Willow Springs.....2/23/08.

[Sean K.]

Anyone post pics yet? We seem to have lost some threads in the recent server back up or whatever. Just wondering if anyone posted or linked to pics.

I'm trying to sweet talk Stacey into loading some vids for us. :)

Sean

[Number 7]

We got together yesterday with some friends to run Willow Springs. A few of us had never been there before, and Sean K (the buggy guy) showed us the obstacles and the by-passes, so it was a lot of fun. Here are some of my pictures but feel free to go to my webshots to see the rest.

Sean took us down to that little Moab area on the way in. I wasn’t able to get any shots of his buggy at this stop because he was too fast getting in there!

The weather was beautiful and we all enjoyed getting out and walking around:

http://inlinethumb51.webshots.com/40946/2981154250100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2981154250100085335CDTggW)

Here’s Number 7:

http://inlinethumb07.webshots.com/40070/2558744060100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2558744060100085335sWFVvk)

Fireball:

http://inlinethumb44.webshots.com/37163/2268823700100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2268823700100085335PoVbic)

Jeepdude775:

http://inlinethumb60.webshots.com/34875/2499820220100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2499820220100085335BIoEcQ)

KenD:

http://inlinethumb34.webshots.com/42913/2001900720100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2001900720100085335RBlvfT)

Dan:

http://inlinethumb21.webshots.com/3668/2091544330100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2091544330100085335oZmjsC)

Number 7 thought he saw an awesome wicked line:

http://inlinethumb49.webshots.com/43056/2546409700100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2546409700100085335LLaOPh)

Um, uh-oh!

http://inlinethumb51.webshots.com/9522/2437386160100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2437386160100085335IKjlxG)

Doh!

http://inlinethumb06.webshots.com/41477/2671626640100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2671626640100085335QGFrQf)

After we left the play area Sean stopped at another little obstacle area along the way:

http://inlinethumb59.webshots.com/32122/2613209610100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2613209610100085335FJGMvx)

Continued
V
V
V

[Number 7]

Our next stop was farther back into the canyon at that big rock you go over if you want. If not there’s a by-pass. Here’s Sean showing us the line you want to take if you go over it:

http://inlinethumb41.webshots.com/39592/2498549840100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2498549840100085335dKhvkd)

Just like it was nothing:

http://inlinethumb54.webshots.com/41973/2299730240100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2299730240100085335ULbwaw)

I got a couple of us crossing it on video. Here the 1st part of Number 7 crossing it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpmA8gyiniY

Number 7 Part II:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnPkdGk8zyA&feature=related

Here’s KenD on the rock:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pr5tpHtpXA4&feature=related

Here’s Dan up on the rock:

http://inlinethumb28.webshots.com/37787/2646577580100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2646577580100085335RvjHqY)

I wasn’t able to get one of the other Sean climbing over the rock. Sorry Jeepdude!! =(

Right after going over that big rock we came to a section that was pretty full of water on one side and rock on the other. We all found various lines through there:

http://inlinethumb13.webshots.com/28044/2478996920100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2478996920100085335OFLOVV)

None of us were too sure Number 7 wasn’t going to sink when he went this way, but he didn’t:

http://inlinethumb24.webshots.com/30423/2839860940100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2839860940100085335xDyRIK)

Here comes KenD:

http://inlinethumb51.webshots.com/41330/2476488220100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2476488220100085335bRKbeL)

We came to this spot that isn’t usually so full of water; made it kind of fun:

http://inlinethumb56.webshots.com/39927/2198688180100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2198688180100085335MYkjhS)

http://inlinethumb32.webshots.com/42271/2886725410100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2886725410100085335LtBJVb)

This is further down the canyon; finally a picture of Sean’s buggy!

http://inlinethumb39.webshots.com/230/2596018170100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2596018170100085335synvZS)

http://inlinethumb30.webshots.com/285/2818691680100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2818691680100085335bOiTKx)

This was as far as we went with the Jeeps but we hiked down a little farther to check it out. It was already 0300 and with everything wet we decided to head back.

Continued
V
V
V
V

[Number 7]

This is almost back to the Big Rock obstacle. I thought the sunlight on the canyon walls was spectacular!

http://inlinethumb03.webshots.com/42434/2854764990100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2854764990100085335ztJxhL)

http://inlinethumb07.webshots.com/19590/2714340370100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2714340370100085335rcdiaB)

http://inlinethumb46.webshots.com/9517/2768143530100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2768143530100085335hibBJH)

http://inlinethumb27.webshots.com/23770/2855989420100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2855989420100085335zxpRrf)

http://inlinethumb42.webshots.com/23913/2331191990100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2331191990100085335iFBlrR)

It was smooth sailing until KenD got to this spot where he got a bit dug in:

http://inlinethumb38.webshots.com/22693/2679639530100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2679639530100085335BdxBHH)

But Sean was able to pull him forward off of it:

http://inlinethumb24.webshots.com/33943/2880361990100085335S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2880361990100085335lBcWTj)

We all sort of struggled over it after that we got out unscathed.

We’d like to thank Sean for all the personalized tour and the spotting! It was great to see everyone and a very fun day!

GnD

[YJunk]

I've only been there once (just about a year ago)... but I love that trail. Its clean, well maintained and beautiful... I think its a testament to how well Locked Gate programs can work...

[jpotts]

I gotta get out there sometime. I get a little tired of wheeling through trash.

How bad is the door George? It doesn't look terrible in that pic. Is it dented or just scraped?

[Sean K.]

Haven't loaded any video yet, but figured you guys might want to see some older video of a friend and myself running the V-Notch....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEpVccq_qAk


And for comparison of the ledge drop off....filled in about 4 feet I'd guess:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psCkRpZhCYk

Sean

[Number 7]

I've only been there once (just about a year ago)... but I love that trail. Its clean, well maintained and beautiful... I think its a testament to how well Locked Gate programs can work...

Amen to that John! That's what we've been talking about on that "Self Policing Not Working?" thread. I think Bulldog Canyon and Willow Springs are perfect examples of how the locked gate system does work.

How bad is the door George? It doesn't look terrible in that pic. Is it dented or just scraped?

Jamie, yeah, the door got a slight dent. Didn't go all the way down to metal, just scrapped down to the primer. Hit my exo-roof rack post and bent it into the body; another slight dent there. Was able to pull the rack post back out by hand. Not gonna worry about it; it's a Jeep. I'm sure you understand. :skull:



Haven't loaded any video yet, but figured you guys might want to see some older video of a friend and myself running the V-Notch....

Thanks for showing us these videos Sean! Those are awesome! Also thanks again for showing us around and helping everybody out yesterday.

GnD

[Sean K.]

Oh, and here's a pic of the V notch we all did at the beginning in the Mini-Moab area.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v125/blt4rox/100_0428.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v125/blt4rox/100_0426.jpg

Amazing how much stuff fills in and washes out here, huh? :)

Sean

[lancetkenyon]

Sean, you gotta love the Creepies over the Irocs!

[lancetkenyon]

Nice pics and vid, I have got to get out there sometime, I still haven't run it yet.

[Sean K.]

Thanks for showing us these videos Sean! Those are awesome! Also thanks again for showing us around and helping everybody out yesterday.

GnD


No problem. Glad you guys had a good time.

So far, I haven't been able to get the wife to load the vids, but as soon as I do, I'll post them up. Thanks for putting up your pics. :)

Sean

[Sean K.]

Sean, you gotta love the Creepies over the Irocs!

Ya.....except I just found out Maxxis in their infinite wisdom :rolleyes: has seen fit to stop selling competition compound to the public, so I can no longer buy new tires from Maxxis. Best I can hope for next time around is a set of used ones off a racer.

Sean

[Erich]

Nice pics! :fashizzle:

[kend]

Thanks, Sean for leading us on this ride on a beautiful trail on a beautiful day. Kind of wet under foot, so we took it easy and had relaxed fun.

A highlight was watching Sean's buggy perform. Here's an example in the play area. He climbed this hill as easily as going up a curb, even with wet tires, and none of the Jeeps gave a second thought to trying it:
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18911&stc=1&d=1203895406
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18912&stc=1&d=1203895406
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18913&stc=1&d=1203895406
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18914&stc=1&d=1203895406
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18915&stc=1&d=1203895753

Here's the other Sean dipping a toe into the water. It felt like quicksand at the bottom of a lot of these pools.
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18916&stc=1&d=1203895753

And George dipping a toe into another water. Good view of his new "door tattoo".
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18917&stc=1&d=1203895753

And Don in the play area.
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18918&stc=1&d=1203895753

[kend]

Here's Dan and the other Sean on the "big rock"
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18928&stc=1&d=1203898685
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18929&stc=1&d=1203898685
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18930&stc=1&d=1203898685
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18931&stc=1&d=1203898685
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18932&stc=1&d=1203898685

[YJunk]

Thats a brave man standing on top of that Rock...

[TomHatch]

It looks like sand has filled in some of the ledges. Great pics.

[lancetkenyon]

Ya.....except I just found out Maxxis in their infinite wisdom :rolleyes: has seen fit to stop selling competition compound to the public, so I can no longer buy new tires from Maxxis. Best I can hope for next time around is a set of used ones off a racer.

Sean

That sucks! I was going to get them next set too.

[JPCooler]

It looks like sand has filled in some of the ledges. Great pics.


Filled some in and cleaned others out. :)

Pic's look great, bummer about the door George, honestly that's why most people who run the 4's take them off ahead of time. John S. actually stashed his near the beginning of the trail last time I ran with him (very doable on this trail, not recommended on all for sure).


Trail is first one my list once my Jeep gets back together :)

[Number 7]

Pic's look great, bummer about the door George, honestly that's why most people who run the 4's take them off ahead of time. John S. actually stashed his near the beginning of the trail last time I ran with him (very doable on this trail, not recommended on all for sure).



That's a great piece of advice, thanks Rich. How do you keep the dome light from staying on when you remove them? Do you recommend tube doors? We're actually thinking of these as we're doing harder trails now.

GnD

[JPCooler]

I believe it's fuse #4, behind the glove box. You can pull it out when you pull the doors.

I love my monkeybars, they have actually held the jeep off the rocks on more than one occasion, saves the area right behind the doors as well, plus they keep me from hanging out to far and also provide some protection from a side impact. Don't do much when it's cold out though :)

[Number 7]

I believe it's fuse #4, behind the glove box. You can pull it out when you pull the doors.

I love my monkeybars, they have actually held the jeep off the rocks on more than one occasion, saves the area right behind the doors as well, plus they keep me from hanging out to far and also provide some protection from a side impact. Don't do much when it's cold out though :)

***Taking Notes*** Definitely considering this next add. =]

[lancetkenyon]

Ehhh, welcome to the elite club of body damage.

[xjstocker]

Ehhh, welcome to the elite club of body damage.

when do i get my membership card?

[Number 7]

when do i get my membership card?

Steve, you're way beyond the body damage phase. :skull:

[Sean K.]

I'm uploading video to YouTube now.....

It's a REALLY slow process. I probably won't post until tomorrow.

Does this site allow embedding? If so, how?

Sean

[jeepdude775]

Great pic's and great time. Sean's buggy is awesome, that thing is a work of art on rocks. Great trail mentor too. Thanks! I'm thinking of something like that before I turn my jeep into a worthless hulk! I managed to centerpunch my front diff and bend my less than a day old currie "heavy duty" tie rod into a nice arc. Luckily I had my newly installed HD diff covers or there would be gear oil on that pristine trail. Needless to say my stock tie rod would have looked like a pretzel :) All in all me and my boy had a great time. Now if I can figure out how to post my pic's I will, getting closer.........And George, that will buff out he he

[Number 7]

I'm uploading video to YouTube now.....

It's a REALLY slow process. I probably won't post until tomorrow.

Does this site allow embedding? If so, how?

Sean

Sean, I saw a thread the other day from Joe West saying he is going to enable Video embedding; he was asking what formats we all wanted. Not sure that this is done or will be soon.

I just rely on posting the Youtube link; seems most reliable, at least for now. Looking forward to seeing them. Drink some coffee, it is a VERY SLOW PROCESS!!!

d

[mingoglia]

That sucks! I was going to get them next set too.

X2. I was just checking out a set on their website Friday. I was going to call Emery to order me up a set but got busy getting ready for this conference.... yes, it's 4:30am, and yes, I just got back from the strip club. :osama:

[Sean K.]

The comp 356 compound is still listed on the site, but my friend called and confirmed (after talking to various distributors) that they are cancelling the program.

My understanding is that their lackluster quality control allowed 1 comp tire to get mixed in with a set of 4 that went to a guy with a DD with a huge lift on something like an F350.....of course, he wondered why one of his tires was BALD in short order, so now we all get punished and they'll only sell the street compound which is at least 10 durometer points harder.....that, and they want almost the same ridiculous amount for them.

While I like Maxxis' tires.....they're pricing is TOTALLY out of line.

Sean

[Sean K.]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=hIOYJlqk1BE

[Sean K.]

Dan:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=CO4boDQDpVE
Ken:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KXzWgsSnKKM
Me:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=EgUUdaUYN2Y

Bill:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=BONE27-h4ic

George's Body Damage:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=PJ9ZGNUuQZk

Ken:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ttCdPfvRiRY

Me:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Exq96uMRVJ4

George on the big rock:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Jy-HipshP58

Ken:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=h5pFTUWQlp8

Dan:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=9O84taiMhGw

Sean:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=xq-wKRyJTB8

The ledge drop off (for comparison to the other video I posted)

http://youtube.com/watch?v=_pFOx0ZKkGw

Me on the 2nd Obstacle:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=NETZLfvhAIw

I have a few more....I'll get them posted at lunch or tonight.

Sean

[kend]

And big thanks to Stacey for the photography! Stills just don't capture the mood like the video.

[Desertdawg]

The ledge sure has filled in. The average Jeep couldn't drop down at that point about three months ago. You had to drop down more towards the camera beyond that rock outcropping shown on the right of the screen.

[Number 7]

Those are awesome videos! Thanks you guys for posting them & a HUGE SPECIAL THANKS to Stacey for shooting all that video!

[Duality]

looks like a fun day. Wish I could have gone.

Question though, you were worried about sinking in that bit of water?

[jeepdude775]

some of that sand was pretty loose and quicksandy would suck your foot in. We just let the buggy go first so at least we would have a good anchor.

[Sean K.]

Dan on the 2nd obstacle....

http://youtube.com/watch?v=QFnTzMAGLmM

George on the 2nd obstacle....

http://youtube.com/watch?v=1N97l97BgBg


Ken and Sean coming up the last ledge.....

http://youtube.com/watch?v=IhaSaPgmpp0
Sean

[Sean K.]

looks like a fun day. Wish I could have gone.

Question though, you were worried about sinking in that bit of water?

I didn't post the video of that b/c it wasn't that impressive, but dropping off the ledge and into it first, my 40's sank pretty far and I had to nail it to keep from getting stuck.

Sean

[kend]

looks like a fun day. Wish I could have gone.

Question though, you were worried about sinking in that bit of water?

When Sean told us that it had filled in about 4 feet of sand that was now under about a foot of water, it gave us pause. Also when people walked around the area they would sink into the sand above the ankles - hard to predict what a Jeep would do. Sean going first seemed to splash out some water and pack the sand a bit, making it easier for the rest of us.

[k7mto]

Wow, a *lot* of sand has back-filled in on the ledge. It looks like an even shorter height than it was *before* all the sand was washed out.

I found this pic in another thread of what it looked like a year or so ago...
The sand drops off more making the ledge higher toward the right of the picture...

http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l315/Ridinspinnas/Willow%20Springs/IMG_5588.jpg

I gotta get my junk ready and go run it again soon.

[Fire Ball]

Here are a couple of pics Carrie got before we had to head out

These are pretty much all the play area since we had to bug out pretty soon into the run but we sure had a blast in a short time

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01624.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01627.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01628.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01629.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01631.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01632.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01636.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01637.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01634.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01635.jpg

[Fire Ball]

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01640.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01641.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01643.jpg

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/jetdriver_phx/willow%20springs%20Feb%2023%202008/DSC01648.jpg

[Number 7]

Good Pictures Bill & Carrie! Thanks for posting them up. At least everybody can see that I was laughing after George took his imaginative line!

[Fire Ball]

Good Pictures Bill & Carrie! Thanks for posting them up. At least everybody can see that I was laughing after George took his imaginary line!

Fixed it for you :)

[DanFelix]

I had a really great time, thanks Shawn and thanks to all of you for some really excellent pics. I'm ready to do that one again, looking forward to anther run with you all again. Dan

[Sean K.]

Thanks for those pics Dan. I really like that first one. :) One of the better ones of my buggy at that angle.

Sean

[gefelix]

I had a really great time, thanks Shawn and thanks to all of you for some really excellent pics. I'm ready to do that one again, looking forward to anther run with you all again. Dan

Nice pics bro! Looked like a good time.

[Sean K.]

Well, the plans have changed for next weekend. Many of you will recall how some FJ Cruisers were supposed to come along with us on this trip. They cancelled and I was supposed to take them to Martinez next weekend (along with a guy from CA).

After seeing the pics from this trip, they've decided they want to run Willow Springs on Sunday, March 2nd. So.....if any of you are up for this one again, feel free to post up and join in.

I will warn you though....this will likely be a LONG day. From what I've witnessed of the FJ Cruiser on the trail, it doesn't really compare to a locked up Jeep, so there will be a lot of stucks, I'd imagine. Unfortunately, it's a Sunday b/c the guy from CA could only wheel that day, so I understand if there are no takers.

Don't know how far they'll get so we may split the group once the going gets tougher.

Sean

[xjstocker]

hey sean is the guy with the blue fj from the uw night run going to be there? ya know scorpion man:)

[Fire Ball]

Darn, I have to work through Sunday. I would like to do more of this trail.

[Sean K.]

Steve,
Nope. The "Scorpion Doctor" is actually getting ready for a wheeling trip sponsored by All Pro Off Road to Clawhammer the next weekend. I guess there's going to be magazine coverage. Something like 10 IFS FJ Cruisers are going to spend the day running the trail. I have no doubt they'll make it, but I envision a lot of work to make it happen.

The guy with the yellow FJC (from the same UW night run) will be there on Sunday though.

Sean

Sean

[Sean K.]

Darn, I have to work through Sunday. I would like to do more of this trail.

Well, I wouldn't be really surprised if we don't even make it to the point in your avatar pic (3rd obstacle). I drove down close to that point last weekend in the buggy while the rest of the group stayed at the 2nd obstacle.

Alot has washed out. In dry weather, I think the Jeeps can make it down there without much issue, but I think the FJs are going to hang on their sliders so hard I doubt they'll be able to keep going and climbing back out with no true front locker should be interesting to say the least.

Sean

[JPCooler]

Thanks for those pics Dan. I really like that first one. :) One of the better ones of my buggy at that angle.

Sean

Yeah, that's a great one:

http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=19027&d=1203991315

[Desertdawg]

I guess I better scrouge up some spare Dana 35 axles for this run. This is going to be cool!:punk:

[kend]

Oh, too bad - I can't make it Mar 2. Another rain check:)

[Fire Ball]

Can't wait till it dries out, I love this trail. It's been a while since I was back there..

[Sean K.]

Oh, too bad - I can't make it Mar 2. Another rain check:)

Hopefully next time Ken. It was very nice running with all of you guys. Very nice bunch of folks. Capable rigs and good drivers. Thanks for making it a fun day. :)

Sean

[Sean K.]

Posting up meeting time and location here as well in the other thread for the Sunday March 2 run of WS.

8am at the gas station just north of US60 and Idaho. The station is on the east side of Idaho.

Sean

[Tom Jacobson]

Well, I wouldn't be really surprised if we don't even make it to the point in your avatar pic (3rd obstacle). I drove down close to that point last weekend in the buggy while the rest of the group stayed at the 2nd obstacle.

Alot has washed out. In dry weather, I think the Jeeps can make it down there without much issue, but I think the FJs are going to hang on their sliders so hard I doubt they'll be able to keep going and climbing back out with no true front locker should be interesting to say the least.

Sean

No offense, Sean, but...

Knowing all this (and I think you are dead right in the assessment of how far stock/slightly modded FJ's will get)...they still want to run the trail???

And even if they WANT to run it...are you sure it's a good idea to actually take them there????

Look, I'm not trying to start another "underequipped rig" or "trail ratings" debate, but seriously. Typical minimum requirements for this trail are 33's and one hard locker...plus some body armor and at least a bit of driving skills. And that's in the dry. Having run the trail several times, I personally wouldn't recommend it for the FJ's (unless I'm way off base on their build and skill level).

Or prepare yourself for a potentially long day. And prepare them for a potentially expensive (and long) day!

[Sean K.]

Agreed. But they meet those requirements. There's no reason they can't do the upper sections.....how far they get will determine how well they are really set up.

I can't say for sure....so I guess we'll see. I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt.

I do know it will likely be a long day. If anyone is contemplating going....then they need to be fully aware of that....and I think I've covered it in both threads.

Sean

[Sean K.]

I had to write that reply quickly. I'd like to make a few more points now that I have more time.

Most of this group (actually all but maybe one) will also have a 3.5" lift, sliders, upgraded bumpers, and they already have the factory rear locker and the "atrac" eletronic traction control system for the front. It works reasonably well, but it doesn't work as well as a true locker in front. Several have winches. One of the vehicles coming has a front ARB locker as well as a crawler tcase. Some are brand new to wheeling, others have a decent amount of experience in previous rigs.

I've made it clear that they must have at least a rear locker, atrac, and sliders....additionally, the factory tire size is a metric equivalent 32-33" (285s).

As for "allowing" them to run the trail. They picked this one over Martinez. I know Martinez can be run by FJCs b/c I know 3 have done it (one with me). I don't think the upper portion of Willow Springs is any harder than Martinez and we've got the added benefit of being able to "play" in the Mini-Moab area so at the very least, if they can't get too far into the canyon, they can always play around there for a little while.

The other thing: I'm not one to tell someone what they cannot do. (This isn't aimed at you....just my view point). I don't like being told my rig can't make a trail and I'd bet they wouldn't appreciate it either. When I hear someone say that and I know them and their style of wheeling, I respect it.....however, there are many wheelers out there that don't share that same opinion and need to prove it to themselves. I'd wager the majority of wheelers fall into that latter category.

I know for a fact this will be a long day if they continue down into the canyon. If they feel like it's beyond their capability, I have zero heartburn about turning around early and leading them out. I may really want to continue on with the Jeeps, but I'm leading the run and it's my responsibility to get them out safely, so I'll honor that commitment.

I hope any Jeeps that tag along can understand that and fully realize that if they decide to run with this group, they can leave at any point on their own if they feel they're being slowed down too much. If they stay, they'll need to have a great deal of patience with me and them. We didn't all start out walking.....they'll need our help to get there.

Hope that explains it.

Sean

[Tom Jacobson]

Hope that explains it.

Sean

That and then some! Heh heh! :)

I did go read your other thread and see you explain a bit more about the group that's coming along. You had pretty much everything covered with them and are conveying a great, up front attitude/explanations with everyone. Excellent!

I just got a little nervous thinking FJ Cruiser + out of towners + Willow Springs = possible bad times for all if they really didn't know what they were in for.

That is an awesome trail...pristine, challenging, close to town (for us East Siders!), and scenery rivaling, if not arguably better than, Martinez. Only the view is from the bottom of a beautiful canyon as opposed to the top!

Have an awesome trip. Hope to hit the trails you sometime.

Tom

[Sean K.]

Thanks for understanding and taking the time to read the other thread.

I also hope we can wheel together in the future.

Take care,
Sean

[Xiled1]

I've been in Willow Springs a number of times with my jeep and hiking, its close by. I've never been past the tippy spot in my jeep, but have hiked back in a little ways. I'd like to know where the mini-moab area is. Maybe I've been by it and not given it a second thought, as I am under equipped. But its bugging me not knowing where.

Thanks.

[Sean K.]

It's actually at the very beginning right after you pass through the gate. When you drop down into the wash....you turn left instead of right. It's a very short drive to the mini-Moab area. Traction is so good, you can probably get away without having lockers and doing alot of the obstacles. It's a very small area....only a couple of hundred yards long. The rock is sorta a reddish color and is almost like petrified mud or something. Very gritty and grippy.

HTH,
Sean

[RokNRich]

Mini Moab -

http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n275/roknrich/DSC03223.jpg



Be careful on the line to the left :)

[jeepdude775]

Hi Sean this is the other Sean I may be in as well-that is if there is room. (plus I have a really good winch :) I get back in town Sat. nite but should be able to get out there. I fully understand the situation and think it would be fun to watch. That is a fun trail would like to see it again.

Later

[jeepdude775]

PS I just won't bother changing my tie rod from last Sat!

[Sean K.]

It'll be good to have ya if you can make it. See ya Sunday.

Sean

[Xiled1]

It's actually at the very beginning right after you pass through the gate. When you drop down into the wash....you turn left instead of right. It's a very short drive to the mini-Moab area. Traction is so good, you can probably get away without having lockers and doing alot of the obstacles. It's a very small area....only a couple of hundred yards long. The rock is sorta a reddish color and is almost like petrified mud or something. Very gritty and grippy.

HTH,
Sean

Thanks! I've hiked that way, but never Jeeped it. Probably just not paying attention. I'll have to check it out next time I'm down there.

[Sean K.]

Related thread:

http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/showthread.php?t=31577

Sean

[Sean K.]

Closing this thread. Moving to this one:

http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/showthread.php?p=302567#post302567

Sean