got an "error domain" type message. They could
not send me any email due to my side having problems????? I have done all I
know, and have found nothing wrong. Could I please ask you to try and send
me a test email so as to confirm that the problem is not on my end.. I would
appreciate this help very much.
> Thank you in Advance,
>
> Casper
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
88081 From: TODD MCCULLEN <desertfab@m...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 6:05am
Subject: Az workshop
Chris,
With a attitude like this, is why we lose land to public use. It does not
matter if you are a individual user or part of a group. It does matter if
you let your self be heard. Do you think the greenies would be where they
are if they did not say anything and ignore thier issues. They are annoying
because thier numbers are so big.and they let themselfs be heard. Yes they
are on a mission, Maybe we as off-road users should be on a mission also, if
we are a individual user or part of a group.
Yes there is alot of politics involved, which I have no patiants for, but
that's the way it is. Personally I think we all should be more aggressive on
issues and not play the politics game. ( Ruffle certain key people
feathers.) I think if we ruffle more feathers the greenies will take a step
back, they do not take a step back now because people ignore them and they
get what they want. When we ignore them, the image is we do not care if we
lose our land so they win.
Todd
Message: 7
Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 22:51:40 -0700
From: "Chris Lindsey" <azrubi@a...>
Subject: RE: Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
Please don't misunderstand me... This is not an attack.
The reality is that the majority of "users" consider
themselves "individuals". They're not part of a group. They don't
consider themselves as a "Jeeper", "Quader", "Motorcyclist" or whatever.
They're people wanting to go out and have a good time and enjoy
the "outdoors".
"WE" are never going to make the "greenies" take a step back, cuz, they
don't give a sh!t about what "we" want. They're on a mission and we will
never be able to mount a united front to repel them by trying to assemble
people that are just trying to make a living and have a little fun.
So, I ignore them. And I ignore most of you. I know it doesn't seem to
make sense, but if I don't give them or you any special consideration,
then your point of view isn't relevant.
I'm putting on my asbestos underwear, as I assume I'm going to receive
some flames over this. But, the bottom line, in my mind, is that if you
don't take them serious, no one else will. Or, if I'm completely wrong,
we're screwed anyway as the only options and alternatives I've seen
coming out of the OHV community for the last 20 years is concessions. I
for one, am tired of giving "it" up to make other people feel like I'm a
nice guy.
My .02 YMMV
Take care,
Chris
__________________________________________________ _______________
Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
88082 From: nathanielaz <nathanielaz@y...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 6:11am
Subject: Re: Need Paint Work
I need a 93 Grand Cherokee limited (body cladding is painted)
repainted from white with some chipping to orange
Nathaniel
--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin Gallagher" <GIThunder81@c...>
wrote:
> Well that is the thing. Number one the guy is really inexpensive
and he
> does great work. I run a grocery store and have had a few
incidents with
> stockers hitting cars with carts and I have sent them over to
Pete's
> (Paint by Pete) and all of the customers said he did a great job.
I am
> sure If I can get enough people lined up he will hook me up. I was
> stationed in Germany and I have contacts over there that are
getting me
> parts for pete so myselkf and him kinda made an arrangement. He
does a
> lot of custom work for a VW club out here and they are all happy.
Let me
> know what you7 need done Obviously the trailer let me know the
> diomensions and I will talk to pete and see what I kin get fer ya.
> Regardless of a group discount he is still really inexpensive but
I will
> work with him and see what I can get for you just give me the
dimensions
>
> >
88083 From: Paul Tenniswood <rockjeep76@y...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 6:37am
Subject: Saturday wheeling???
Hello all... is there anyone that would like to wheel in the Florance
area on saturday...Vince, Steve, and I are probably going to abandon
the Axle Alley run but are undecided on where to run from there...
any suggestions please e-mail me... thank you
Paul 76 CJ
88084 From: Daver <daver@i...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 7:04am
Subject: RE: Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
Not a flame, but a couple comments...
I'm not sure what your point is here. You discuss seeing 20 years of
"concessions." Meaning closures. If you have seen these 20 years of
closures occur, how can you help but to take them seriously? The vast
majority of this was not "conceded" or "comprised" to closure...it was just
_closed_, one way or another. Some of it was fought for, some of it went
quietly. I have been involved in off road motorized recreation for 25 years
now, and I have yet to see something "open up." Just fewer places to ride.
More closures. Not concessions, not compromises, just closures, plain and
simple. I fail to see how ignoring closures will help reduce them. Ignoring
them will engender more, not less. You can "don't take them serious," but
I'll tell you what, when there are no more places left to ride, then their
point of view will be "relevant" to you, and serious as a heart attack.
Plus, FYI, I'm not a nice guy about this. Neither are most of the people
that I've met in relation to land use issues over the years. Nice guys
finish last. Maybe you are not interested in fighting them, for various
reasons. I can respect that, and don't have a lot of problem with it. Some
people do. Failing to see that _someone_ needs to fight them is your error.
Unfortunately what happens when we "don't take them serious" is _NOT_ that
"no one else will." History shows us that what happens when we "don't take
them serious" is that land closes. Laws and regulations shift against those
of us that enjoy outdoor recreation. There are fewer places to ride, and
more regulations to obey in the places left. If the last 20 years doesn't
show you that, I'm not sure what can.
At 10:51 PM 7/23/2003 -0700, Chris Lindsey wrote:
>Please don't misunderstand me... This is not an attack.
>
>The reality is that the majority of "users" consider
>themselves "individuals". They're not part of a group. They don't
>consider themselves as a "Jeeper", "Quader", "Motorcyclist" or whatever.
>They're people wanting to go out and have a good time and enjoy
>the "outdoors".
>
>"WE" are never going to make the "greenies" take a step back, cuz, they
>don't give a sh!t about what "we" want. They're on a mission and we will
>never be able to mount a united front to repel them by trying to assemble
>people that are just trying to make a living and have a little fun.
>
>So, I ignore them. And I ignore most of you. I know it doesn't seem to
>make sense, but if I don't give them or you any special consideration,
>then your point of view isn't relevant.
>
>I'm putting on my asbestos underwear, as I assume I'm going to receive
>some flames over this. But, the bottom line, in my mind, is that if you
>don't take them serious, no one else will. Or, if I'm completely wrong,
>we're screwed anyway as the only options and alternatives I've seen
>coming out of the OHV community for the last 20 years is concessions. I
>for one, am tired of giving "it" up to make other people feel like I'm a
>nice guy.
>
>My .02 YMMV
>
>Take care,
>Chris
> >>>----------------------->
>Christopher Lindsey
>Union Planters Mortgage
>8700 E. Via de Ventura
>Suite 150
>Scottsdale, AZ 85258
>http://www.ChrisLindsey.com
>480-951-1422 Ext. 300 Main
>623-742-9911 FAX Direct
>602-577-5988 Cell
> >>>------------------------>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: "Hackle" <hackle@q...>
>To: "tomas2691" <tomasr@a...>, az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
>Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 17:12:56 -0700
>Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
>
> > Roger you are missing a large part of the group that will help us
> > while we
> > help them. Last time I checked not everyone that is into OHV drives a
> > 4-wheel drive. If we rely on only 4 wheel drive owners we are screwed.
> > OHV
> > covers all the Quads, Motorcycles, buggies, bronco's, Toys, Suzuki,
> > sand,
> > mud, plus the numerous other SUV's that at least camp. These are the
> > type of
> > numbers we need to get involved to start making the greenies take a
> > step
> > back. This is what I mean by one voice and a larger community. Jim F.
> >
> > "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member"
> > Groucho
> > Marx
> > Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: tomas2691 [mailto:tomasr@a...]
> > Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 4:01 PM
> > To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
> >
> >
> > Any idea how this "organization" would relate to the ASA4WDC? I
> > though the ASA4WDC was going to try to become that single, state-wide
> > voice. Am I missing something?
> >
> > -Roger
> >
> > --- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "Hackle" <hackle@q...> wrote:
> > > I have sent my registration in (again) This is well worth
> > your time on a
> > > weekend. If we get a good organization set up the entire OHV
> > community would
> > > speak with one voice and have the numbers behind it to make it
> > stick. I urge
> > > everyone that gets involved in the Land Use Meetings and even those
> > that do
> > > not to join in. I do not know how to make everyone understand how
> > important
> > > this could be if we put in the effort to get it started. OK off the
> > soap
> > > box. Jim F. aka Hackle
> > >
> > > "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member"
> > Groucho
> > > Marx
> > > Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> > > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
----------
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.502 / Virus Database: 300 - Release Date: 7/18/2003
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
88085 From: Dan Dennis <dannpegg@c...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 7:39am
Subject: Re: Which is better YJ or TJ AC
Correct me if I'm wrong, guys and gals...
If I remember correctly, YJs only blow at your feet (at least early
YJs do). TJs have dash vents, as well as the floor vents. It's a huge
difference here in AZ. I'd suggest a TJ with a six cylinder.
AZ Treadhead (AKA BRUZR's Daddy)
97 TJ with A/C (BRUZR) in Lake Havasu City, AZ
--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "bk83gold" <bk83@j...> wrote:
> I am looking at buying a nother jeep and I want to know if there is
a
> real difference in the YJ and TJ ac. I know the TJ is an overall
> better jeep but I have heard that the TJ's air is as good as a
car's
> ac. Is there any truth to this, or are people just talking bull.
>
> Thanks guys happy wheeling,
> Brandon
88086 From: FredTJ <fredtj@c...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 8:00am
Subject: Re: Re: Which is better YJ or TJ AC
Rob, you may wish you have the A/C in your Jeep checked..
Not only do I have a soft top, but I also have the Bestop 2 piece soft
doors, that really, really leak..
Even with the windows only 2/3's zipped up, I seldom have to turn the A/C
above the low setting, just sometimes going to the middle setting.. On the
highest setting, mine will almost produce ice inside ;)
'98 TJ, BTW.
Best,
Fred
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Williams" <g_rob_williams@y...>
To: <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 10:09 PM
Subject: [az_vjc] Re: Which is better YJ or TJ AC
> The AC works pretty well in a TJ with the soft top. In the summer
> you can make it comfortable, but I have found that it isn't near as
> good as a car. In a car, after 15 minutes or so you can turn the air
> down to the lower settings, but the TJ you need to keep it on hi.
> Makes sense though since you are loosing your cold air through the
> fabric and zippers. If you have to choose... I second the TJ with a
> D44 rear. -Rob
>
>
> --- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "bk83gold" <bk83@j...> wrote:
> > I am looking at buying a nother jeep and I want to know if there
> is a
> > real difference in the YJ and TJ ac. I know the TJ is an overall
> > better jeep but I have heard that the TJ's air is as good as a
> car's
> > ac. Is there any truth to this, or are people just talking bull.
> >
> > Thanks guys happy wheeling,
> > Brandon
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
88087 From: Chris Lindsey <azrubi@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 9:48am
Subject: Re: Az workshop
Hi Todd,
I can't necessarily disagree with you completely. But, if you'd like to
show up at their meetings and instead of providing them a "sea" of red
shirts that legitimize their position, they saw a "sea" of OHVs, campers,
bikers, etc. all standing outside in the parking lot with pitch forks.
I'd be happy to attend, and I believe it would have a much bigger and
more benificial (for us) impact. :-)
Take care,
Chris
>>>----------------------->
Christopher Lindsey
Union Planters Mortgage
8700 E. Via de Ventura
Suite 150
Scottsdale, AZ 85258
http://www.ChrisLindsey.com
480-951-1422 Ext. 300 Main
623-742-9911 FAX Direct
602-577-5988 Cell
>>>------------------------>
-----Original Message-----
From: "TODD MCCULLEN" <desertfab@m...>
To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2003 13:05:20 +0000
Subject: [az_vjc] Az workshop
> Chris,
>
> With a attitude like this, is why we lose land to public use. It does
> not
> matter if you are a individual user or part of a group. It does matter
> if
> you let your self be heard. Do you think the greenies would be where
> they
> are if they did not say anything and ignore thier issues. They are
> annoying
> because thier numbers are so big.and they let themselfs be heard. Yes
> they
> are on a mission, Maybe we as off-road users should be on a mission
> also, if
> we are a individual user or part of a group.
> Yes there is alot of politics involved, which I have no patiants for,
> but
> that's the way it is. Personally I think we all should be more
> aggressive on
> issues and not play the politics game. ( Ruffle certain key people
> feathers.) I think if we ruffle more feathers the greenies will take a
> step
> back, they do not take a step back now because people ignore them and
> they
> get what they want. When we ignore them, the image is we do not care if
> we
> lose our land so they win.
>
> Todd
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 22:51:40 -0700
> From: "Chris Lindsey" <azrubi@a...>
> Subject: RE: Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
>
> Please don't misunderstand me... This is not an attack.
>
> The reality is that the majority of "users" consider
> themselves "individuals". They're not part of a group. They don't
> consider themselves as a "Jeeper", "Quader", "Motorcyclist" or
> whatever.
> They're people wanting to go out and have a good time and enjoy
> the "outdoors".
>
> "WE" are never going to make the "greenies" take a step back, cuz, they
> don't give a sh!t about what "we" want. They're on a mission and we
> will
> never be able to mount a united front to repel them by trying to
> assemble
> people that are just trying to make a living and have a little fun.
>
> So, I ignore them. And I ignore most of you. I know it doesn't seem
> to
> make sense, but if I don't give them or you any special consideration,
> then your point of view isn't relevant.
>
> I'm putting on my asbestos underwear, as I assume I'm going to receive
> some flames over this. But, the bottom line, in my mind, is that if
> you
> don't take them serious, no one else will. Or, if I'm completely
> wrong,
> we're screwed anyway as the only options and alternatives I've seen
> coming out of the OHV community for the last 20 years is concessions.
> I
> for one, am tired of giving "it" up to make other people feel like I'm
> a
> nice guy.
>
> My .02 YMMV
>
> Take care,
> Chris
>
> __________________________________________________ _______________
> Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
88088 From: DesertJeep <joey@d...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 9:50am
Subject: RE: Crown King run Options
To those camping prepare for monsoon rains. It can pour 5" of rain in an
hour up there and really get things wet.
Joey K
93YJ
-----Original Message-----
From: Hackle [mailto:hackle@q...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 3:42 PM
To: DesertJeep; az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Crown King run Options
Joey many of our group the RockRats are taking the kids (yes
Storm is
going) and camping out. We may even return down the same trail on
Sunday.
Jim F.
"I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member" Groucho
Marx
Member of the original dirty half dozen.
http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
-----Original Message-----
From: DesertJeep [mailto:joey@d...]
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 3:34 PM
To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [az_vjc] Crown King run Options
Anyone thought about taking a run with their children?
Is anyone camping overnight?
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
88089 From: Bill Warner <wwarner@d...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:13am
Subject: Re: Re: Rubicon or sport
On Wed, 2003-07-23 at 17:50, Kent Warner wrote:
> That's true, but she wouldn't need a lift. But can she lock up front
> and back at the flip of a switch?
nope just once a month
>
> KurtASinger wrote:
>
> >If you think maintaining a jeep is bad...Think what it would take to
> >keep her happy?
> >
> >
> >--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "BADAZXJ XJArizona" <BadAZXJ@m...>
> >wrote:
> >
> >
> >>I will trade my jeep for angelina jolie....straight across...... :)
> >>
> >>
> >>Frank
> >>http://groups.msn.com/BadAzXJ
> >>http://groups.msn.com/badazxj/arizonaundertakers.msnw
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>From: "rbales77" <rbales77@y...>
> >>>To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> >>>Subject: [az_vjc] Rubicon or sport
> >>>Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 17:19:00 -0000
> >>>
> >>>I have to agree that if the Jeep came with Lora Croft I would have
> >>>
> >>>
> >to
> >
> >
> >>>buy that one to. The big question is. Is it better to get a Jeep
> >>>that has no upgrades on it or to get a Rubicon which has everything
> >>>that I would get. The only thing that I would think about changing
> >>>is the lift. Any suggestions
> >>>
> >>>Rob
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> >>>
> >>>
> >http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >>>
> >>>
> >>__________________________________________________ _______________
> >>Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE*
> >>http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
--
Bill Warner <wwarner@d...>
Direct Alliance
88090 From: Chris Lindsey <azrubi@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:15am
Subject: RE: Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
Hi Daver,
I understand what you're saying. But, I believe you've made my point.
It doesn't matter what we say or do, they close the areas anyway. Our
participation in the process only legitimizes their actions.
They "accepted" public comment. The had "open" forums. The "people"
were represented in the decision making process. The outcome? Exactly
what they intended in the first place.
I'm going to back off this thread, as it's not my intent to rain on
anyone else's parade. With our years of involvement in this, we've just
drawn different conclusions. I appreciate yours and the positions of
others that fight the good fight.
I'm sure within this group there have been hundreds of thousands of man
hours expended on this issue. I commend all of the individuals that
pursue it. I don't want to advocate any change in others positions. I
just "vented" my frustration and stated my point of view. I'm just tired
of the people I pay to cut my lawn, telling me to keep off the grass.
Sorry for the noise.
Best wishes,
Chris
>>>----------------------->
Christopher Lindsey
Union Planters Mortgage
8700 E. Via de Ventura
Suite 150
Scottsdale, AZ 85258
http://www.ChrisLindsey.com
480-951-1422 Ext. 300 Main
623-742-9911 FAX Direct
602-577-5988 Cell
>>>------------------------>
-----Original Message-----
From: Daver <daver@I...>
To: "Chris Lindsey" <azrubi@a...>,"Hackle"
<hackle@q...>, "tomas2691" <tomasr@a...>,az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2003 07:04:11 -0700
Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
> Not a flame, but a couple comments...
>
> I'm not sure what your point is here. You discuss seeing 20 years of
> "concessions." Meaning closures. If you have seen these 20 years of
> closures occur, how can you help but to take them seriously? The vast
> majority of this was not "conceded" or "comprised" to closure...it was
> just
> _closed_, one way or another. Some of it was fought for, some of it
> went
> quietly. I have been involved in off road motorized recreation for 25
> years
> now, and I have yet to see something "open up." Just fewer places to
> ride.
> More closures. Not concessions, not compromises, just closures, plain
> and
> simple. I fail to see how ignoring closures will help reduce them.
> Ignoring
> them will engender more, not less. You can "don't take them serious,"
> but
> I'll tell you what, when there are no more places left to ride, then
> their
> point of view will be "relevant" to you, and serious as a heart attack.
>
> Plus, FYI, I'm not a nice guy about this. Neither are most of the
> people
> that I've met in relation to land use issues over the years. Nice guys
> finish last. Maybe you are not interested in fighting them, for various
> reasons. I can respect that, and don't have a lot of problem with it.
> Some
> people do. Failing to see that _someone_ needs to fight them is your
> error.
> Unfortunately what happens when we "don't take them serious" is _NOT_
> that
> "no one else will." History shows us that what happens when we "don't
> take
> them serious" is that land closes. Laws and regulations shift against
> those
> of us that enjoy outdoor recreation. There are fewer places to ride,
> and
> more regulations to obey in the places left. If the last 20 years
> doesn't
> show you that, I'm not sure what can.
>
> At 10:51 PM 7/23/2003 -0700, Chris Lindsey wrote:
>
> >Please don't misunderstand me... This is not an attack.
> >
> >The reality is that the majority of "users" consider
> >themselves "individuals". They're not part of a group. They don't
> >consider themselves as a "Jeeper", "Quader", "Motorcyclist" or
> whatever.
> >They're people wanting to go out and have a good time and enjoy
> >the "outdoors".
> >
> >"WE" are never going to make the "greenies" take a step back, cuz,
> they
> >don't give a sh!t about what "we" want. They're on a mission and we
> will
> >never be able to mount a united front to repel them by trying to
> assemble
> >people that are just trying to make a living and have a little fun.
> >
> >So, I ignore them. And I ignore most of you. I know it doesn't seem
> to
> >make sense, but if I don't give them or you any special consideration,
> >then your point of view isn't relevant.
> >
> >I'm putting on my asbestos underwear, as I assume I'm going to receive
> >some flames over this. But, the bottom line, in my mind, is that if
> you
> >don't take them serious, no one else will. Or, if I'm completely
> wrong,
> >we're screwed anyway as the only options and alternatives I've seen
> >coming out of the OHV community for the last 20 years is concessions.
> I
> >for one, am tired of giving "it" up to make other people feel like I'm
> a
> >nice guy.
> >
> >My .02 YMMV
> >
> >Take care,
> >Chris
> > >>>----------------------->
> >Christopher Lindsey
> >Union Planters Mortgage
> >8700 E. Via de Ventura
> >Suite 150
> >Scottsdale, AZ 85258
> >http://www.ChrisLindsey.com
> >480-951-1422 Ext. 300 Main
> >623-742-9911 FAX Direct
> >602-577-5988 Cell
> > >>>------------------------>
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: "Hackle" <hackle@q...>
> >To: "tomas2691" <tomasr@a...>, az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> >Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2003 17:12:56 -0700
> >Subject: RE: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
> >
> > > Roger you are missing a large part of the group that will
> help us
> > > while we
> > > help them. Last time I checked not everyone that is into OHV drives
> a
> > > 4-wheel drive. If we rely on only 4 wheel drive owners we are
> screwed.
> > > OHV
> > > covers all the Quads, Motorcycles, buggies, bronco's, Toys, Suzuki,
> > > sand,
> > > mud, plus the numerous other SUV's that at least camp. These are
> the
> > > type of
> > > numbers we need to get involved to start making the greenies take a
> > > step
> > > back. This is what I mean by one voice and a larger community. Jim
> F.
> > >
> > > "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member"
> > > Groucho
> > > Marx
> > > Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> > > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: tomas2691 [mailto:tomasr@a...]
> > > Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 4:01 PM
> > > To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
> > >
> > >
> > > Any idea how this "organization" would relate to the ASA4WDC? I
> > > though the ASA4WDC was going to try to become that single,
> state-wide
> > > voice. Am I missing something?
> > >
> > > -Roger
> > >
> > > --- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "Hackle" <hackle@q...> wrote:
> > > > I have sent my registration in (again) This is well worth
> > > your time on a
> > > > weekend. If we get a good organization set up the entire OHV
> > > community would
> > > > speak with one voice and have the numbers behind it to make it
> > > stick. I urge
> > > > everyone that gets involved in the Land Use Meetings and even
> those
> > > that do
> > > > not to join in. I do not know how to make everyone understand how
> > > important
> > > > this could be if we put in the effort to get it started. OK off
> the
> > > soap
> > > > box. Jim F. aka Hackle
> > > >
> > > > "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member"
> > > Groucho
> > > > Marx
> > > > Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> > > > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
>
88091 From: Craig Micek <micekc@e...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:15am
Subject: Re: On board air compressor help?
It looks like the output is really low. It would take you quite a while to
fill a tire at .5 cfm. You would probably burn it up. ( I didn't see any
duty cycle info.
Craig
----- Original Message -----
From: "Casper" <casper@c...>
To: <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2003 2:36 AM
Subject: [az_vjc] On board air compressor help?
> Help! I was given a air compressor (12v DC), which is a Thomas air
compressor. I have never set one up before. I was hoping that some of you
could look at the specs for this compressor and tell me if it would work
for an on board unit. Not necessary for a hard core unit, but just something
to use to air up tires after trail runs...... I would really appreciate any
help and suggestions you all could give me... I attached the
specs........oops we can't do that anymore.....
> Well here is the web address:
http://www.thomaspumps.com/products/oem/pdf/315.pdf
> it is the 315CDC56/12
>
> Thank you,
> Casper
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
88092 From: Craig Micek <micekc@e...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:23am
Subject: Re: On board air compressor help?
Whoops, duty cycle was there. 25% 10 minutes on and 30 minutes off. I
would say it will not work for very long.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig Micek" <micekc@e...>
To: "Casper" <casper@c...>; <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2003 10:15 AM
Subject: Re: [az_vjc] On board air compressor help?
> It looks like the output is really low. It would take you quite a while
to
> fill a tire at .5 cfm. You would probably burn it up. ( I didn't see
any
> duty cycle info.
>
> Craig
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Casper" <casper@c...>
> To: <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2003 2:36 AM
> Subject: [az_vjc] On board air compressor help?
>
>
> > Help! I was given a air compressor (12v DC), which is a Thomas air
> compressor. I have never set one up before. I was hoping that some of you
> could look at the specs for this compressor and tell me if it would work
> for an on board unit. Not necessary for a hard core unit, but just
something
> to use to air up tires after trail runs...... I would really appreciate
any
> help and suggestions you all could give me... I attached the
> specs........oops we can't do that anymore.....
> > Well here is the web address:
> http://www.thomaspumps.com/products/oem/pdf/315.pdf
> > it is the 315CDC56/12
> >
> > Thank you,
> > Casper
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
88093 From: JimSerio <jim@r...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:27am
Subject: Extended Warranties
I'm in the process of buying an extended warranty for my 2001 XJ. It
has 33K on it and a little under a year left on the original 3/36
warranty. I was considering buying on the Intertnet and so far have
found 2 places that offer the 7/100 ($50 deductable) for $2550. That
includes the additional charges for 4x4 and mileage/age of the
vehicle.
I decided I would call the local 5 star dealerships to see what
their cost was (read on Google Groups that someone did this in AZ a
few years ago). Only Pitre was willing to share his costs (and faxed
them to me). Howevere, even they seem high. It's 2K for the 7/100/
$50 plus $100 each for 4x4 and over/under 24/36 mileage. Plus he
added a $100 over that. So $2400. This seems a little high having
researched warranties on Google Groups. I recall many buying them
for around $900-$1600 (Maximum care.. same one as I'm looking at).
Does anyone here know if these costs are about right? I'm tempted to
give me business to Pitre as the guy there (Joe) was pretty nice. He
said they they don't go for profit on the warranties, but customer
loyalty. I just want to make sure this is a good price.
Any advice or info would be appreciated.
Jim
88094 From: JimSerio <jim@r...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:30am
Subject: Dealership maintnence
Has anyone taken their Jeeps to any of the local dealers for the 30K
tune-up? What's the cost run on this and what does it include? I'm
leaning toward Darner since they get such good marks from this
group, but if anyone else has recommendations, I'd appreciate it.
BTW... I'm considering a dealer as opposed to a mom/pop shop as I've
read that some warranty work may require proof of regular
maintenence. Who better to have those records than a dealer.
Jim
88095 From: tomas2691 <tomasr@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:31am
Subject: Re: Which is better YJ or TJ AC
The TJ's A/C is much better than the YJ's A/C. The YJ's only came
with under-dash units that don't blow as much air as the TJ system
does.
-Roger
--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "bk83gold" <bk83@j...> wrote:
> I am looking at buying a nother jeep and I want to know if there is
a
> real difference in the YJ and TJ ac. I know the TJ is an overall
> better jeep but I have heard that the TJ's air is as good as a
car's
> ac. Is there any truth to this, or are people just talking bull.
>
> Thanks guys happy wheeling,
> Brandon
88096 From: tomas2691 <tomasr@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:40am
Subject: Re: Which is better YJ or TJ AC
I agree with most of what Doug said. However, I'll disagree with his
rationale for picking a 95 over other years. In my opinion, the fact
that the 95's came with 297 u-joints is relatively insignificant
because the axles that take those u-joints can be had new for about
$135 a side and they are completely interchangeable with the shafts
that take the smaller 260 u-joints.
The more important criteria - in my opinion - for selecting certain
years is the motors and trannies. The early YJ's came with
carbeurated 4.2L motors and Peugot trannies. Some also came with a
different t-case (207?). These are the ones to stay away from. What
you really want in a YJ is the 91 and later which gets you the fuel
injected 4.0HO motor and the AX15 tranny (and NP231 t-case). It also
gets you the later style roll cage which is good if you have
passengers in the rear seat.
-Roger
--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "DougB" <azjeep@c...> wrote:
> YJ's 94 and older have 260 axle joints (weak), whereas the 95 YJ
and all
> TJ's have 297 joints, which are much stronger. Also, most (if not
all YJ's)
> have the D35c rear axle. TJ's also have this axle, but also come
(as an
> option) w/ D44's.
>
> TJ's have a better ride (IMO) than YJ's, however, YJ's are easier
and
> cheaper to do axle upgrades.
>
> Both are extremely capable offroad.
>
> If interested in a YJ, I'd look at 95's.
>
> If interested in a TJ, get one with a D44.
>
> Doug
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "bk83gold" <bk83@j...>
> To: <az_vjc@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 9:50 PM
> Subject: [az_vjc] Which is better YJ or TJ AC
>
>
> > I am looking at buying a nother jeep and I want to know if there
is a
> > real difference in the YJ and TJ ac. I know the TJ is an overall
> > better jeep but I have heard that the TJ's air is as good as a
car's
> > ac. Is there any truth to this, or are people just talking bull.
> >
> > Thanks guys happy wheeling,
> > Brandon
88097 From: tomas2691 <tomasr@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 10:47am
Subject: Re: Crown King run Options
You mean like last year when I only had a bikini top on my Jeep?
(Good thing I had packed a tarp.)
-Roger
--- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "DesertJeep" <joey@d...> wrote:
> To those camping prepare for monsoon rains. It can pour 5" of
> rain in an hour up there and really get things wet.
88098 From: Roger Tomas <tomasr@a...>
Date: Thu Jul 24, 2003 11:06am
Subject: Re: Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
Jim,
Thanks for the comments. I seem to recall reading something about the
ASA4WDC expanding to include quads, motorcycles, etc. based on
discussions at one of their latest meetings. That's why I asked my
question. But Sandee's point about the difficulty of pulling off something
like this with just volunteers is well-taken. Hopefully the NOHVCC will
be successful.
-Roger
Hackle wrote:
> Roger you are missing a large part of the group that will help us while we
> help them. Last time I checked not everyone that is into OHV drives a
> 4-wheel drive. If we rely on only 4 wheel drive owners we are screwed. OHV
> covers all the Quads, Motorcycles, buggies, bronco's, Toys, Suzuki, sand,
> mud, plus the numerous other SUV's that at least camp. These are the type of
> numbers we need to get involved to start making the greenies take a step
> back. This is what I mean by one voice and a larger community. Jim F.
>
> "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member" Groucho
> Marx
> Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tomas2691 [mailto:tomasr@a...]
> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2003 4:01 PM
> To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [az_vjc] Re: FW: URGENT AZ LEADERSHIP WORKSHOP
>
> Any idea how this "organization" would relate to the ASA4WDC? I
> though the ASA4WDC was going to try to become that single, state-wide
> voice. Am I missing something?
>
> -Roger
>
> --- In az_vjc@yahoogroups.com, "Hackle" <hackle@q...> wrote:
> > I have sent my registration in (again) This is well worth
> your time on a
> > weekend. If we get a good organization set up the entire OHV
> community would
> > speak with one voice and have the numbers behind it to make it
> stick. I urge
> > everyone that gets involved in the Land Use Meetings and even those
> that do
> > not to join in. I do not know how to make everyone understand how
> important
> > this could be if we put in the effort to get it started. OK off the
> soap
> > box. Jim F. aka Hackle
> >
> > "I refuse to belong to any group that would have me as a member"
> Groucho
> > Marx
> > Member of the original dirty half dozen.
> > http://www.users.qwest.net/~jkflorence/