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View Full Version : New Landfill off Cottonwood RD in FJ ???



RokNRich
07-19-2007, 09:19 PM
Meetings next week ??

Anyone have the scoop ?????

Usually this site has pretty good info regarding these issues, any reason it's not being passed along here ?

Swiped from elsewhere:


ALERT...........
The notice below is in reference to stopping a proposed "Landfill" located within the MGCP (Florence Junction) area. The MGCP has been working for nearly 7 years to develop a "recreation/cultural/historical/scenic" area for the citizens of Arizona. Pinal County has included this area in their "Open Space" planning and it has been included in the "20 Year Trails Plan". Pinal County helped fund (along with State Land Dept) the Morrison Inst. to do the Superstition Vistas "vision" for the State Land surrounding this area. The Morrison Inst. agreed with the MGCP in keeping this area for Open Space and recreation.

Now Pinal County wants to rezone 600 plus acres of private land that is for sale to allow a landfill develop. The Florence Junction (MGCP) area is probably contains more recreational trails; cultural petroglyphs, and/or historical credits than anywhere else in the state. Cottonwood Canyon would be paved with NUMEROUS large trucks in and out daily.................... do we want it to look like A.J. with this massive scar along the horizon?

Actually, it would be a great place to develop an OHV park in that most is rock or slab rock................. ????? $$$$$$

Please help keep this area pristene for recreation and outdoor enjoyment......................

IT IS REQUESTED AS MANY CITIZENS AS POSSIBLE ATTEND THE MEETING NEXT TUESDAY........................ OHV: WEAR RED IF POSSIBLE.................... PLEASE FORWARD THIS MESSAGE ON TO YOUR MAIL LISTS. THANKS FOR YOUR HELP.......................



YOUR HELP IS NEEDED TO SAVE OUR DESERTS (FLORENCE JUNCTION)

WHAT: An Open House to Discuss a
Proposed NEW REGIONAL LANDFILL
In Pinal County

WHERE: Florence High School Cafeteria
1001 S Willow Street
Florence, AZ 85232

WHEN: Tuesday, July 24, 2007

TIME: 7:30 PM to 8:30 PM
SPONSORED BY: UNKNOWN

LANDFILL LOCATION: A private parcel completely surrounded by BLM land that contains ecological, historical, and cultural resources. The site is located 13 miles NE of Florence just south of Florence Junction, 6 miles east of SR 79 through the Planned Superstition Vistas, off Cottonwood Canyon Road.

IS THIS LANDFILL SITE IN YOUR BACK YARD?
The answer should be a resounding YES by all Arizona residents.

WHY? Located in the Middle Gila Canyons Area, the Landfill will destroy hundreds of acres of Pristine Desert land, disturb and destroy animal habitats and methods of feeding, interfere with the many recreationists visiting the Middle Gila Canyon Area for hunting, camping, hiking, sightseeing, OHV riding, and driving for pleasure.

IS THIS NEW LANDFILL NEEDED? This answer is a resounding NO because Allied WasteĘs Cactus Waste Landfill and Waste ManagementĘs Butterfield Landfill have sufficient capacities to accommodate all the waste materials from Pinal, Pima, and Maricopa Counties and all the expected new population growth for a minimum of 100 years and probably longer.

HOW IS THIS POSSIBLE? Both Waste companies are willing to build Transfer Stations at strategic locations near major populations. Waste material is compacted at a Transfer Station and trucked to the landfill every day. No Waste material remains overnight at a Transfer Station. This simple and easy solution to the disposition of our solid waste will save hundreds of acres of desert land as well as the recreation lands of the Middle Gila Conservation Area.

WHO SHOULD ATTEND THIS OPEN HOUSE: Everyone who has an interest in the future of our State, County and Region and cares about the lands of our Country.

FOR ADDITIONAL INFORMATION YOU MAY CONTACT:
Bonnie Bariola at saveourdeserts@yahoo.com

GRUNT
07-19-2007, 09:46 PM
Rich, are you going to the meeting? If so I may tag along with you... Caravan anyone?

RokNRich
07-19-2007, 09:52 PM
No, I will be out of town next week or I would try at least.

Don't let that stop you though, wear red. I've been to a few of these things, wear red, sign in, leave when it get's too boring :) ;) .

This isn't sounding too good though, plenty of other places to put a landfill besides there.

Allen
07-20-2007, 12:11 AM
I got a red shirt!!

Time to get them shirts on!!

I'll be there!

Allen
07-24-2007, 12:17 AM
How many people planning on showing??

Two red shirts dosnt seem like a big turnout!

Fire Ball
07-24-2007, 08:32 AM
Crap, I have been so busy with other things I just noticed this. I live right by the AJ land fill. Although I never smell it , nor do I usually notice Mt. AJ any more, I do see the impact it has on the surrounding area.

What I DO notice is the noise from vehicles coming and going all day. The sound of tractors working the pile at night. The garbage strewn along all roads accessing the landfill area from trucks with no tarps to hold in the garbage. People who come after hours or on Sunday when the land fill is closed and just dump their shat anywhere they feel it is OK since that is how they did it in their country.

I have solid plans for tonight but let me see if it will cause me a divorce if I change them :p

Tom Jacobson
07-24-2007, 12:37 PM
At first I thought I missed it...but it is tonight. (already thinking today is Weds!)

I could probably go without too much grief on the homefront. Would be interested in hopping a ride or carpooling down with someone, though. I'm in East Mesa, near Baseline/Power.

06GrnRubi
07-24-2007, 12:51 PM
Can I catch a ride with anyone?

Fire Ball
07-24-2007, 01:05 PM
My wife made dinner plans with her family a couple days ago. Missing it would put me in a bad way :D

Allen
07-24-2007, 01:57 PM
I'm coming from Queen Creek, so I'm not able to pick anyone up on the way. I'm already down here!

azcharlie
07-24-2007, 03:13 PM
I plan to make it.

Allen
07-24-2007, 04:39 PM
Soon as trailjocky gets here to pick up his Xterrain I'm on my way!

FrenchChili
07-24-2007, 06:11 PM
Dang..this is a bad week for me, I honestly don't have the gas money right now:(

Fire Ball
07-24-2007, 07:16 PM
Looks like I'll take one for the team and not go to dinner. I'm going down from the east valley. Any one want to carpool or wants to ride along I can meet you someplace like Goldfield road just off of the us 60 at the chevron gas station.

I'll be in a red F150 4 dr. Like about 6:40 pm

****** EDIT ****

Went to the meeting, there were quite a few red shirts there :)

This meeting was more like a "This is what we are doing screw you" informational meeting than anything else. Zoning isn't complete nor is it a go but there was a lot of opposition there I think. It has been a long time since I heard so much double talk. They would say whatever they thought you wanted to hear.

RokNRich
07-25-2007, 05:31 AM
Who was "they" ??

Anymore info ? Link ?

Thanks.

Sandee McCullen
07-29-2007, 11:56 PM
Comments please from those that attended the meeting. I'm getting two very different views.

Evidently some of the OHV representatives that attended are now FOR the landfill.

I would appreciate all views and interpretations of what was heard.

I'm meeting with the same leaders later this week to "hear" them out. I know one thing........... WORDS ARE CHEAP. If they're so positive about "helping OHV" it will be in writing or there's no way we should support anything they "mouth" to us.????

Fire Ball
07-30-2007, 11:57 AM
I asked Chuck about trucks driving in and dropping trash. He said all the trucks will be covered trucks coming from collections stations and will not be the trucks used for pickup.

I asked Venessa who is responsible for the transfer trucks, she said Allied waste and waste management. Are the transfer stations being planned right now? No.

When will they? When Allied Waste feels it is no longer pheasable to run the collection trucks they will build transfer stations. When will that be? I don't know, it is not up to us.

What about people who throw things away that are not supposed to be in there such as car batteries and chemicales. "It is against the law to dump those things. " How will that be enforced? "Not our responsibility, it is up to Allied waste"

What about all the trash that blows out of the land fill and falls off of vehicles. Chuck: " We will have a very agressive monitoring and litter control program. We will be responsible for keeping the area clean."

What does this control program look like ? Venessa " We will be required to pick up trash 2 days in each 90 day period and there will be a small fine for the trucks that aren't tarped."

I thought the trucks will all be covered trucks from transfer stations? Well we want them to be but it is not our responsibility, that belongs to the carrieres."

So if you send a couple prisoners from Florence out to pick up trash on days 89 and 90 and also day 1 and 2 for the following 90 day period, that would satisfy the requirement for 2 days every 90 day period and you don't have to do anything for 180 more days? "Yes"

So now not only do we have to worry about our desert being littered with plastic bags and other blowing garbage, we have to worry about our families being run over by speeding trucks and prisoners picking up garbage?

"The trucks won't be speeding because there will be posted speed limits"

Like the posted speed limit at the Tomahawk landfill? "Yes" They drive at least double that speed limit there are you aware of that? "Well it will be up to the county to police it not us"

Why not continue to use the land fill down south since it has so much capacity? " No one wants the pollution spread though Coolidge as all these trucks drive through" You mean the pollution from uncovered trucks and garbage flying all over? " Well uhm no, well yes but it won't happen here" Were those people told the same thing? "Here's my card if you have any more questions, thanks for coming "

I also asked Micheal how BLM feels about having this landfill thrown right in the middle of their land and he said they have no trouble with it.

I talked to a lady there I forget her name but she knows Sandy well and she said Francisco couldn't find anyone who was talking to them and hey were not really included in the decision of best use for this land.

I could go on but I think you get the point.

I'm not ALL against this landfill but there are a lot of unanswered questions:

Is this the best use for this land.
How many acres of pristine foothill desert will be plowed up out side of the mine site.
What is in place to protect the surrounding desert?
What will be in place to protect the hundreds off users in this area?
Why not put it on trust land that is already closed off to most users and just dig a deeper hole as to not make a mountain like Mount AJ.
Where is the water going to come for this site?
Is a new land fill even needed or is there sufficient capacity else where?
Why is Maricopa county so FOR this regional land fill here instead of their county?

azcharlie
07-30-2007, 05:59 PM
I attented this meeting last week. They really made it sound like a landfill out there would be a good thing for OHV since no one wants to build houses next to a landfill. One concern that was bought up was the saftey of OHV on the access road. That perhaps a new air down/parking area needed to be built closer to the landfill.

papajeep
07-30-2007, 09:06 PM
The best place for that new landfill is smack dab in the middle of florence.:eek:

amber.hodge
07-30-2007, 09:20 PM
Had a Chief Warrant Officer Ben works for go to the meeting on this. This has drawn Guard interest because we have the Florence Training Site there. There is also a range there. Chief is a wheeler and went to the meeting as a wheeler, however. He reported back that as a wheeler this did not sound as bad as some were making it out to be as currently there is only the Arizona Training Site Command weapons ranges/mount and lanes training sites/ land navigation for the Guard and a small scale cattle open range grazing.... They are talking about paving which will cut down the dust and they are not talking about cutting into any existing trails - only the entry/exit area at cottonwood where they plan to provide an additional air down spot at the back as the one up front would likely go bye-bye. The landfill being there would cut down the likelyhood of homes being built there, which will cause less encroachment into the natural environment. Between the noise from the range and the landfill - I don't see this becoming a desirable little mecca anytime soon. This is all what I got reported back to me from another wheeler who was originally very concerned before actually attending the meeting. Just my unsolicited .02

Sandee McCullen
08-19-2007, 09:50 PM
Florence Junction Landfill Update…….

A little background:
Just a couple of weeks ago we (the public) found out about a proposed landfill to be located on the private lands just inside the BLM lands south of Cottonwood Canyon Rd. No one knew anything about the supporting data nor had the applicants met with the Middle Gila Conservation Partnership (the group doing the route inventory, evaluations and planning for motorized trails. This group has been meeting for just over 7 years). The Pinal County Open Space planning as well as the Trails Planning have never been contacted either.

I was contacted about this and asked for the MGCP’s Vision Statement for this area along with the Goals and Objectives that were developed for this area to be maintained as a multi-use recreation area. An article was written for the Florence paper that simply contained facts or questions regarding the need; the timing; or how does it fit with the already planned uses of the Florence Junction area. There was nothing negative nor banning of the landfill site……… just facts or questions. This article truly set the applicants on the warpath.

As a result of this article the applicants did host a couple of public meetings…… one in Superior and one in Florence in the same night. A number of OHV recreationists attended the meeting in Florence (we didn’t even know of the Superior meeting). There were many questions asked………….. as well as many different answers given. There were a few from the OHV community that supported the plan with no questions asked. They felt the fact that the applicants offered a new staging area and were planning on paving Cottonwood Canyon was good enough for them. The fact regarding keeping tile roofs and golf courses away as well as allegedly guaranteeing access were thought to be substantive reasons to support this landfill. They were good thoughts and maybe founded but there were no guarantees to OHV on anything.

I was then brought into the picture and met several times with the applicants. It was made very clear we needed the offers in writing. They basically refused. They did however, make firm fact they felt the Zoning & Planning Commission would support them at the upcoming rezoning meeting the next week. (last Thursday). I had already contacted the Board of Supervisors and they all seemed to be 100% behind this plan and indicated they would support it as presented. When we asked for a couple of months to sit at the table and discuss some of the issues we were told an absolute “NO WAY”. This was a debatable issue but the OHV Coalition wrote a letter requesting the “rezoning” of this property be held off until the Pinal County Comprehensive Planning is complete. (Approx. 18 mths – 2 yrs). Applicants were NOT happy about this and at that time they "pulled the staging area out of the offer/plans". (Result of nothing in writing)

At this time both the Az OHV Coalition and the ASA4WDC felt if this was a done deal regarding rezoning, we had best at least try, to attach stipulations requiring a number of the issues be a part of the zoning itself.

Well…............. I must say I’m impressed with the Pinal County Planning group. They have been working diligently for the past 4-5 years on developing a sound plan for the future of Pinal County. They CONTINUED to do this on Thursday.

The Planning & Zoning Commissioners voted to ‘POSTPONE THE DECISION FOR 3 MONTHS REQUIRING MORE DATA INVOLVING THE NEED AS WELL AS THE STATUS OF THE EXISTING SURROUNDING LANDFILLS.” “WATER issues as well as HAZMAT issues were also asked for”. The applicants vehemently pushed for a “denial” vote in lieu of a postponement. WHY, you ask? If P&Z had denied the application they could have simply overstepped P&Z and taken it to the Board of Supervisors where they believe they are unanimously supported.

So, where does OHV sit in this? We MUST continuing meeting with the applicants with plans for a satisfactory staging area (they are offering only 2 acres); continue with the safety issues of concern; and the planning for the ‘protected’ area. The anti-access groups want this area (adjacent to the landfill itself) as a psuedo wilderness!!............ We need to show how we can "protect" the saguaros and have a trail system or play area at the same time.

Continued meeting with the users of this area was one of the stipulations that they agreed to so we’ll soon see whether they hold up their end of the bargain.

Goes back to P&Z in November so between now and then I will be having meetings to review plans and/or issues that will benefit OHV but still uphold the goals and objectives already planned for the area. Anyone interested in joining, please let me know.

Sandee
sandee@mccullens.com

DanFelix
08-19-2007, 10:16 PM
You may want to contact someone that I know who I spoke with about this project. As usual, the Pinal County big wigs want to increase revenue on a fee basis by taking on Maricopa County's trash. My view is that each county should take care of their own trash. This landfill is being approved in the closet after the Pinal County voters disapproved it.
Contact: Louis.Felix@co.pinal.az.us
He'll give you the straight scoop as of the last meeting, tell him "Jet" referred him to you. You might also want to mention AZVJC. Thanks and appreciate you're concern on this.

Sandee McCullen
08-19-2007, 11:21 PM
You may want to contact someone that I know who I spoke with about this project. As usual, the Pinal County big wigs want to increase revenue on a fee basis by taking on Maricopa County's trash. My view is that each county should take care of their own trash. This landfill is being approved in the closet after the Pinal County voters disapproved it.
Contact: Louis.Felix@co.pinal.az.us
He'll give you the straight scoop as of the last meeting, tell him "Jet" referred him to you. You might also want to mention AZVJC. Thanks and appreciate you're concern on this.

Not only did the applicants not produce FACTS or DATA or NUMBERS, there were several P&Z members that were vehemently against Maricopa using Pinal County landfills. I've also heard they cannot ban use so this is one fact I really need to follow out. The site at Mobile is mostly Maricopa........... I agree, let them find their own. They ban OHV, landfill or transfer stations, dust, use of your own lands and extend waivers to developers. hmmmmmmmmmmmm.............. too bad they didn't do some decent planning 20 years ago. Pinal County is trying!!!

I will contact Louis Felix. Thanks for the heads up. Feel free to join in the fight and pass on any information. EVERYONE THANKS.

FYI: AZOHVC is recognized as being a Charter Member of the AZOHVC. Name and numbers are recognized.

Sandee McCullen
08-20-2007, 12:44 AM
Had a Chief Warrant Officer Ben works for go to the meeting on this. This has drawn Guard interest because we have the Florence Training Site there. There is also a range there. Chief is a wheeler and went to the meeting as a wheeler, however. He reported back that as a wheeler this did not sound as bad as some were making it out to be as currently there is only the Arizona Training Site Command weapons ranges/mount and lanes training sites/ land navigation for the Guard and a small scale cattle open range grazing.... They are talking about paving which will cut down the dust and they are not talking about cutting into any existing trails - only the entry/exit area at cottonwood where they plan to provide an additional air down spot at the back as the one up front would likely go bye-bye. The landfill being there would cut down the likelyhood of homes being built there, which will cause less encroachment into the natural environment. Between the noise from the range and the landfill - I don't see this becoming a desirable little mecca anytime soon. This is all what I got reported back to me from another wheeler who was originally very concerned before actually attending the meeting. Just my unsolicited .02

Thanks Amber......... this probably was Doug Larson, member of the Classic Broncos. He had been for approving the landfill for all the mentioned reasons. He was right in all other than he was much too trusting. He did have the support of his club but he was the only club supporting this landfill unquestioned. I do not believe he feels this way today. I had met with Doug the day before the P&Z meeting and a group of us had lunch together that day discussing the underlying issues.......... i.e.: The applicants had told him, and others, they would donate the land and build a staging area. That lasted only as long as OHV jumped to their every whim. When they were ticked that the OHV Coalition had requested "time" and "more research of facts and data" they immediately PULLED THE STAGING AREA". Long story later, Doug was at the P&Z meeting and saw firsthand how the P&Z Commissioners "wanted more documentation and facts" and did not like having something crammed down their throats. Neither the OHV Coalition (of which AZVJC are Charter Members) or the ASA4WDC asked to deny the landfill site or plans. We just wanted more than "lip service". Maybe I've been working with the feds or the political field too long but "lip service" simply doesn't do it any longer. There must be compromise and trust from both sides and that was not a componant of this deal. I'm thinking it will now. Actually, probably not trust but they will listen to OHV. For some reason they really wanted OHV support.......... maybe because of our numbers but they also felt they "had us in their pocket due to the staging area and paving". Don't think they expected questions.

Hopefully we can keep the upper hand with our knowledge and compromise. Their lack of willingness to settle for anything outside their desires which will hurt them so I believe they will regroup over the next couple of months. Wondering how much smoke they'll try blowing this time.???

GRUNT
08-20-2007, 01:05 AM
I can attend with you Sandee. I live in Pinal Co. just east of Queen Creek and will attend any meetings with you. Lets tell maricopa to take their trash elsewhere! THey have all that land in the south near Gila Bend right?!

Sandee McCullen
08-20-2007, 01:17 AM
I can attend with you Sandee. I live in Pinal Co. just east of Queen Creek and will attend any meetings with you. Lets tell maricopa to take their trash elsewhere! THey have all that land in the south near Gila Bend right?!

Thants a deal............... Right now I'm just thinking of hosting a few "think tables" to discuss the issues. I have a really good book from NOHVCC re site plans and details for OHV parks / staging areas / trail building etc. I think we can start with some "visions" to enable us to produce actual site plans for what we need. I think between BLM and the applicants I can get us into the area connecting to the landfill site itself. Between an actual site visit and Googleearth we should be able to get a feel of what we can work with. As stated earlier......... the anti-access groups want this preserved which simply means "psuedo wilderness". This was the suggestion of P&Z so if we can show "multi-use" in a responsible way we may come out of this deal better than we anticipated. What we do need to do is be firm on stipulations needed.

More soon.

amber.hodge
08-20-2007, 06:59 AM
Thanks Amber......... this probably was Doug Larson, member of the Classic Broncos. He had been for approving the landfill for all the mentioned reasons. He was right in all other than he was much too trusting. He did have the support of his club but he was the only club supporting this landfill unquestioned. I do not believe he feels this way today. I had met with Doug the day before the P&Z meeting and a group of us had lunch together that day discussing the underlying issues.......... i.e.: The applicants had told him, and others, they would donate the land and build a staging area. That lasted only as long as OHV jumped to their every whim. When they were ticked that the OHV Coalition had requested "time" and "more research of facts and data" they immediately PULLED THE STAGING AREA". Long story later, Doug was at the P&Z meeting and saw firsthand how the P&Z Commissioners "wanted more documentation and facts" and did not like having something crammed down their throats. Neither the OHV Coalition (of which AZVJC are Charter Members) or the ASA4WDC asked to deny the landfill site or plans. We just wanted more than "lip service". Maybe I've been working with the feds or the political field too long but "lip service" simply doesn't do it any longer. There must be compromise and trust from both sides and that was not a componant of this deal. I'm thinking it will now. Actually, probably not trust but they will listen to OHV. For some reason they really wanted OHV support.......... maybe because of our numbers but they also felt they "had us in their pocket due to the staging area and paving". Don't think they expected questions.

Hopefully we can keep the upper hand with our knowledge and compromise. Their lack of willingness to settle for anything outside their desires which will hurt them so I believe they will regroup over the next couple of months. Wondering how much smoke they'll try blowing this time.???

Yep, that is the right Chief Warrant Officer :D he's got a sweet bronco with a ton of dough sunk into it - Well, I guess if that is the way things are panning out, then I'm for listening to those of you who know more.

Sandee McCullen
08-20-2007, 03:04 PM
Yep, that is the right Chief Warrant Officer :D he's got a sweet bronco with a ton of dough sunk into it - Well, I guess if that is the way things are panning out, then I'm for listening to those of you who know more.

Speaking of the Army National Guard............ all ANG plans have changed significantly. There will be no more artillary actions in this area thusly the area will NOT be fenced. This fact alone eliminates problems regarding transportation in and out of the area as well as casual use going around the area on live fire days. Yes, this offers a definite problem re the Land Dept. selling the land to developers but the MGCP have met with the Morrison Inst. (have been the developers of the Superstition Vistas "VISION" for the future of Pinal County). Just before their proposal went to print they squeezed in their SUPPORT for the MGCP plans of Open Space for multi-recreation. They are going back to the table for continuing planning so we (MGCP/OHV) need to continue reminding them their final plan/vision should reflect "no tile roofs and golf courses in this area".

The land dept. are being very difficult (MORE so than normal) regarding recreation use of State Trust Lands. hmmmmmmmmm ............. when the lands were given to the State in 1912 I don't believe there was much in the way of "motorized recreation"........... or any recreation for that matter, on State Lands. We need to push / lobby our Representators and Senators to CHANGE or update the Constitution involving the goals or mandates regarding State Trust Lands.

It may be the landfill may be a "good deal" for recreationists to waive the developers in a different direction but there are numerous underlying issues that may directly affect the casual user of the FJ area.

More soon.

Sandee McCullen
08-21-2007, 05:22 PM
I can attend with you Sandee. I live in Pinal Co. just east of Queen Creek and will attend any meetings with you. Lets tell maricopa to take their trash elsewhere! THey have all that land in the south near Gila Bend right?!

Allen,
Please PM me regarding dates, times, availability to meet with OHV reps and the attorney/lobbyist for the applicants. Anyone else that knows the area and is interested in meeting and finding a middle ground for some of the planning for the surrounding area near the landfill.

ROCRWLR
08-21-2007, 05:40 PM
Currently there are 2 landfills in mobile just north of 238 on 99th ave. there were plans for a 3rd until Goodyear anexed mobile. Goodyear told mobile residents they would not let the 3rd land fill be built.

Dean

amber.hodge
08-21-2007, 05:44 PM
Speaking of the Army National Guard............ all ANG plans have changed significantly. There will be no more artillary actions in this area thusly the area will NOT be fenced. This fact alone eliminates problems regarding transportation in and out of the area as well as casual use going around the area on live fire days. Yes, this offers a definite problem re the Land Dept. selling the land to developers but the MGCP have met with the Morrison Inst. (have been the developers of the Superstition Vistas "VISION" for the future of Pinal County). Just before their proposal went to print they squeezed in their SUPPORT for the MGCP plans of Open Space for multi-recreation. They are going back to the table for continuing planning so we (MGCP/OHV) need to continue reminding them their final plan/vision should reflect "no tile roofs and golf courses in this area".

The land dept. are being very difficult (MORE so than normal) regarding recreation use of State Trust Lands. hmmmmmmmmm ............. when the lands were given to the State in 1912 I don't believe there was much in the way of "motorized recreation"........... or any recreation for that matter, on State Lands. We need to push / lobby our Representators and Senators to CHANGE or update the Constitution involving the goals or mandates regarding State Trust Lands.

It may be the landfill may be a "good deal" for recreationists to waive the developers in a different direction but there are numerous underlying issues that may directly affect the casual user of the FJ area.

More soon.

Sandee - I wouldn't speak so soon on that...Howitzers are gone but there will still be munitions of all sorts fired out there.

Also, the states are being given the right to train their own troops for combat to decrease the deployments from 18 months to 11 months overseas with only 1 month instead of up to 6 at the premob station. This will mean extensive lanes training sites and such built in areas such as this one. Currently the state has Infantry, AVIATION (Helos), Transportation, Explosive Ordinance Disposal, Maintenance/engineers - all will have to have facilities to train on their given Equipment set for what their unit does. This was given in a briefing last month at drill.

Sandee McCullen
08-21-2007, 11:12 PM
Sandee - I wouldn't speak so soon on that...Howitzers are gone but there will still be munitions of all sorts fired out there.

Also, the states are being given the right to train their own troops for combat to decrease the deployments from 18 months to 11 months overseas with only 1 month instead of up to 6 at the premob station. This will mean extensive lanes training sites and such built in areas such as this one. Currently the state has Infantry, AVIATION (Helos), Transportation, Explosive Ordinance Disposal, Maintenance/engineers - all will have to have facilities to train on their given Equipment set for what their unit does. This was given in a briefing last month at drill.

The LAnd Use Permit authorizes ANG only 22 days of use and most of these authorized days were not "live fire" days. I realize there will be small gun firing and maneuvers but the area, as previously planned, will NOT be fenced and ANG are not sure how long they will continue paying the ridiculous fees to State Land. Fees more than tripled this year. The landfill applicants were worried how they would control traffic on "firing days" when Cottonwood Canyon would be closed........ this is no longer an issue. I'm assuming we'll continue as has been done for a number of years past. When ANG are in the area they will fly the red flag at the entrance. If this landfill is approved the applicants will purchase the right-of-way and pave Cottonwood Canyon Rd. This road will then become a PUBLIC road of Pinal County that cannot be restricted or closed to the public.

I don't think I said ANG was going away..... just that a number of issues have changed. The plans to fence and gate Cottonwood Canyon is the major issue that is now a moot point.