Newbie

[GruveB]

I recently purchased an 80 CJ7. I'm pretty happy with it.

I'm 34, teaching High School math here in Rio Rico. I'm married, have two daughters. I've always enjoyed exploring the desert and such and have had a number of projects, but this is my first jeep.

My Jeep has a 304 that is fuel injected, has custom exhaust (quiet), has a low rpm/torque cam (not sure of the specs), SPOA, rancho shocks, wide track axles (chromoly too), and a 3 speed auto tranny. It's got various other doo-dads and such, but that's what it basically is.

The jeep is set up for strictly offroad use and is flat-out dangerous on pavement. I'd like to make it a little more capable of road use so I don't have to trailer it to short trails that are a few miles away.

Anyhow, that's me and that's my rig.

[ademster]

Welcome to the club


First off whats make it so scary on the road?

Tracking problems, bump steer?
in order for us to provide help on the issues... we'll need a little more details.



btw it is nice to see another Cj on the roads.

[1eagle]

Welcome to the board. Their is a great bunch of people here with a lot of knowledge.

Roger

[GruveB]

Welcome to the club


First off whats make it so scary on the road?

Tracking problems, bump steer?
in order for us to provide help on the issues... we'll need a little more details.



btw it is nice to see another Cj on the roads.

3 things:

1. Extremely sloppy steering. I've never worked on these before, but have read a little. I was thinking of checking the caster angle first. All of the moving parts seem to be in good order.

2. Braking power is horrible. I'm definitely upgrading the brake lines, and probably replacing the pads and shoes...they feel burned. Hopefully that'll do the trick.

3. Body roll...I think if problems one and two are resolved, this will be ok.

[ademster]

Well.... for the sloppy steering could be a few things.

Worn out worm gear in the gear box.
bad outer tie rod ends,
bad rag joint.


for your braking power... well.... from the looks of you you have over sized tires, suspension lift... remember thats a lot of mass to stop with the CJ-7s original braking system.

I would suggest buying a lat 70s-80s Master Cylinder or doing the YJ power brake booster set-up... or if you already have power brakes, might suggest buying upgraded brake kits. I would go with wilwood brake calipers with 4 pistons or of the such... and over sized rotors.. might want to consider doing the rear dis brake conversion... this will help dramatically too.

Body roll... well do you probably font have a sway bar installed.... might be something to consider... I have a stock sway bar if you are interested... you'll just need to buy JKS quick disconnects from 4 wheelers supply made for you total lift and your good to go.

[Wayco]

Welcome to the forum. :)
Old CJ's have a shorter wheel base than the newer Jeeps, so they are already less stable for highway/road use. Some people put wider axles or lengthen them to compensate. Your's looks like it is built up quite a bit, the higher/bigger it is the less stable it will be.
The loose steering can be a loose pitman arm or any number of other components, including the steering box. We have several good business sponsors that will be glad to advise you, or you could just get on a couple of local trails with some of us, we are full of free advice, and it's worth every penny you pay for it.:)
Check out the "Links to Sponsor Websites" here:
http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/forumdisplay.php?f=52
My favorite is 4 Wheelers supply, but for steering issues, I would use Desert fab. Absolute Offroad is doing a long arm kit on my Jeep, and Joe has a lot of knowledge about suspensions and how to make them work better.
It's great to ask questions here, but it's better to get out and WHEEL! :D When you do a few trails, and talk to folks with similar rigs, you will get a better idea about what you want to do with YOUR rig....

[GruveB]

I checked the tire pressure...it was 35 psi! I lowered it to about 17 and it helped a lot.
Everything looks good, feels tight, so it may be the gear box. We'll see.

It is pretty built up, the previous owner took it on the Moab Easter Safari a few years ago and always had it out at Reddington Pass.
I do have one poser video that I made yesterday. We were just out getting dirty and having fun... Here it is: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4677530131699878503&hl=en

[GruveB]

Well.... for the sloppy steering could be a few things.

for your braking power... well.... from the looks of you you have over sized tires, suspension lift... remember thats a lot of mass to stop with the CJ-7s original braking system.

I would suggest buying a lat 70s-80s Master Cylinder or doing the YJ power brake booster set-up... or if you already have power brakes, might suggest buying upgraded brake kits. I would go with wilwood brake calipers with 4 pistons or of the such... and over sized rotors.. might want to consider doing the rear dis brake conversion... this will help dramatically too.

Body roll... well do you probably font have a sway bar installed.... might be something to consider... I have a stock sway bar if you are interested... you'll just need to buy JKS quick disconnects from 4 wheelers supply made for you total lift and your good to go.

It has power brakes, but they're drums in the back. I was considering an upgrade there. And no, there isn't a sway bar at all. That would help a lot.

[jeep108]

Make sure to check the brackets on the gear box. They are known to be a weak point. They sell after market braces or you can make one.

[Billy 4 hp]

Nice looking CJ...

I pretty much agree with everything being said, but what do I know?!

From a height standpoint your CJ looks pretty tall from the photo's, adding or reinstalling a front swaybar with change the onroad manners 100%.... But with that high of a center of gravity it's always gonna to be a bit on the squirrely side IMO...

Although our CJ's aren't identical I can cruise comfortably a 75 to 80 mph onroad with the swaybar installed, so it can be done....

BTW my CJ has a rear disc brake conversion from Stainless Steel brakes and although I haven't put it to a formal test, I swear my old 81 CJ7 will outstop our 2001 Ford Explorer that has a measly 60k miles on it... My CJ has 33x12.50x15's so I am stopping a fair amount of rolling mass....

[jr4asu]

Welcome to the club... nice to see another CJ owner. If your looking to do the swaybar and disconnects I'm selling my old ones. :D

http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/showthread.php?t=23861

[Papa Mo]

Welcome to the club hope to cya on da trail!!

[Jdemonto@Airpark Jeep Sales]

Welcome

[GRUNT]

Welcome! I did disc conversion on my YJ... Much improved.
x2 on swaybar...
Do you ever have a problem with your rear tires getting up in your tub? Looks like a tight fit...

[lancetkenyon]

Welcome to your new addiction!

[twstdtj]

Welcome. Hope to see ya on the trails!!

[My Green Jeep]

Woo hooo.... another CJ owner...

welcome...welcome!!!

[YJunk]

spring over is going to give you a lot of lift from stock and will change the caster of the axle (todd at df explained this to me in detail)... you've also got a lift shackle on the rig so I'm estimating between four and six inches of lift there... some of your body roll could aslo be your leaf packs; if they are stock cj or yj they may be getting soft from being run on top of the axle... as adam pointed out you might also want to run a sway bar on the road.

That's a great looking rig... have fun and welcome aboard

[SEDONA RICK]

[QUOTE=GruveB;216823]I recently purchased an 80 CJ7.
I'm 34, teaching High School math here in Rio Rico.

JEEP MATH
80' CJ7 - $$ IN UP GRADES =:D:D:D $$00

WELCOME ABOARD

[ob1jeeper]

With a spring over lift, coupled with the lift shackles, you're gonna have a tough time controlling lateral compliance to a level that is sufficient to fully control wander (the steering loosness/slop you're describing..). UNLESS you have sufficient knowledge to fab & install a proper panhard bar(s)...at least on the steered axle.

As far as lean/sway control, that too is gonna be tougher to fully address, than simply adding an OEM sway bar with longer links... Mostly because the COG (center of gravity) is now WELL above the instant center. I suspect this is also likely translating into at least some amounts of roll-steer.

In some large lifts, and most SOA's, roll-steer typically manifests itself in a manner that is inconsistent with steering inputs, causing driving around corners to be a series of corrections, essentially "chasing the steering wheel to achieve correct amount of steering inputs". A VERY STIFF, FRONT sway bar may help, by controlling lean, and thus the axle movements that are contributing to roll-steer, but IMHO, it will most likely never fully correct the suspension geometry gremlins typically resulting from the SOA lift, sufficiently to allow it to be driven at OEM levels and highway speeds as safely as it was OEM.

HTH...Good Luck...:);)

[YJunk]

With a spring over lift, coupled with the lift shackles, you're gonna have a tough time controlling lateral compliance to a level that is sufficient to fully control wander (the steering loosness/slop you're describing..). UNLESS you have sufficient knowledge to fab & install a proper panhard bar(s)...at least on the steered axle.

As far as lean/sway control, that too is gonna be tougher to fully address, than simply adding an OEM sway bar with longer links... Mostly because the COG (center of gravity) is now WELL above the instant center. I suspect this is also likely translating into at least some amounts of roll-steer.

In some large lifts, and most SOA's, roll-steer typically manifests itself in a manner that is inconsistent with steering inputs, causing driving around corners to be a series of corrections, essentially "chasing the steering wheel to achieve correct amount of steering inputs". A VERY STIFF, FRONT sway bar may help, by controlling lean, and thus the axle movements that are contributing to roll-steer, but IMHO, it will most likely never fully correct the suspension geometry gremlins typically resulting from the SOA lift, sufficiently to allow it to be driven at OEM levels and highway speeds as safely as it was OEM.

HTH...Good Luck...:);)

The COG is a really good point...

If you take anything away from this it should be there are a lot of things that are affecting your on road performance... each upgrade and change to improve off-highway ability will have some other affect elswhere (on-highway)...

As I've made changes in JrunkenStien I've had to compensate to some degree on the highway... its a give and take... when you start cruising through some of the harder trails (at least for some of us) it all seems worth while!

[MitchRonda]

Adj. your rear drums, jack up 1 tire & adj until it starts to drag, then same for other may improve stopping, & check your front hub berrings for your loose steering may be all you need...M...

[GruveB]

Thanks for all of the advice. I'll put it to good use. The springs are stock springs and very soft, the original owner said he kept them that way because they were easy on his rear-end (not the jeeps).

I don't have hopes, or desire, to use it as a daily driver...but it would be nice to drive on the road. I'll be going through various things in the coming weeks to see where I can improve.

[GruveB]

I just put on a set of used maxxis creepy crawlers and it actually drives much better now on the road than with the Super Swamper TSL's. :D

[Gasman]

I just put on a set of used maxxis creepy crawlers and it actually drives much better now on the road than with the Super Swamper TSL's. :D

Good to hear they worked out for you. You didn't waste any time getting those mounted up! :D :D

[GruveB]

lol, definitely not. I had the day off, so I got them on this morning. Installed a CB this afternoon and then took a nap. If I was really devoted though, I'd have gone on a short run to test them out.

[OlneyJeeps]

welcome aboard!

as you can tell, everyone has an opinion:eek:
I love the CJ7 (mine is a 78, 304,TF999,D300)
thought about wheel spacers (I use 1.5 " spacers, 5 years, love them)

SteveO