Land Navigation

[amber.hodge]

For all of those who think that the technical knowledge base needed for Jeeping is mechanical only, I believe that is wrong.

If you are stranded, stuck, lost or have an emergency where you need to find a route different than the one you are on, having map reading and land navigation skills can come between you and danger. The average Joe thinks he can read a map - but can everyone shoot an azimuth? If you don't know what an azimuth is, you DEFINITELY should attend. Also, if you think there is only 1 north and not 3, you should DEFINITELY attend.

Land navigation is a required knowledge base for soldiers and marines. It is a requirement for the passing of leadership courses.

Not always will your GPS be able to save you. Get it wet, crack the screen or run out of battery and you are in trouble.

ArizonaXJ is extremely experienced in Land Navigation and Map Reading. I have asked him to personally teach me this skill on some weekend this fall (oct or nov) in prep for my leadership course in Jan. I felt that this skill was so important and that his knowledge and experience is so emmense, that to not open this learning experience up to the group would cause everyone to miss out on something GREAT.

This would be a 2 day course. 1 day of classroom instruction and 1 day in a field environment. Required tools to bring would be a lensatic compass, water, and sunscreen for day 2 - if you are so inclined you can bring a GPS so you can see some pros and cons of each.

I am opening up this thread for input, questions (which will be answered by ArizonaXJ mainly), as well as a poll for interest. If we can get a class of at least 5 and not more than 40 individuals who can all attend on a weekend, we can start coordination on the date and getting classroom facilities for day 1.

[amber.hodge]

ArizonaXJ - what area are you thinking of doing the field exercise in?

[ArizonaXJ]

Just to add to what Amber has posted;
I do believe that a GPS is a good tool. However, it is just that, a tool. The same can be said of map reading and land navigation. It is but another tool in our box.
While GPS is nice, it does not tell you every thing and is vulnerable to damage.
I am Infantry, Artillery, and Chemical corps qualified. Now this doesn't mean anything to most of you. However, Map reading and land navigation are critical to these three career fields in the Army.
I have a class that will take the average person that only knows that a map is on paper and will teach them everything they need to know and then some.
I am instructor qualified in the Army and have been since 1990/91. I have taught this class many, many times. To young soldiers and also at the leadership schools.
To echo Amber's point above; How many "Norths" are there? What is a G-M angle? How high is that ridge line or, how deep is that hole (depression in the Army).
Post up and let us know. Amber asked me if I would do this and I said yes.

[ArizonaXJ]

ArizonaXJ - what area are you thinking of doing the field exercise in?

Florence for the "field portion".......

[amber.hodge]

At the Army National Guard land nav course that we have to train on? or are you creating your own?

[TanTJJim]

Thanks for the heads up on this workshop Amber. If there is enough advance notice I will be able to schedule a full weekend off to do this. It's been quite a while since I broke out a map and compass, a refresher would be great.

For the day in the field were you guys going to do a course or something. Like placing numbered flags and having to navigate to them and write the correctly numbered flag for the desired location. Another cool thing we did in Boy Scouts waaaay back in the day was hike to a random location with a group and we had to find out where we were on the map based on the terrain features and navigate back to the starting location. Not sure what the time/heat constraints would place on this but thought I might add some ideas.

[amber.hodge]

I believe there is a course in Florence. If he is gonna drive 80 miles one way to do this area, I believe it will be to utilize that, but that is assumption. The area is terrific for this sort of thing. I would assume the classroom portion could be on the west side the day before to even the playing field?

[06TJWRANGLER]

I watch MAN VS WILD all the time, I think im good!! Thanks though:D

[amber.hodge]

LOL by that logic, I should be an EXCELLENT doctor, because I'm glued to House all the time :D This will be a good course.

[Kelly P]

I would be very interested in this course, great idea!

[mbuckner]

But if I need a land navigation course, how will I find my way to the class?:confused:

Mike

[amber.hodge]

But if I need a land navigation course, how will I find my way to the class?:confused:

Mike

LOL follow me :D

[GRUNT]

But if I need a land navigation course, how will I find my way to the class?:confused:

Mike

I can't quit laughing, that was funny!

ArizonaXJ, I can assist you in this course if you'd like. I spent 8 years in the Corps, BEFORE we had GPS.... :eek: I can help set search points and or help answer questions/supervise while you run the land nav course in Florence. I actually used to run agressor forces against my marine company there several years back. The CO gave me several OCS candidates, luckily some were prior enlisted against 325 marines. I got them in through the lines, under darkness and to the CP "tree" before we got spotted. Nothing like getting to take out your whole command staff!
I also can bring my partner from work to help you/everyone, he is a Green Beret/Ranger with 19th SF. I just call him the "Green Weenie." Just curious if you'd like help to keep track of heads out there.... And I would like to watch Amber use her mad map reading skills!:eek: "Why is this arrow thingy spinning?!":D:D:D

[amber.hodge]

LOL - I know that when the group breaks up for search points it may be a good idea to pair someone with some knowledge with someone less experienced. That is what I did with my first land nav course - I did all the work and he was just along in case I got lost - which I never did. I could use some refreshing with shooting an azimuth as it is a PIA if you aren't in practice.

[GRUNT]

A KIA, I thought that was a small Korean car?! Oh... PIA, sorry..... :p

[amber.hodge]

Last time I checked, KIA was "killed in action" :(

[danno]

Do you plan on teaching the course using Lat Lon as the basis for Coordinates or UTM... I might suggest UTM as an option, simply because it is easier for the beginner to plot a position on a map using known UTM coords and a UTM Grid. Especially if they understand the concept behind UTM.

[ArizonaXJ]

At the Army National Guard land nav course that we have to train on? or are you creating your own?


I would prefer to create my own as I have done in the past. Since this is a Jeep club, I could work in a portion of "mounted land nav"

[amber.hodge]

Yay. What trail rating would the mounted be?

[ArizonaXJ]

I can't quit laughing, that was funny!

ArizonaXJ, I can assist you in this course if you'd like. I spent 8 years in the Corps, BEFORE we had GPS.... :eek: I can help set search points and or help answer questions/supervise while you run the land nav course in Florence. I actually used to run agressor forces against my marine company there several years back. The CO gave me several OCS candidates, luckily some were prior enlisted against 325 marines. I got them in through the lines, under darkness and to the CP "tree" before we got spotted. Nothing like getting to take out your whole command staff!
I also can bring my partner from work to help you/everyone, he is a Green Beret/Ranger with 19th SF. I just call him the "Green Weenie." Just curious if you'd like help to keep track of heads out there.... And I would like to watch Amber use her mad map reading skills!:eek: "Why is this arrow thingy spinning?!":D:D:D


I'll take you up on your offer. I have friend up there in the 19th group also. Them guys have been trying to get me to go over to them for years. I keep telling them to go stuff it. Get me right, I would enjoy the extra cool guy gear and secret squirrel missions but, Rangers and SF are cannon fodder for the most part. I like coming in with the rest of the Brigade or division. Something about having a supply train with more ammo then 48-72 hours worth!!!

[Fire Ball]

LOL follow me :D


There won't be any water crossings will there? :D

I haven't done this for many years and would love a refresher course. It's sad I don't carry maps any more.

[ArizonaXJ]

Okay, to answer some of the questions that people may be having and some that have been asked.....

The way that I teach this would would enable everyone to understand and do the following:

Know and understand the colors of a map. How to measure straight line distance in feet, miles, kilometers. How to measure road distance. Determine elevation to include in depressions (yes, sometimes you want to know how deep a hole is??). Terrain features (5 major, 3 minor, 2 supplemental). Grid zone designators. Grid coordinates (4, 6, and 8 digit). Intersection. Resection. Azimuth conversion (grid to magnetic, magnetic to grid). Back azimuths. What is and how to use a protractor. Understanding the difference between map scales (1:25,000, 1:50,000, 1:100,000). What all that "stuff" around the side of the map is and how to use it. Pace count (for measuring distance when walking). Navigating around obstacles (no, not rocks, lakes and such).

There will be no lat/long. Lat/long is not accurate enough for what "we" have been trained to do.

Right now, I am thinking of the classroom portion being held some where around 52nd street and McDowell Rd. A lot of where we do it is based on how many people we end up with wanting to do this.

As for the "hands on" or "field" portion; I think that Florence would be good. I have set up courses there before and it worked very well. That is where I took the Department Of Corrections personnel when I taught them a few years ago.

When out in the "field" you will need to have a Camelback, canteen or something for water. A lensatic compass if you have one. If you don't have one but want to get one, check out a surplus store (probably about $30-40.00 now). The only thing is, compasses are sometimes off! you have to check them out when you buy one. I drove the guy nuts when I bought mine. I would also recommend hand held radios just in case (snake bite, rolled ankle, etc.).

If people wanted to, I could teach how to do land nav at night. That is where things get really interesting!!! (I freaked that S.F. buddy of mine out one night doing land nav).

Finally, for the course itself, yes, you would be looking for a post or picket with something attached to it with a number, letter, word, whatever on it. These must be logged down so that we know you successfully found the points. By the way, I usually set up my courses so that there are multiple answers so that if two people or groups of people run into each other on the course, they can't say "hey, the answer to #5 is XYZ. What is the answer to #8?"

So, with this being said, let me know if you're still interested.

[amber.hodge]

Still interested. (not a surprise I'm sure) I think 52nd street and McDowell would be good for easy use of powerpoint if needed. :)

[mbuckner]

I vote for 52nd & McDowell ... That's close enough to the house that I will not get lost .... I am at 60th Street and Thomas Road ......

Mike

[WalterD]

Mostly depends on when

[GRUNT]

I am down for where ever, when ever... As long as it is past the 15th of Spetember....

[amber.hodge]

It will be. I know ArizonaXJ will not be in town till October. I can't do September because of the runs we posted up.

[Tom Schenk]

You can count me in to. I did my share of land nav as an 0311 in the Marines and could help instruct a group on the course. Also, I can get protractor's from my wife's store on Luke AFB.

[amber.hodge]

Just add to the poll so it is easier for me to collect all of the names, please :)
We'll have protractors, maps, etc etc :D

[GRUNT]

YES! 0311s in the house!!!! Oorah Devil Dog!!!!

[amber.hodge]

YES! 0311s in the house!!!! Oorah Devil PUP!!!!

fixed it :D

[GRUNT]

I am so jealous of you marines... Sure I like the Army and I miss my lil boat from when I was in the Navy but I sure would like to have a set of Dress Blues...:(

Okay, game on... Fixed yours too... :rolleyes::D:p

[amber.hodge]

Okay, game on... Fixed yours too... :rolleyes::D:p

LOL I have dress blues - ARMY dress blues....:D LOL silly leatherneck! :D

[ArizonaXJ]

You can count me in to. I did my share of land nav as an 0311 in the Marines and could help instruct a group on the course. Also, I can get protractor's from my wife's store on Luke AFB.


HOOAH! I will take you up on your offer also......by any chance does she deal in 1:50,000 maps too? I have some but, depending on how many sign up, I may need some more. I can provide map name, sheet number, etc.

[Tom Schenk]

I don't think she does but maybe she can point us in the right direction. I'll ask her tonight.

[ROKCRLR]

I'd be interested in this. Are you guys planning a for a Saturday + Sunday or consecutive Sundays or what?

[GRUNT]

XJ - If we do a Sat/Sun out there in Florence will they let us camp over night? I am down for that! We could caravan up to SanTan Flats for Saturday night dinner too! Yee-ha!

[amber.hodge]

It would be a Sat at Papago area and Sun at Florence from what I thought...but this thread is not to post up rigid outline of the course - more of a tickler for interest to set it up....
I believe Sat/Sun so it is fresh in your head the next day.

[amber.hodge]

HOOAH! I will take you up on your offer also......by any chance does she deal in 1:50,000 maps too? I have some but, depending on how many sign up, I may need some more. I can provide map name, sheet number, etc.

I may have said resource, talk to me tonight at the meet and greet.;)

[ArizonaXJ]

It will be the same weekend, Saturday AND Sunday, no splitting weekends. I will be going out the Friday prior and marking the course like I usually do. I prefer that people use their new found knowledge as soon as possible after gaining it because the field portion is what cements things in.
As far as camping goes.....I've spent more nights there in Florence then I care to think about. However, it is an idea......although I usually administer night land nav AFTER the day time portion :D
Night time land nav is fun.......the only thing more fun is driving at night in black-out drive WITHOUT NVG's!!!! :eek:

[Bill Ritter]

I would be interested.

I used to be pretty good w/a compass and could use a refresher course.

Bill [0311]

[amber.hodge]

:) I think we are looking at housing possibilities or places to stay out in Florence for you westies.
Looks like we have enough interest to work on setting dates for this class.

[YELACON]

i am in, as long as i have the day off or enough time to get the day off.

[jporvaz]

I used to be able to navigate the urban jungle in the cloak of darkness, blacked out before we ever heard of GPS or car computers or NVG. But that was a long time ago so I would be interested. Should be open most weekends after Sep.

[GRUNT]

I used to be able to navigate the urban jungle in the cloak of darkness, blacked out before we ever heard of GPS or car computers or NVG. But that was a long time ago so I would be interested. Should be open most weekends after Sep.

Was that back when Chandler had six paved streets and 4 squad cars? :D

[cross_007]

I am interested, but would need to know exact date and time in advance so I can take days off of work. Thanks, Chris

[amber.hodge]

So I'm guessing about 20-30 people interested if you count spouses, etc.....
Sounds like it is time to set a date - ArizonaXJ - you have my dates of availability and they have not changed since Remington's surgery will be September 5th.

[jporvaz]

Was that back when Chandler had six paved streets and 4 squad cars? :D


Yep :)

[amber.hodge]

LOL I remember Chandler then...when I was little and grew up on the acre lots off of warner and price (now 101 freeway), warner road was dirt and everything south and east of it was pretty much farmland....

[Andrew F]

I would love to take part. Attendance would mostly be determined by how much school decides to beat me up that week end.

[amber.hodge]

So, what you're saying is that you don't want it to be the weekend before midterms, right?

[ArizonaXJ]

Okay everyone. It looks as though we will be going for October 13 & 14. The 13th will be "classroom" and the 14th will be the "hands on" practical application in Florence. I really didn't want to do this weekend but it seems as though it is the best for everyone else, so......that is what we will go with.
Now, for the time being I am going to say that the classroom portion will / should start at 0800 on Saturday the 13th. This will or could last a good eight hours. Depends on how serious everyone is about learning this stuff and if they have any problems getting it down. Now if everyone gets it pretty quick, it won't take as long. I am thinking about holding the class at my unit down at 52nd street and McDowell rd. I think that that is a fair middle ground for all involved.
The hands on portion in Florence will be the following morning, Sunday the 14th. I haven't thought about a start time for that yet. However, plan on being out there for a few hours.
If this is looking good for all interested, let me know. I like to think that this far enough in advance for some of you to make the required scheduling adjustments that your busy lives require. I didn't want to push this into November because of the holiday season.

[jporvaz]

I'm in

[amber.hodge]

X2

[mbuckner]

So land navigation will be based on how long it takes Amber to
learn "WATER" navigation .....:D

Oh no!!! Not my reputation:eek:

Mike

[GRUNT]

I am in for those dates XJ. Let me know what you need assistance with okay?
*** Do we need to bring "water wingies" for Amber?

[mbuckner]

Will there be list of minimum classroom/field supplies required that each pupil will need to bring ???

Best regards,

Mike

[amber.hodge]

LOL - why do I have to get the brunt of my HUSBAND'S driving? LOL

[ArizonaXJ]

Here is a list of things that you may to bring for this class:

Classroom Day:
pencil(s) Preferably a 0.5 mm mechanical one but, good old number 2's will do.
6 inch plastic ruler.
note/scratch pad.
refreshments for yourself (there is a soda machine and snack machine but they suck)
lensatic compass if you have one.

Hands-on Field Exercise in Florence:
Camelback and or canteen with water. ***This is NOT a requested or optional item. You will stay hydrated out there. If not, I will stick you and give you an I.V.......Safety First!!!!

Sunscreen.
Lunch.
Aforementioned lensatic compass.
Aforementioned 6 inch ruler.
aforementioned pencil(s).
Aforementioned note book/scratch pad.
FRS radio if you have them.
GPS if you have one (just for comparison, not for running the course).
Comfortable but rugged/durable shoes (you'll be walking quite a bit...more if you mess up). :D
Clip board if you want.
Anything else that you deem required while you're walking for any distance. As we say in the Infantry "If you don't hump it; you don't have it" of course the down side to that is the more you bring, the more you carry.

I will publish a final reminder list as we get closer to the day as a reminder to everyone.
Just so that everyone knows, I will be out of the country for about the first 2-3 weeks of September so, if you have questions or comments or concerns, ask me before I leave or wait until I return. I may or may not have internet access where I am going and don't know what kind of time I wil have to do anything.

[GRUNT]

XJ - Sir, in your absence I will act as your XO... No worries, I have it all under control!
"Men/Women, as we prepare for battle it is imerative you have your gear ready. We will be going into harms way. Yes, it is true there will be danger. Look to your left, look to your right. Some of these people you see will not be returning... Lets keep our chins up and press through! We band of brothers, we merry few... Wha'? Oh for pete's sake we are about to step off, has anyone seen Amber?!" :p:rolleyes::D

[amber.hodge]

LOL I PASSED landnav the only time I did it 3 years ago.... :D We just failed RiverNav as a team :D

ArizonaXJ - Yes I do have a request...Bring me back some of that stuff that tastes like water but better and I'll pay you for it. :D Ben will worship the ground you walk on for it.

[jporvaz]

XJ - Sir, in your absence I will act as your XO... No worries, I have it all under control!
"Men/Women, as we prepare for battle it is imerative you have your gear ready. We will be going into harms way. Yes, it is true there will be danger. Look to your left, look to your right. Some of these people you see will not be returning... Lets keep our chins up and press through! We band of brothers, we merry few... Wha'? Oh for pete's sake we are about to step off, has anyone seen Amber?!" :p:rolleyes::D


LMAO. I needed a good laugh.

[Andrew F]

So, what you're saying is that you don't want it to be the weekend before midterms, right?

Haha, exactly.

I have a Calc 2 cource follow by a Differential Equations course follow by Physics for engineering followed by a Biological Engineering and Systems. In addition to that I have a Physics lab, but I think that will be fun.

I am hoping that I can make it that weekend. Do you need to know for sure if I will be there, or if I sign up and can't make it, will that be ok? I don't want to sign up and then flake out and have it be an issue or cause problems.

[GRUNT]

...I have a Calc 2 cource follow by a Differential Equations course follow by Physics for engineering followed by a Biological Engineering and Systems. In addition to that I have a Physics lab, but I think that will be fun....
Whoa, easy there big fella! Don't get all crazy on us now...:eek: Does this mean you'll come out there and build a compass with water, a twig and a polarized rock? Using the sun as a reference and start firing off linear equations to reference true or magnetic North?! :D

[amber.hodge]

You can't do that Grunt!!?? And here I thought you were a highly qualified XO.... :D
LOL

[FrenchChili]

I can do "classroom" but I doubt I can make "hands on"

[ROCRWLR]

Originally Posted by amber.hodge
I am so jealous of you marines... Sure I like the Army and I miss my lil boat from when I was in the Navy but I sure would like to have a set of Dress Blues...


whats wrong with the navy? The Marines are a sub division on the Navy. sems to me the secretary of the Navy runs the marines also.:D

Dean

[Fire Ball]

I get my Oct. schedule on the 16th of Sept. If I'm off sign me up :D Sorry but I can't give you a solid yes or no till then.

Bill

[Wayco]

Originally Posted by amber.hodge
I am so jealous of you marines... Sure I like the Army and I miss my lil boat from when I was in the Navy but I sure would like to have a set of Dress Blues...


whats wrong with the navy? The Marines are a sub division on the Navy. sems to me the secretary of the Navy runs the marines also.:D

Dean

Yes Dean, the Marines are a Department of the Navy, THE MEN'S DEPARTMENT.... :D

[amber.hodge]

That's why I was in the navy - I'm a girl :)

[My Green Jeep]

Walt and would like to go but...

I want to go to the Jeep Jamboree at
Airpark... :(

[amber.hodge]

.

[GRUNT]

AMBER!!! I think you should check with XJ before you start rescheduling things, after all you talked XJ into teaching and he sounds like he has started making plans. Head him off at the pass early if you are thinking a change.... My 2 cents

[amber.hodge]

Good lookin Grunt. :) will contact him. I think we have a great class, I think it will be much more beneficial and fun than a jamboree at a dealership - but I understand we'll lose some people because of it - just like we would have lost people if we pushed it back to november and holiday season.

I think this day will work...

[jporvaz]

Post it on the calendar

[amber.hodge]

doing that right now...

[TAGIPURIT!!!]

Good lookin Grunt. :) will contact him. I think we have a great class, I think it will be much more beneficial and fun than a jamboree at a dealership - but I understand we'll lose some people because of it - just like we would have lost people if we pushed it back to november and holiday season.

I think this day will work...

Why would I attend a class...when I can win free ****????


Urit

[Wayco]

Why would I attend a class...when I can win free ****????


Urit

Obviously, education was wasted on you. :rolleyes:

[TAGIPURIT!!!]

Obviously, education was wasted on you. :rolleyes:

I passed 10th grade:D

TAG:eek:

[GRUNT]

Obviously, education was wasted on you. :rolleyes:

Zing...
I understand him though. I went to the one last year even though I was not in the run. Good time. It was neat to look at everyone's jeeps... Strange though that the TJ guys wouldn't talk to me after they saw me pull in the lot w/ my YJ...

[amber.hodge]

Okay, ummmmm I'm sure trying to win a raffle and then not winning will really help if you get broken down some day in the middle of nowhere, Tag...

[TAGIPURIT!!!]

Zing...
I understand him though. I went to the one last year even though I was not in the run. Good time. It was neat to look at everyone's jeeps... Strange though that the TJ guys wouldn't talk to me after they saw me pull in the lot w/ my YJ...

Dude....no problems with YJ's....A jeep is a jeep:confused:

Okay, ummmmm I'm sure trying to win a raffle and then not winning will really help if you get broken down some day in the middle of nowhere, Tag...

I'l just do what you do...Cry for help;)

TAG

[ArizonaXJ]

XJ - Sir, in your absence I will act as your XO... No worries, I have it all under control!
"Men/Women, as we prepare for battle it is imerative you have your gear ready. We will be going into harms way. Yes, it is true there will be danger. Look to your left, look to your right. Some of these people you see will not be returning... Lets keep our chins up and press through! We band of brothers, we merry few... Wha'? Oh for pete's sake we are about to step off, has anyone seen Amber?!" :p:rolleyes::D


Too funny......carry on!!!!!!
You have the CON:eek:

[ArizonaXJ]

Whoa, easy there big fella! Don't get all crazy on us now...:eek: Does this mean you'll come out there and build a compass with water, a twig and a polarized rock? Using the sun as a reference and start firing off linear equations to reference true or magnetic North?! :D



You forgot "grid north"!!!!!!!

[ArizonaXJ]

Yes Dean, the Marines are a Department of the Navy, THE MEN'S DEPARTMENT.... :D


D***, I'm feeling the love in this group!!!!!!
I guess I better wear my uniform for this class in hopes to at least maintain some resemblance of order & professionalism during the day....this group I fear will be worse then the DOC when I taught them :eek:....and let me tell you, they were a rowdy and ornery little group.

[GRUNT]

You forgot "grid north"!!!!!!!

Crap, I should have known you'd catch that.... :mad:

[amber.hodge]

I'l just do what you do...Cry for help;)

TAG

Perhaps you should change "TAG" to "does not play well with others" "can't say anything nice" or just "azz clown" :D lol :D

[KennethS]

The only thing is, compasses are sometimes off! you have to check them out when you buy one.

OK, what do you mean by check it out, as in what should I be looking at/for?

I've always wanted to get a good lensatic compass, but so far I haven't because I already have a decent Silva compass. Now that I know it's an orienteering compass and won't do the job, I can justify getting a new one.

[WalterD]

Me and the wife are in. :) Airpark will be there next year.

[TAGIPURIT!!!]

Perhaps you should change "TAG" to "does not play well with others" "can't say anything nice" or just "azz clown" :D lol :D

Nice.....


Would be Nice if your Tj could float.........

Good luck with your retard training:rolleyes:


URIT

[AZG23]

Nice.....

Good luck with your retard training:rolleyes:


URIT

Not cool.......I know who you are....even hiding behind this fake name....not cool.:rolleyes:

[amber.hodge]

Nice.....


Would be Nice if your Tj could float.........

Good luck with your retard training:rolleyes:


URIT

I guess when I have 2 different PMs about an identity I take it as gospel. I guess I will assume that it is NOT Jason and say that I am sorry. I had 2 messages though - and both said it was Jason. Ademster and I last night were talking about this guy and thought it was Renob or PMFG - never woulda thought it was Jason without two someones telling me...

Anyway, sorry if it wasn't you, Jason - I'd be very curious to find out who's behind that name now, though.

[Jdemonto@Airpark Jeep Sales]

Fake name???? I don't hide behind any fake name......as you guys can tell some one is messin with you guys.......Not me..I spend way too much time on here to be accused of this...

PS. Most likly your friend PMFG or Renob..who knows

Jason:mad:

[Hardline]

Okay, I know who you are also, JASON DEMONTO, and I think its really low for you to hide behind a fake name and harrass people

I had wondered who was hiding behind the TAG screen name, and I guess the former PFmg whatever banned name.

Interesting to note.

[GRUNT]

Why would it be Jason?! It is not him......

[Jdemonto@Airpark Jeep Sales]

x2.....Its the Net..Unfortunatly this can happen to anyone:mad:


Jason

[AZG23]

Lol...

[amber.hodge]

Fake name???? I don't hide behind any fake name......as you guys can tell some one is messin with you guys.......Not me..I spend way too much time on here to be accused of this...

PS. Most likly your friend PMFG or Renob..who knows

Jason:mad:

:eek: Well, if it is not you, then 2 sources misinformed me. I'm sorry to throw a false accusation your way if it is not you...:o

Brad? Who the hell is TAG???? :o

[Curly]

It's a long way to go, but I have always wanted to know how to read more than a generic map. Depending on the dates you chose, count me in.

Curly

[KennethS]

The only thing is, compasses are sometimes off! you have to check them out when you buy one.

OK, what do you mean by check it out, as in what should I be looking at/for?


Uhh, sory to pull everyone back to the topic, but I really would like an answer to the above question before I go and spend $50-60 on a compass.
Anyone know what I should be looking for?

[ArizonaXJ]

OK, what do you mean by check it out, as in what should I be looking at/for?

I've always wanted to get a good lensatic compass, but so far I haven't because I already have a decent Silva compass. Now that I know it's an orienteering compass and won't do the job, I can justify getting a new one.


I should have posted this up sooner.
What you do is go to a store that sells lensatic compasses, military version preferred. Ask to see one. Take it out of the box/packaging. Open it up and "shoot" an azimuth to an object. I used a telephone pole across the street from the surplus store. MAKE SURE THAT YOU ARE AWAY FROM METAL when doing this. remember the azimuth you just shot. Set the compass down and ask to see another one. Repeat the process of shooting the azimuth again to the SAME object. Remember that azimuth now also. Repeat this process at least 3-5 times (check out 3-5 compasses is what I am saying. More if they vary a lot and if the clerk isn't getting irritated). Once you have checked at least 3-5 compasses, remembering their azimuths to the object of choice. Out of 5 compasses you should have at least 3-4 that are within 1-3 degrees of each other. It would not surprise me that you would have one that had a 5-7 degree variance from the others. This is the one that you buy to give as a present to your "favorite" in law for when they go camping!!! In any case, if you looked at 5 and 3-4 of them were within a degree or two of each other, buy one of them.

[KennethS]

Thanks for the info.

Is this still on Oct 13 and 14? I found that on the 4th page of posts, but wasn't certain if there was an update buried in the remaining pages. Perhaps the dates could be added to Amber's first post on page 1? That would make it a lot easier than wading through 7+ pages of stuff to locate the date.

[ArizonaXJ]

Yes, we are still on for the 13-14th of October.
I hope that everyone that said they would show up does still do so since I just realized the other day that the first day of quail season is the 12th. :eek:
I am looking forward to seeing everyone, meeting some more members and trying to put more faces & names together.

Just as an FYI for anyone looking for any more information regarding this. I will be out of the country for a couple of weeks beginning tomorrow the 7th of September. IF I can get internet service where I will be, I will try to check in on this class. However, If I can't, bear with me and I will check in on this as soon as possible when I get back.

[DLT]

Sorry guys I posted I could go and would reall love to but forgot about a prior commitment on those days.
Thanks Dave

[amber.hodge]

I'm excited - can't wait for this. Everyone still able to go out of the original interests besides those who posted otherwise?

[jporvaz]

I'm still in. Just need to go find a ????compass and other stuff. I printed ArizonaXJ's list- just got to go some of it.

[amber.hodge]

Lensatic compass - Bass pro shops - or have Ben pick one up for you (we get 15% military discount at Bass)

[KennethS]

I'm still in. Just need to go find a ????compass and other stuff. I printed ArizonaXJ's list- just got to go some of it.
Same here. My co-worker said I can borrow his compass, but I really need my own.

[Kelly P]

Cant make it:( please remove me from the list. Thanks

[Andrew F]

Not going to be in attendance either, please remove my name from the list. Thanks for putting it on, though.

[amber.hodge]

I asked my readiness a while ago if drill was the first weekend in the month of October. He said that sounded right. Verified today...it is the weekend of this event. I was excused from drill last month because of the surgery Remi had......I don't want to ask it to be rescheduled on my behalf. Jim - what do you want to do? Roll with this and then you can take me another time, or since this is an officially taught military course on a military post....? Also, if the 198th RSG is drilling that weekend that means that the 259 Engineers, 2220th, 1404th, 222nd, 2222nd, 3666, etc will be drilling also....

[My Green Jeep]

Lensatic compass - Bass pro shops - or have Ben pick one up for you (we get 15% military discount at Bass)

Amber what would the cost be for Ben to pick it up?

[amber.hodge]

Yeah, I'm sure he can do that or if Walter wants to meet him at the store either this Saturday or something, that would work too. Ben and I both have drill during this class. DOH!!!! :( :( :( :mad:

[My Green Jeep]

Yeah, I'm sure he can do that or if Walter wants to meet him at the store either this Saturday or something, that would work too. Ben and I both have drill during this class. DOH!!!! :( :( :( :mad:

Let me see what is going on... there is a military surplus store that I am going to and see what they have...

[WalterD]

So is this a go or a no go?

[Duality]

I was a nerdy home schooled kid that drew topographic maps "accurately" on areas based soley on memory. I can read a map... to the point that when I was 6 I told my parents which turn to take to get to a certain point... witout reading anything, but I would like to learn what is being taught beacause you can never learn too much.

[KennethS]

I don't want to ask it to be rescheduled on my behalf. Jim - what do you want to do?
For the record, I am OK with rescheduling, if that is being considered.

[ArizonaXJ]

As of today I am still inclined to go with what we have planned. However, if rescheduling is something that would benefit the collective group, let me know ASAP so that we can get the word out to everyone. I know that the following weekend is out for me due to military obligations October 20-21.
With that being said; IF THE GROUP WANTS TO RESCHEDULE, PM ME THE DATES THAT YOU WOULD WANT TO BE CONSIDERED. I will go with what the majority asks for.


Jim

[Bill Ritter]

I am O.K. with a reschedule,date don't matter.

Let us know.

I'll go to the AirPark Poker Run instead.

Bill

[My Green Jeep]

I am O.K. with a reschedule,date don't matter.

Let us know.

I'll go to the AirPark Poker Run instead.

Bill

X2

Just let us know as soon as you can, thanks!!!

[ArizonaXJ]

As of today I am going to continue with this as scheduled for the 13th & 14th provided that those that are signed up are still game and going to be there. I see where a couple have dropped out but if 50% or better is still game, I will still teach.
I would appreciate it if everyone could let me know if they are still in or out.
Thanks,
Jim

[Bill Ritter]

I'm in.

Bill

[mbuckner]

I am still in .......

I do I tell if I have the correct compass required ???

Best regards,

Mike

[jporvaz]

I'm in

[WalterD]

WalterD and MyGreenJeep IN

[ArizonaXJ]

Looking back at some of the posts guys....don't get too hung up on a compass for this class. I'll get some for you to use for the class. You really will only need it for Sunday's portion any way when we go to Florence for the actual hands on, walk your butt off portion.
After Saturday you will be able to see exactly what you may want. I am partial to the military style lensatic since that is what i have been using since 1983.....no, not the same one for all of those years.

[amber.hodge]

You know my situation. If I can split train for the course, then I will be there in military uniform.

[jperez]

hey yall! I would really like to attend this nav class but.... i wont be able to make it that weekend.... will there be any more of these or do you know of any others that I can attend in the future?!

Thanx!

[jporvaz]

Jim, just a couple posts ago I said I was in- that may change. Don't count on me being the deciding vote whether to go with this. I probably won't know for sure until late this week or early next week. Sorry. - JP

[amber.hodge]

I am a no-go for this date. My unit will not let me split train for the land navigation, but I will be cut loose to be my command sergeant major's driver to attend ben's unit's dining out and the change of command ceremony. I'll be out of the net this weekend. Perhaps keep with this weekend and then we can form another one for March or February to pick up any stragglers - I will be fresh out of my 2 week Warrior Leadership Course in Utah and will be able to assist in instruction at that point. :(

[ArizonaXJ]

I will be willing to put on another one in the future. I cannot and will not commit at this date but I will do another.

Just one thing....for those of you that attend, I am trying to scare up some maps for you to keep.....they may or may not be of areas that mean anything to you i.e: an area that you wheel or hunt in, etc. but hey, you'll have some thing to show for your time besides a new skill.

John, no sweat my friend if you can't make it. I understand. We still have to get a chance to wheel together.....

For the others that are bowing out, just let me know as well. No harm no foul.


Amber.....don't let your britches get too big young lady. Yes, you will learn at WLC but, I have been doing this since 1983........ AND I started out in the Infantry.......AND, I'm instructor qualified!!!!!!


I am a no-go for this date. My unit will not let me split train for the land navigation, but I will be cut loose to be my command sergeant major's driver to attend ben's unit's dining out and the change of command ceremony. I'll be out of the net this weekend. Perhaps keep with this weekend and then we can form another one for March or February to pick up any stragglers - I will be fresh out of my 2 week Warrior Leadership Course in Utah and will be able to assist in instruction at that point. :(

[amber.hodge]

No - I don't want to teach - just help - lol - like walk with someone to points or help with stuff. :D

[cross_007]

I cannot make it that weekend....sorry.

[GRUNT]

I will be fresh out of my 2 week Warrior Leadership Course in Utah and will be able to assist in instruction at that point. :(

LOL, does the Army have a class for everything?! :D j/k Amber... I am amazd though that they can teach you "warrior leadership" in two weeks...?! For the Green Beret pipeline the Army says I have to go to a Leadership course, they will not accept that I was a platoon sgt. in the Marines and in charge of 50 marines for several years. Apparently they have a class that will get me all NCO'd up in a couple of weeks?!

[GRUNT]

Amber, why are you bailing out of this class?! Wasn't this class your doing?!?!?! :eek:

[ArizonaXJ]

Yes, the class was her idea....however, as a young E5 she hasn't learned the importance of a calendar and marking things down on it :):eek::):eek:
I will get her schooled up good and proper later..........Just kidding Amber....you and Ben will have to attend the next class......and yes, if you know enough, I will use you as an AI..........
Grunt YJ, For your other question though, yes, the Army has a class for everything! and then some.

[WalterD]

I have to work sunday. So me and My Green Jeep are out.

[Bill Ritter]

I am going to bow out of this class and take the next class.

Bill

[JACC]

If it is still going on I would like to attend both days

[jporvaz]

Jim, I have to bail out due to work and personal reasons. Sorry. See you on the next one.

[mbuckner]

Hello ...

Has the schedule, time, location, etc. been finalized?

I did not see it in all the postings .. I may have overlooked
it ....

Best regards,

Mike

[My Green Jeep]

Okay everyone. It looks as though we will be going for October 13 & 14. The 13th will be "classroom" and the 14th will be the "hands on" practical application in Florence. I really didn't want to do this weekend but it seems as though it is the best for everyone else, so......that is what we will go with.
Now, for the time being I am going to say that the classroom portion will / should start at 0800 on Saturday the 13th. This will or could last a good eight hours. Depends on how serious everyone is about learning this stuff and if they have any problems getting it down. Now if everyone gets it pretty quick, it won't take as long. I am thinking about holding the class at my unit down at 52nd street and McDowell rd. I think that that is a fair middle ground for all involved.
The hands on portion in Florence will be the following morning, Sunday the 14th. I haven't thought about a start time for that yet. However, plan on being out there for a few hours.
If this is looking good for all interested, let me know. I like to think that this far enough in advance for some of you to make the required scheduling adjustments that your busy lives require. I didn't want to push this into November because of the holiday season.


Mike...
There ya go... had to dig for it but I knew it was in there... somewhere :rolleyes:

[My Green Jeep]

I have to work sunday. So me and My Green Jeep are out.

Sorry guys... would like to attend but with Walt working and me still being on "house arrest" because of the surgery... its better we wait for the next class... have fun and learn lots!!!!

[SEDONA RICK]

I will not be able to attend this class. Maybe next time.

[Gil T. Azell]

Oops. Can't make this one. I'll watch for the next one.

[KennethS]

I am thinking about holding the class at my unit down at 52nd street and McDowell rd.
Does anyone have more precise directions that this? It would be nice to know exactly where I am going.

[ademster]

You cant miss it... it's the Army reserve base...

If your heading east on MCdowell You'll come up to 52nd street... and on your left you will see Pagago Army Reserve base there pull up to the gate... tell them your there with who ever is putting this on...

they'll direct you through.

[GRUNT]

Just don't go to the "other gate" or they will mow you down with machine gun fire!


j/k

[ArizonaXJ]

Okay everyone.....here we go. Final time, location etc.....

Who: Who ever shows up!!!
What: Map Reading class
When: Saturday the 13th of October at 0800
Where: 5425 E. McDowell Rd. Phoenix, AZ. 85008-3429
How: Military style is the teaching method
Why: Because someone asked me if I could and would do this for the club


Directions for getting to the class.......

From 52nd street and McDowell RD. go EAST on McDowell. Prior to going up between the buttes you will come to an intersection with traffic light. this is BUSHMASTER....you will want to go SOUTH (right turn) onto BUSHMASTER. Stop at the gate, show the guard your ID (driver's license is good) tell them that you are here to attend a class being put on by SFC (Sergeant First Class) James Branton from the 153rd FA Brigade. If the guard has an issue; call me on my cell at 602-672-4312. Assuming that the guard has no issues and lets you continue, follow the road around to the right. As you are headed back WEST you will begin to go down hill. Prior to going too far down hill you will see a parking lot to your left (South). turn into that parking lot and park anywhere in the front of the building. DO NOT go around to the North or South end of the building to park. Between the 105mm howitzer and the Large black horse statue there is a set of double doors with glass. That is the entrance to the building that you want. The room that the class is going to be held in is just inside those doors on the left hand side.

IF the gate is closed, call me.
IF the guard gives you a hard time, call me.


While "on base" a few do's and dont's....

No cell phone use unless handsfree.
Seatbelts must be worn at all times.
There will be other soldiers from other units in the area drilling.....if they ask you who you are, what you're doing, you can tell them. If they start to give you an attitude; refer them to me.

We will take hourly breaks and we will break for lunch. If you want to bring something, you can. We do have refrigerators and a microwave. If you want coffee in the classroom, speak now and I will make sure that there is a coffee pot in there.
You will be able to snack while the class is going on.....HOWEVER, I don't want the maps getting messed up by sodas getting spilled and such. They are not all mine and I do need to keep these for teaching this class.

Any questions, shoot me a PM or call me. If you're running late on Saturday, call me and I will hold up for you. Not for ever but for a few minutes.

See ya all Saturday,
Jim

[ArizonaXJ]

Just don't go to the "other gate" or they will mow you down with machine gun fire!


j/k

We're artillery.....we doon't use machine guns......we use 155MM HOWITZERS!!!!!!!!

[KennethS]

And that is EXACTLY why I asked for precise directions!

[ArizonaXJ]

Okay folks....the course is set up at Florence......off of Cottonwood Canyon Road for Sunday.
I will be at the unit (52nd Street & McDowell Rd.) at 0800 tomorrow ready to teach. I guess that I needn't bring the coffee pot since no one has said anything about it......
I will have a few "things" for those in attendance :) Sorry, I won't be handing out winches or new shocks or even tow straps....just a little something that you may appreciate:confused:

You guys and gals have my number if you need to talk to me.

Wear what you want on Saturday but for Sunday I reccomend hiking boots and jeans.....too dang much cacti down there in Florence:eek:

Jim

[GRUNT]

We're artillery.....we doon't use machine guns......we use 155MM HOWITZERS!!!!!!!!

OUCH! Nothing left for evidence then huh! LOL, BOOM!:D

[FrenchChili]

For good reasons I can't go. I know I'm posting at 2am but no I didn't party. Enjoy

[JACC]

I just wanted to thank Jim for taking time out of his weekend to teach us today. I learned alot and can't wait for Sunday's class.

[KennethS]

Same here. Thank you very much Jim, I really appreciate your time and efforts. Also, thanks to Amber for the sodas, that was very thoughtful of you. I have been working the quizzes and final exam and I think (hope?) I am ready for the field exercises. Gotta get some sleep now so can make it there on time tomorrow morning!

[mbuckner]

A salute to Jim for taking his personal time on Saturday and Sunday for the "Land Navigation" class ....... I was exposed to a different way to naviagate ........

Thanks Amber for bringing in the refreshments on Saturday ........

Best regards,

Mike

[ArizonaXJ]

Where to begin???

Ah, first things first....
Congrats to the 3 people that showed up!
Mike, Ken, and Jason.......they did an outstanding job with learning from a new and condensed version of what I usually teach in the Army. They did an excellent job of working through the conversions and so-on and reconciling their discrepancies when they were outside of standards down in Florence. They also thought out of the box and asked me some questions that I am having to find the answers for!!! It has been a LONG, LONG time since that has happened in map reading. I also wish to thank them for showing up or else I would have REALLY, REALLY wasted my time.

Now for the rant........I had 28 people say that they would be there. Then I had some drop outs.....notified me in advance and that was fine. Then I had a couple people PM asking if they could still attend with such short notice and all and I said sure.......So, a little time getting my supplies together. Called in a favor or two to get some additional maps and training aids.....TWO 135 mile round trips to Florence from my house for the class. One to mark out the the course and make it challenging but not too bad. Even gave the points Jeep names, I.E. Willys, CJ, XJ, etc.....entertainment/enjoyment factor....Second trip for the practical application field portion. I selected my unit for the class for several reasons....central location being the main thing for everyone attending. Why did I pick Florence for the field portion? Because everyone likes to go to Florence to wheel.....Also a good training area for such a thing.
Then to top it all off, I missed the opening weekend of Quail season!!!!

Next time, IF there is to be a next time, I will pick dates, times, locations that are convenient to me. I must admit that I was very, very disappointed.


Jim


PS....thanks Amber for the sodas. And no, I'm not mad at you for not attending. You had a reason for not being there and let me know in advance......

[amber.hodge]

Well, it was really saddening to me to see that the turn out was low out of the initial tickler for interest, especially knowing how much trouble has to be gone to on the instructor's part to guarantee a successful official Army course trained to standard.

I was happy to see that there were at least a couple of people who turned up and that they were interested and having a good time. (2 pretty rigs in the parking lot during drill).

I came in to visit after grading a PT test at my unit, and as the ladies locker room was right across from the classroom, I got to stop back in once I was changed out in my ACU's. Soda was the least I could do after getting this whole thing together and then getting bad drill dates...Columbus day threw me off - we never drill on holiday weekends and as I don't even consider Columbus Day a federal holiday when looking at a calendar (forgot it still is for military).

I really would like to see another course be put together, though, SFC B.....

I'll have company and stuff throughout November, December is bad for everyone usually, First week of Jan is 1st wedding anniversary (I keep forgetting if it was the 2nd or 3rd of January we got married - must find marriage certificate so Ben doesn't find out!!), the rest of January, I'll be in Utah for Warrior Leadership Course......
February is good.....March until the 15th is good....then 18 March or so I go to San Francisco for a month for Human Resources MOS Transition Course.....

I guess that leaves me available Feb and early March or Late April through June excluding drill weekends and additional A/T days for upcoming FY09 Deployment to Western Iraq near the Iran Border.....I guess nobody can accuse me of having no life...I wish I could have less of one!!

[XJ Un-Limited]

I'll be in Utah for Warrior Leadership Course......

Is that what was formerly known as Primary Leadership Development Course or PLDC?

Man things in the Army sure are changing.

Sorry to hear the land nav. class wasn't very well attended. For those who didn't make it, it is a good thing to have at least a general knowledge of. Technology has a tendency to leave your butt hanging when you need it most. Plus it's just good times to get out there and see how well you can find your next point, really fun when you don't find it and have to backtrack! :eek: I would have liked to attend the class to have my old army skills refreshed, but right now, my fiance is due to have our baby boy within the next few weeks. Perhaps next time, if there is one.

[amber.hodge]

Yes, Warrior Training Course has replaced Primary Leadership Development Course, here is the course description:

The Warrior Leader Course (WLC) is branch immaterial. The conduct of the course takes place in an NCO Academy live-in environment IAW the small group instruction (SGI) process. It consists of minimal classroom dynamics and practical application with an intense field training environment that involves hands-on, performance-oriented training. The course graduates leave equipped with standards-based, performance-oriented, battle-focused training that supports squad level operations. It provides the Army with a leader who can visualize, describe, and execute squad level operations in varied operational environments. It is a leader course that produces a predictive, adaptive, and innovative combat leader capable of leading Soldiers in any situation. The instructional design and methods of delivery consists of face-to-face instruction, learner-centered outcomes, based on today's contemporary operational environment (COE), and used to reinforce all small unit tactics, techniques, and procedures (TTPs). The course incorporates recent lessons learned, the 9 battle drills, 39 warrior tasks with the inclusion of weapons immersion, and a 96-hour situational training exercise (STX). The STX centers on competency, battle focused combat scenarios, and troop-leading procedures. Evaluation centers on their ability to demonstrate troop-leading procedures in current threat-based scenarios that will enhance their 360-degree assessment.


I'll be attending at Camp Williams, UT from January 4th to January 19th (meaning I'll be doing land navigation in 3 feet of snow)

[mbuckner]

Be sure and take your snorkle just in case you run into 3+feet of water ..:D

Mike

[ArizonaXJ]

Be sure and take your snorkle just in case you run into 3+feet of water ..:D

Mike


ROTFLMAO......that's funny....I don't care who you are, that's funny! Early spring thaw!!!!!!

[amber.hodge]

LOL won't need snorkel as my husband won't be driving up there.....besides, I don't think there will be any unfrozen water masses there at that time of year....maybe in detroit...but we know better than to try to drive across the detroit river :D

Now.......getting lost in the snow --- that COULD happen.....I've seen snow less times than I can count on my fingers........I guess that would explain why I stole some private's snow shovel and excitedly shoveled the sidewalks at Camp Navajo last January and why I was AMAZED at the marvel of salt with snow and ice. I'd never seen that before! So, yes, I'll probably die or get lost in Riverton, Utah, as I walk around in 2-3 feet of snow in gortex pants/jacket and boots freezing my arse off!

[GRUNT]

I have to take the Army "Warrior Leadership Course"(formerly PLDC) for my SF pipeline. They will not(big Army) give me an exception, even though the SF unit tried, for my prior service leadership. I guess being a Platoon Seargent for an entire platoon of Marines is not experience enough.

[amber.hodge]

LOL You have to go and learn the kinder gentler way - Are you in the reserves or guard? I didn't know you rejoined....! If you are in guard, you should go to the Jan 4-19 one so I know someone there!

[GRUNT]

It is all beauricratic crap/hoops that big army makes everyone jump through, you should know that! So I have to suck it up... I am tentative to start the SF pipeline. I was signing with the 19th out of Utah but a team lead is moving to the 20th out of Florida. He wants his Team SGT. (MSGT, my coworker) to go with him and that guy wants me to join him there... He has two of us re-enlisting to do this. The hard part is getting the logistics set up with my current employer. They have stated they would support me all the way, the bad part is the dates for all the courses are hard to line up if you must take a break between. A break is not advised or condusive to the training but if I go for the several months straight that it would be for me(prior service, as opposed to over a yr for new enlistee) it would affect my status and may need to take a seperation vs. a leave? Still trying to hammer it out. LOL, either way it wouldn't be joining you this January. You should try to get a jump-school slot for late 08 and we can do that together! :D "C-130 rollin' down the strip..." I have been conditioning for this for sometime and a little extra remedial training never hurt anyone, just sucks having to takie time off of work too.

[amber.hodge]

You never have to take a separation. There is federal statutes dating back to 1975 which state that even for volluntary military service, you can be gone for up to 5 years from your employer and MUST be reinstated at the same or greater pay and status, and you also must be given the same benefits, your seniority and raises must accumulate as if you were there the entire time. It is always leave unless you go beyond that 5 year mark. Also, any training on new equipment/procedures/SOPs/etc must be given to you upon your return at no penalization to you.
Punishment for a civilian employer not abiding by this is a 300.00 fine (a lot in 1975 but not much now) and 30 days in jail (still as horrid as it was in 1975).
I'm sure as a SFC you know this, as you'd have to in order to take care of your troops below you, but from you stating separation over leave I figured I'd throw it out there. When I was a recruiter, I had to go over this with any new member which I enlisted as I hate to see uninformed privates go and quit their jobs before basic and AIT and then come back without a job in 6 months to do 1 weekend a month drills.

For instance, I am a military student counselor for University of Phoenix in my civilian job, but I have not been there since September of 2006 and do not plan on returning until 2009. I'll still have the raises, seniority and my same or better job back at that time. :D As long as I am not gone more than 4 years, 11 months and 29 days, I'm in the clear!

[TanTJJim]

Where to begin???

Ah, first things first....
Congrats to the 3 people that showed up!

I'm so sorry I wasn't able to show up for this, especially after looking at the turnout. My computer has been down for almost a month and I never saw when the exact date was set. I was really looking forward to this class too. I'd at least like to thank you for all the effort you put into this Jim.

[ArizonaXJ]

I'm so sorry I wasn't able to show up for this, especially after looking at the turnout. My computer has been down for almost a month and I never saw when the exact date was set. I was really looking forward to this class too. I'd at least like to thank you for all the effort you put into this Jim.

I understand that things happen to people....I've had them happen to me! I was just expecting more like at least 10-15 people to show up. At least the three that did show were fun and learned quick......maybe next time they will tag along and be the AI's (assistant instructors)????

Ken?
Mike?
Jason?

Sound good to you guys????

[JACC]

Sounds good to me I would help out if we had another class

Jason

[brewmeister dan]

I'm a new member (first post!) but was a spectator for a couple years while this was azvjc.com I would love another chance at one of these classes. I'd have gone to the past one if I had seen it! Any time works for me! Look forward to meeting everyone! Got some real personalities here...

[ArizonaXJ]

I'm a new member (first post!) but was a spectator for a couple years while this was azvjc.com I would love another chance at one of these classes. I'd have gone to the past one if I had seen it! Any time works for me! Look forward to meeting everyone! Got some real personalities here...

That's putting it mildly!

[GRUNT]

That's putting it mildly!

x2! ;)

[ArizonaXJ]

x2! ;)


He obviously hasn't read the "Under-equipped rigs" thread has he?

[defibvt]

I would love to learn land navigation by a professional. When I was in Scouts we used a compass all the time and I found it a fun challenge. I would love to build on those skills. I missed the last one so I will wait patiently.

[ArizonaXJ]

Well, I will probably do another.....I'm working on getting some extra maps for the "students" to keep upon graduation....Various sections of Arizona, Utah, California, Texas, whatever I can lay my grubby paws on.....

Mike, Jason, Kevin, you guys ready for some more?

[JACC]

Mike, Jason, Kevin, you guys ready for some more?

Any time.

Jason

[mbuckner]

I am interested ......... BUT .......

It depends on the dates ...

Elk and deer hunts coming up ...
Christmas tree cutting.....
Annual inventory at work 03-Nov
And I committed to a run on 10-Nov ....

What dates did you have in mind?

Best regards,

Mike

[KennethS]

Ken?
Mike?
Jason?

Sound good to you guys????


Mike, Jason, Kevin, you guys ready for some more?

I'm in, unless I got replaced because I didn't respond quickly enough.

[ArizonaXJ]

OOOPS, sorry.

[jeffrey1055]

I would like to attend your next class.

[brewmeister dan]

So now that it's still nice out and we're not making glass out there yet, any chance to get this class resurrected?

[ArizonaXJ]

Possibly......it all depends on GUARANTEED attendance.
Last time I had 20+ say they would be there and when the time came, I had 3!
I will NOT put myself out like that again. Grant it, the 3 that showed up were good students and great guys but still. I drove 140+ miles round trip twice, not to mention time and effort, etc.

Sort of like the White Tanks clean up that I started 2-3 months ago.....on, off, on, off......
I don't do flaky crap very well anymore.
Guaranteed, Absolute, Promised or Forget it!

[amber.hodge]

I think as long as you post it on a day other than April 20th or mother's day or drill you'd definitely get us there.

[sms1688]

I think as long as you post it on a day other than April 20th or mother's day or drill you'd definitely get us there.

Damn you already have 3 excuses I am sure you could come up with some more.

[ArizonaXJ]

Damn you already have 3 excuses I am sure you could come up with some more.

No kidding Amber......come on, ou can come up with a couple of more can't you?

[wolfman]

I would attend