Sunday wheeling?

[Huck]

Any takers for some 4.0+ wheeling on Sunday? TM or FJ trails are fine by me. After seeing all of the Predator shots last week, I'm jonesing.

My 'playdate' cancelled for tomorrow and I'm looking for another rig or two to run with, just in case.

Worse case, I'll just be up at TM around 9AM tomorrow morning and I'll see if anyone shows up to run with. I'll check back later, for any interest.
Sorry for the late notice, but my buddy just cancelled today,
Huck

[LOST TJ]

I'd be up for wheeling tomorrow Huck. I have done Lower Terminator and JD several times, so i'm good for those. I have never done Predator but would love too. I can be at the air down spot at 9 am no problem. Let me know. Thanks.

[SHNIPE]

Ill be over at Pleasant! if i get bored lookin at half dressed cuties ill come over and ... what am i saying??!?!

[k7mto]

Since I had to pass up wheelin' with Pat today (had to take the kids to the Ren Fest) I might be up for some wheelin' tomorrow, Dave.

I've never been to TM so I'm not sure where the air down spot is. You know I don't mind hard trails but having to drive up from Gilbert, I want to be somewhat confident I'll be able to drive back home afterward :)

Post up some *precise* directions to the meeting spot and I'll see if I can make it.

If you have a cell #, PM it to me so I can call you in the AM and let you know if I'm coming up or not (wouldn't want to drive all the way up there and miss you).

[Wind_Danzer]

Travel north on I-17.

Go past Anthem and about another 5 miles will be the exit for TM. It says "Table Mesa Rd."

Take that exit and at the stop turn left and go back over the highway.

Make the 1st right after crossing the bridge over the highway. Take that road (TM Rd.) north and about 300+ feet after it goes to dirt is a pull off/air down area on the left. That is where everyone meets up.

I may be up for a TM run tomorrow. Unde the advise of DR. Lost TJ I have taken some pills to make the headache go away. ;)

[k7mto]

Thanks, Jamie. That's much better than "meet at the air down spot" which is all TM runs usually say :)

[LOST TJ]

Lost TJ I have taken some pills to make the headache go away.


Hopefully you are feeling better. :D

[k7mto]

btw - what's the last fuel stop along 17 on the way up there?

[LOST TJ]

btw - what's the last fuel stop along 17 on the way up there?

I would have to say Anthem. Some one will speak up if i'm wrong.

[Wind_Danzer]

Yep, Anthem. Exit the highway cross back over and then choose between the two or three places. :)

[Huck]

Matt,
I'll PM you the cell #, I would like to run with you again. My junk is a little different than the last time you saw it.
Jamie's directions are dead on. I'll have the CB on 4 and the cell gets reception there.

If you are coming from the 60 to the 10 to the 17, you can meet up with me and drive up. I'm right off of the 17 and Glendale..... I usually gas up at the Diamond Shamrock at Union Hills and 17. Its the cheapest gas I've found (with snack foods) on the way up to TM.

If you are taking the 60 and swinging around on the 101, then Anthem may be your best bet. I wouldn't worry about running out of gas, if gas up anywhere around the 17 and 101, so Deer Valley gas stations would be fine, as well. I can always fill my two Gerry cans for you, if that is needed.

You should be fine running the trails up at Table Mesa, I know your rig and skills are more than adequate. WE should be able to get you home in one piece, too. I really want to do a 4.0+ trail to keep testing out the suspension. I've done a lot of the trails out there and would be up for seeing a new one or two. I know that Jamie has been out on some I want to try (i.e. XXX, etc), so it would be an asset to have her along.

My rig is competent and I'll have along the recovery gear and some spare parts for the TJ crowd.

I'm looking forward to some 80+ degree wheeling weather.
Lets plan on 9AM out at TM. Matt, if you want to meet up with me, we need to be rolling around 8:15 or so, to be on time.
Let's crawl,
Huck

[Griswold]

You guys will have some company tomorrow. ;)

[Huck]

Nice,
Its shaping up to be a good showing.
Huck

[k7mto]

I'm not worried about running out of gas, just want to top off before heading to the trails. I'm sure I can make it in/out without to omuch damage. Heck, anything I can break up there I can break in FJ and I drive there all the time, so I'm sure I'd be OK.

If I do come up, I'll probably leave home around 7:00 so I can get a bite to eat on the way. I would definetely go 60/101/17 so if I go I'll meet you up there.

I'll call you around 8:00 to let you know.

Matt

[xFallen]

We have a group showing up at the TM staging area for 9:00 am blast off also. We didn't post up in order to keep the group managable. Funny thing is we planned to run Predator also as a shakedown run (3.5 ish trail) then something more gnarly after that.

It could be a rather large crowd.

Hopefully everyone is appropriately prepared. :D

See y'all in the am.


Barry

[DesertX04]

I wanna play! It only sounds like a couple w/Huck so far, and don't want to impose if the group is too large...I understand not wanting a parking lot on the trail.

Cheap gas can also be had at Costco off of Yorkshire, basically same exit as Union Hills.

Alan

[Wind_Danzer]

Possibly you make 4 with him so I doubt that is imposing. I'm sure we could run something else besides the crew thatr is with Batrry to give them a head start if we don't combine groups. :D

I plan to be there with Rachel as my co-pilot.

[Huck]

Alright, Roll call,

The way I count it, we have:
Wind_Danzer & Rachel
K7mto
Lost TJ
Griz
DesertX04
Myself and Jamie
Barry and crew
I know every rig but two and they are set up well. I'm still breaking in my junk and I think this is just what the doctor ordered.
I was wanting a fun day in the Desert and it looks like its shaping up to be.
C-Ya in the morning,
Huck

[xFallen]

Possibly you make 4 with him so I doubt that is imposing. I'm sure we could run something else besides the crew thatr is with Batrry to give them a head start if we don't combine groups. :D

I plan to be there with Rachel as my co-pilot.

I really wish my junk was ready. :(

I am riding shotgun too. That just means I can focus more on heckling and taking incriminating pictures of silly rock crawler tricks. :cool:

[Jeeppeepin]

I'm with you Batrry!! :)
Let the hecking begin. And pictures as proof (or blackmail).

[Wind_Danzer]

Will be there still but the day is already starting off eventful. Someone sliced Rachel's tire so I will now be picking her up. Should still be there by 9am but wanted to post up.

I have Brian's celly so I'll call if we do run late.

[DesertX04]

Hope you guys had a good time, I'm sure you did. I had to turn back due to losing air becasue of a bent wheel that I thought I had fixed -it was fine last weekend. :mad: The bright side is that I'll be getting new wheels and tires this week for the Cracks. No longer will I be the Little Guy on 33's. ;)

[bruce farthing]

I run the Cracks on 32"s
bruce F.
01 XJ

[k7mto]

Dave, et al... Sorry I missed you guys. I arrived early and since Joe/Jim and gang were pulling out I tagged along with them under the assumption we'd be doing the same trails and we'd all meet up somewhere. We had a good time, as I'm sure, did you guys. I'll post up the few pics I managed to get today as soon as I get the dl'd.

[SavageSun4x4]

Got out there late couldn't find anyone, called on channel 4 but no answer. Ran lower Terminator and bent my track bar like a banana:confused: Not ever sure how...

[Wind_Danzer]

Matt,

I'm glad your first outing to TM was a good one. :)

Don,

Sorry we missed you, we went to Predator and were there for close to 3 hours then visited XXX while Brian and Huck checked out Raw Deal.

Pics to come soon, I need to bathe. :D

[xFallen]

Pics for starters.

Please be patient as they are loading now and not all may show up for a little while.

We had seven rigs in our group. Daryl, Todd, Travis, Jamie, Huck, Brian and Jeff. All TJs. All 35" or better and ready to rock. Travis drove his Rubicon on 33' tires. I rode along with Daryl and Rachel rode with Jamie.

We headed out to Predator after trying really hard to lose Tood (Daryl's brother) at the staging area. Oops. After getting Todd back inth e group we hit the trail. Another small group had passed us on the way in but somehow we managed to get by them on Predator which was just as well. They ended up having to retreat with equipment troubles.

Predator was a shakedown run for a few of the rigs with recent mods. This fun trail is really about a 3.5+. It can be run on 33" rubber and open diffs if you know what you are doing. It will spank you hard (like any trail) if you don't. Lockers are a very good idea on this trail and 35" tires make the difference. The obstacles are a bit bigger and the opportunties for messing up more abundant.

All in all it was a great day of wheeling. We really wanted to run XXX or something after Predator, but a few little gremlims held us from that. Next time out we'll run the big trail first and play on the little ones on the way back.

Thanks for the fun today everyone!


Predator

Jeff

Brian

We have a crowd of onlookers at the first Predator obstacle

Daryl

Jeff

Brian

Huck

Jamie

[xFallen]

Travis

Brian

Huck

Jamie

Todd, Daryl's brother

Todd

Travis

[xFallen]

Brian

Brian

Brian

Brian

Brian

Jeff

Jeff

Jamie

[xFallen]

Travis

Travis - he is on 33" tires and did great but also is looked front and rear and has 4:1 in the xfer case

Travis

Daryl

Daryl

Jeff

Brian

Brian

[xFallen]

Brian

Brian

Huck

Huck

Huck

[xFallen]

The start of XXX. This is a 4.5 rated trail and not to be taken too lightly. It'll get you. You need good tries, low gears, full lockers and no fear of body damage. A winch may be required even for larger rigs.

Daryl

Jeff

Jeff

Todd

Daryl turning around to leave XXX

Daryl back to the trail head


During the trek to the XXX trailhead we lost a valve stem in Daryl's rig -- driver rear. We stopped, put his spare on and repaired the valve stem. No worries, off we go to the trail head. We get a 100 feet into the trail and Daryl makes the mistake of asking me to move his rig forward. I catch a valve stemon the passenger rear and it breaks (yes breaks,) the metal part right off leaving the stem intact, but the core leaks air. Because we now had just no spare tire and Daryl's rig was the only one with a winch, and it was starting to get late after the various tire repairs, we turned around.


Barry

[Wind_Danzer]

Here are a few pics from today. Predator was awesome as a few of the people in the group had never run it before. Travis on his itty bitty 33's spanked a good few of us, not getting stuck once. I have to say this go around was harder for me then the first. A few stupid mistakes got me hung up and a little more body damage. I did finally break in one of the rails though so it's not as pretty anymore.

Here are some pics from Predator.

Huck in the first waterfall area:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdciz7.jpg

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdckth.jpg

Todd coming up the right side:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdcl8j.jpg

Travis doing the same:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdcoiw.jpg

Todd flexing one way:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdcoxt.jpg

Travis the other:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdcp5j.jpg

Jeff working the chute area:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdcqvd.jpg

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdcqz6.jpg

Brian all flexy:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdcu3d.jpg

Travis flexing out and lifting the tire:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdcuhx.jpg

[Wind_Danzer]

We christened Jamie's Boulder today. I needed to get winched off it with a friendly little tug from Huck (I paid him back a few moments later) :

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdcvsy.jpg

Here's Huck getting some air:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdcxs0.jpg

Travis working his way through:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdcydf.jpg

After this we did lunch and decided that some wanted to do XXX while some wanted to head out to Raw Deal. So we parted ways and I tagged along with the XXX crowd. I was debating on trying it but decided in the end to snap pics instead. On the way there we found Daryl's Valve Stem Rock.

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdd0t2.jpg

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdd177.jpg

After a relatively quick tire change we were onward to XXX and to lots of water in the beginning:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdd1mr.jpg

Daryl going in:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdd3yt.jpg

Jeff:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdd4ip.jpg

Todd:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdd4qr.jpg

Barry caused this "opps" on Daryl's rig and this was Daryl's "MacGyver Fix of the Day":

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdd5dj.jpg

This was the end to our day as the rigs needed to turn around so that Daryl could get to flat ground, change out to his spare and head on out.

We all had a blast though with great people, entertaining spectators on the main first obstacle of Predator, and many LOL moments.

Can't wait to do it again all!!!

[Wind_Danzer]

An no posting could be complete without my favorite pics of the day. :D

My dumbarse getting my west side branding finally:

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdda0z.jpg

"Hey Jeff, what's that smell?"

http://i1.tinypic.com/sdd8j7.jpg

And no post could be complete without showing off the new off roaders trampoline...

"Boingy, boingy, boingy"

http://i1.tinypic.com/sddaj9.jpg

:D :D :D

[Renob]

This looks more like a scene from the film "Broke Bead Mountain" :eek:
And no post could be complete without showing off the new off roaders trampoline...

"Boingy, boingy, boingy"

http://i1.tinypic.com/sddaj9.jpg

:D :D :D

[LOST TJ]

I had a blast everyone. Thanks for the fun and the help. I can't wait to get out and do it again. :D Great pics.

[Jeeppeepin]

Excellent pics as usual! Had a great time playing camera girl again.
Good to meet new people (Huck and Jamie).
I guess you CAN use duct tape on anything:D !

Thanks to everyone who came over and helped with my tire change. Too much flex is not always a good thing. (stop it Barry!;) )
But after looking at the damage, seems that it was not a malicious tire slashing after all. *sigh of relief*.

Hopefully soon I will get my junk back to 4by status and wheel again, but until then, I'll happily resort to camera biotch.:D

Lets do it again (Barry...... about that lube production.....)

[Huck]

Thanks to everyone that showed up and those that tried. You all made both Jamie's and my day. I've been itching to run Predator and got to during the day. We had a great group. Especially, when you consider that as of Saturday afternoon, we were in search of some wheeling partners.

Matt, it was fun playing phone tag on the trail. I'm sure that we'll hook up next time. I'm do for a run out in FJ in two weeks or so. It sounds like we ran a similar set of trails, but in opposite order. You were also able to get in one more trail, since you were running with only three rigs and in very capable company, I might add.

Good people, make for good days. Sorry for missing you DOn. I didn't know you were coming along and all we heard was some ch4 chatter while out on Predator.
Brian, Zach, Jamie and I returned back for Raw Deal after running Predator. It seems like we missed most of the carnage on the way to XXX. We ran Raw Deal from side to side and in circles:D . When you've only got two rigs (and a few bullets flying nearby) you pretty much get to use Raw Deal as a personal half pipe. No carnage to report from our second run, just extreme angles and lift testing.

We ended the day witha series of Yoga poses and Brian showed some impressive balance, at the end of the day. But that's another story.
Thanks for the pics. We only grabbed a few and I'll try to get them up on a webshots album before too awful much longer.
Thanks for crawling with us,
Huck

[mingoglia]

....Where ever John goes, sarcasm follows.

[Wind_Danzer]

Funny how a trail run can garner such interest with one-day notice and a clean up can't with two-weeks...:rolleyes:

WOW! Looks like you all had a great time! Sure glad you were able to put together a run on one day's notice!

John, what.... you didn't get a response the first time you posted so you felt the need to do it again. :rolleyes:

I like ya man, but this is childish. Some went on a run while others did a clean up. I'm glad you feel the need to chastise those of us that felt like spending the day in the rocks burning fossil fuels and polluting our environment instead of finding some kick arse wooden ducks and cleaning up others messes. I don't feel the need to justify myself and my choice like some others in Hunter's thread do. I think it is time you deal with it.

I think maybe we found our next Internet e-tough guy for this week.

[DsrtJeeper]

Great pics!!! I have to ask....after wheeling with Brian; how do the others feel about the TBT lift? Not looking for controversy, but everything lately seems to point to who's lift has the most flex.

[Wind_Danzer]

Huck had the Nth Degree lift and it seemed both Brian's and his did very well for what it is worth.

Huck will have to explain the feeling he had with his as it seems while lifting a tire here and there he said it felt very stable.

[LOST TJ]

I think maybe we found our next Internet e-tough guy for this week.

Watch out Jamie or he will call you out. :eek: :rolleyes: :D
John, it seems that you are just looking for trouble now. Nobody responded to your BS post yesterday so you have to start up again today? WTF is your problem? I don't need you commenting on or trying to police my actions. I also don't need you to try and be my virtual conscience. I went wheeling with some great people and had a great time on a last minute notice. BFD. Mind your own business and **** you panzy *** biatch. I won't play your debate game and will not play your childish BS. If you want me to hurt you just ask or call me out. I will be happy too.

[xFallen]

Great pics!!! I have to ask....after wheeling with Brian; how do the others feel about the TBT lift? Not looking for controversy, but everything lately seems to point to who's lift has the most flex.

The TBT lift no doubt allows a lot of flex. I doubt it has any more than the RK lift on my TJ which is also shod with 37" tires. We'd have to ramp to be sure. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

After watching the Nth Degree lift in action it doesn't appear to have near the flex on the same obstacles as other lifts that day. I noticed it carried the front end earlier and longer than similarly sized RK and RE rigs.

Flex isn't everything, of course, but just addressing the original question based on watching all the rigs closely for the trail (I was a passenger/photographer/spotter this trip) . I am sure I have pictures of many of the rigs on the same obstacles that demonstrate some of that.

The rigs that flexed the most had either RK or Brian's, but that's hardly a representative sample.

The Nth Degree lift seemed to be stable, certainly allows for good clearance, and overall carried Huck's rig pretty much where he pointed it, it doesn't seem to be what I would call a suspension for the hard core crawler. Predator is a fun trail, but hardly the best test for the severe suspension. I was hoping to see it work on something like XXX where you have somewhat more bizarre line opportunities and challenging obstacles.


Barry

[Huck]

Brian's junk flexed well and per him, his rig works the suspension much more, now that he has the full cradle. It makes sense, he's pulled any flex out of the frame and placed it all in the hands of his suspension. Since I was following Brian, I got a good view of the 'workout'. You can tell that he has had the lift installed for a bit and has it 'tuned' to work with those big 'ol tars.
When playing on Raw Deal, we went wherever the other guy went. I'm still surprised at how well my lift gets 'into' a climb. The darn thing, just digs in and walks up stuff. Balance is incredible and it seems like the whole suspension works very well together. I can tune my heap to provide more drop, but for now, I really like the way it is set up. For just getting into it, the lift has been running flawlessly and predictably. No complaints and no jealousy either.
Now to just keep it all together for the drive to Moab later this month.
Huck

[xFallen]

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b239/0IIII0/Pitythefool.gif

Please keep this high-school drama crap out of the trips and trail runs area and in the off-topic discussion area where it belongs.

I don't see the moderator for this forum so I have PMed others.

John, take it elsewhere please. There are other forums on this very board designed for this. Your high-school antics and youthful arrogance are wearing very thing.


Barry

[xFallen]

Brian's junk flexed well and per him, his rig works the suspension much more, now that he has the full cradle. It makes sense, he's pulled any flex out of the frame and placed it all in the hands of his suspension. Since I was following Brian, I got a good view of the 'workout'. You can tell that he has had the lift installed for a bit and has it 'tuned' to work with those big 'ol tars.
When playing on Raw Deal, we went wherever the other guy went. I'm still surprised at how well my lift gets 'into' a climb. The darn thing, just digs in and walks up stuff. Balance is incredible and it seems like the whole suspension works very well together. I can tune my heap to provide more drop, but for now, I really like the way it is set up. For just getting into it, the lift has been running flawlessly and predictably. No complaints and no jealousy either.
Now to just keep it all together for the drive to Moab later this month.
Huck

You mentioned something I did not consider when I posted -- tunable droop. Without me going to Nth's site, can you share how that works on that lift?

I wanted to spend some quality time under your Jeep looking at that lift, but maybe not on the first date, huh? :rolleyes: :cool:


Barry

[LOST TJ]

Please keep this high-school drama crap out of the trips and trail runs area and in the off-topic discussion area where it belongs.

I don't see the moderator for this forum so I have PMed others.

John, take it elsewhere please. There are other forums on this very board designed for this. Your high-school antics and youthful arrogance are wearing very thing.


Barry

Barry. Sorry to post something up like i did, but John's crap is just getting old. You know me and i try to be polite, helpfull and don't ever just spout off here. I've been here about 2 years and still have only around 200 posts. I try to only respond where it counts and if i have nothing good to type i do not type it. I will leave it at that and not continue. If i offened anybody besides John i am sorry. John, i never threatened you. I left the decision up to you if you want to be hurt. It is in your hands. Cya on the trail. :D

[Huck]

Many things are tuneable on everyone's suspension. Shock choice, limiting straps, antirock's or the equivalent.... As we learn our lifts and the way they react we each tune our own lifts. So, to a great extent all lifts are tuneable. My current set up does limit the amount of drop on the front axle, but gets sick amounts of flex out of the rear axle. Running discoed on the front and running a swaybar on the back, I like having the limited droop on the front axle. The idea is "a system that works well together". I can honestly say that this lift, does just that. It works well from front to back. I never felt out of control and was amazed at the control I had over Jeep with clutch play and brakes. Having a hanging axle, is not a bad thing (having lockers helps with this) and it can help with weight and power transfer. From the pictures, it looks like the front is behaving as I had hoped it to do. The springs are at what appears to be full extension and the spacer is still in place. At full drop my front springs are not hanging loose and are an active part of the suspension, still.... That was what I was hoping for (I can always go with a longer shock up front to get more droop, but I'm not sold on that concept). Remember, I'm not running extremely long springs-they are only 4.5" lifted springs and are the 'B' rate or heavy springs. The heap still flexes well with the heavy rate, short, springs.

Regarding the comment about the lift not being for the serious rock crawler. I'll leave that one alone. I believe the system answers a lot of what was wrong with other 'serious' lift systems out there. The lift is still proving itself to me and the rest of the masses. As it stacks up, run after run and mile after mile, time will tell how well it works or doesn't. I do believe it is a lift for a serious rock crawler and installed it for that purpose.
Huck

Feel free to have a good look at the lift anytime. Seeing a rear axle with no upper control arms is always exciting, so I understand not wanting to go there on the first date;) .

[xFallen]

Barry. Sorry to post something up like i did, but John's crap is just getting old. You know me and i try to be polite, helpfull and don't ever just spout off here. I've been here about 2 years and still have only around 200 posts. I try to only respond where it counts and if i have nothing good to type i do not type it. I will leave it at that and not continue. If i offened anybody besides John i am sorry. John, i never threatened you. I left the decision up to you if you want to be hurt. It is in your hands. Cya on the trail. :D

No, Travis, it wasn't aimed at you. In fact, my post doesn't even belong here and I shoulnd't continue it in this forum...I hear your frustration and you are far from alone.

I just want the BS in an area where I don't have to look at it...you could filter the noise makers and trolls out in the days of NTP, but today these boards are often ruined by a few who seem bent on tarnishing things needlessly.


Barry

[Joe West]

This is an excellent thread... nice pics... good wheeling. Let's everyone please drop the negative comments.

Whether you choose to wheel or pick up garbage or both... it's your decision and no one should make comments about what you decide to do with your time. We are all free adults, and we can choose to do whatever we want to do and we should be able to do it without criticism.

Thanks for understanding.

Joe

[LOST TJ]

No, Travis, it wasn't aimed at you. In fact, my post doesn't even belong here and I shoulnd't continue it in this forum...I hear your frustration and you are far from alone.

I just want the BS in an area where I don't have to look at it...you could filter the noise makers and trolls out in the days of NTP, but today these boards are often ruined by a few who seem bent on tarnishing things needlessly.


Barry

10-4............

[4 Wheelers Supply]

This is an excellent thread... nice pics... good wheeling. Let's everyone please drop the negative comments.

Whether you choose to wheel or pick up garbage or both... it's your decision and no one should make comments about what you decide to do with your time. We are all free adults, and we can choose to do whatever we want to do and we should be able to do it without criticism.

Thanks for understanding.

Joe
Thanks Joe
Could you tell my wife that?:rolleyes:

[DsrtJeeper]

The TBT lift no doubt allows a lot of flex. I doubt it has any more than the RK lift on my TJ which is also shod with 37" tires. We'd have to ramp to be sure. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

After watching the Nth Degree lift in action it doesn't appear to have near the flex on the same obstacles as other lifts that day. I noticed it carried the front end earlier and longer than similarly sized RK and RE rigs.

Flex isn't everything, of course, but just addressing the original question based on watching all the rigs closely for the trail (I was a passenger/photographer/spotter this trip) . I am sure I have pictures of many of the rigs on the same obstacles that demonstrate some of that.

The rigs that flexed the most had either RK or Brian's, but that's hardly a representative sample.

The Nth Degree lift seemed to be stable, certainly allows for good clearance, and overall carried Huck's rig pretty much where he pointed it, it doesn't seem to be what I would call a suspension for the hard core crawler. Predator is a fun trail, but hardly the best test for the severe suspension. I was hoping to see it work on something like XXX where you have somewhat more bizarre line opportunities and challenging obstacles.


Barry

Great review Barry and unbiased at that. My point for asking this question to begin with?

Hunter's BBQ each year features a RTI competition. A TBT lift won several years. A comment was recently made that the RK lift has the most flex of any bolt on lift. After viewing the run pics here; I really began to wonder. Keep in mind that the TBT lift uses a radius arm front. Radius arms are supposedly full of bind. I can't help but want to see a fair comparison on the ramp. This would include same length shocks and comparitive swaybar setups. I say equal length shocks between both vehicles because I suspect RK uses longer shocks that allows the coils to fall out on the trail.

The best two out of three? :D I'm such an instigator!:p

[xFallen]

Great review Barry and unbiased at that. My point for asking this question to begin with?

Hunter's BBQ each year features a RTI competition. A TBT lift won several years. A comment was recently made that the RK lift has the most flex of any bolt on lift. After viewing the run pics here; I really began to wonder. Keep in mind that the TBT lift uses a radius arm front. Radius arms are supposedly full of bind. I can't help but want to see a fair comparison on the ramp. This would include same length shocks and comparitive swaybar setups. I say equal length shocks between both vehicles because I suspect RK uses longer shocks that allows the coils to fall out on the trail.

The best two out of three? :D I'm such an instigator!:p

The limiting factors of flex for me are the sheet metal and frame so I dunno. Brian's rig seems set up correctly for that size of tire. Mine really is not, but it works.

The limiting points of the RK lift both comrpession and extension is shock length, not the lift. There is little or no bind. I would say none, but I really mean none detected by me. I have interference issues, some I can fix but won't since I am changing everything anyway, some inherent in the RK design.

On the trail in the very extreme stuff I know the RK kit works very well and is super tough. I keep tires on the ground more and it climbs fairly well most of the time.

I saw a few that would benefit from front center limit straps this weekend though -- unloading during climbs. Mine doesn't so much any more and it makes a world of difference, but that is not a lift specifc thing so much. All lifts seem to do that at some point unless they have loots of dive built in to the front suspension.

I don't know which would win on the ramp but I am pretty sure I could tweak mine to put on a dang good show. :D

Let's see...disconnect front of course....take off limit straps...remove at least one side of the rear sway bar...lower the tire pressure on front left and rear right...disconnect front left an rear right shocks...take out front right and rear right bump stops...put as many cinder blocks in the belly pan as will fit...I must be missing something... :rolleyes: Oh yeah...the D-Man to flop it off the ramp for me at a photo-opportunist moment! :D


Barry

[DsrtJeeper]

The limiting factors of flex for me are the sheet metal and frame so I dunno. Brian's rig seems set up correctly for that size of tire. Mine really is not, but it works.

The limiting points of the RK lift both comrpession and extension is shock length, not the lift. There is little or no bind. I would say none, but I really mean none detected by me. I have interference issues, some I can fix but won't since I am changing everything anyway, some inherent in the RK design.

On the trail in the very extreme stuff I know the RK kit works very well and is super tough. I keep tires on the ground more and it climbs fairly well most of the time.

I saw a few that would benefit from front center limit straps this weekend though -- unloading during climbs. Mine doesn't so much any more and it makes a world of difference, but that is not a lift specifc thing so much. All lifts seem to do that at some point unless they have loots of dive built in to the front suspension.

I don't know which would win on the ramp but I am pretty sure I could tweak mine to put on a dang good show. :D

Let's see...disconnect front of course....take off limit straps...remove at least one side of the rear sway bar...lower the tire pressure on front left and rear right...disconnect front left an rear right shocks...take out front right and rear right bump stops...put as many cinder blocks in the belly pan as will fit...I must be missing something... :rolleyes: Oh yeah...the D-Man to flop it off the ramp for me at a photo-opportunist moment! :D


Barry

Lol!!! Did you see that I included "equal length shocks between Jeeps" in the rules? :D I'm one step ahead of you. I think many would be surprised at even how much flex an RE LA lift can get with shocks removed. I've seen a radius armed early Bronco drive up and over the ramp with conventional long travel shocks connected. :eek: One of the highest scores I witnessed at Hunters was produced by a Scrambler on leaf springs! Anyone remember that about 3 years ago?

[SavageSun4x4]

I don't know which would win on the ramp but I am pretty sure I could tweak mine to put on a dang good show. :D

Let's see...disconnect front of course....take off limit straps...remove at least one side of the rear sway bar...lower the tire pressure on front left and rear right...disconnect front left an rear right shocks...take out front right and rear right bump stops...put as many cinder blocks in the belly pan as will fit...I must be missing something... :rolleyes: Oh yeah...the D-Man to flop it off the ramp for me at a photo-opportunist moment! :D


Barry
Therein lies the problem with the ramp. It lends itself to "cheating" or if that is too harsh a word then skewing the results.

I don't know if its possible to really get things equal enough to judge.

[xFallen]

Therein lies the problem with the ramp. It lends itself to "cheating" or if that is too harsh a word then skewing the results.

I don't know if its possible to really get things equal enough to judge.

There ya go.

There's a ton of stuff that works on the rocks, even stuff that by the numbers should not work as well as it does. What works for one, won't for someone else.

All I really know is, my poor abused heep of junk usually works pretty well. :D And when it doesn't get me through, my winch usually does. :rolleyes:


Barry

[Jeeppeepin]

I would be happy to donate my vehicle as a test subject for the RK lift.
Anyone with a 5.5" TBT lift that wants to play on the ramp? Let's check it out. Should be fun. :)

[4 Wheelers Supply]

Our Ramp is wide open. Bring it on! Saturday?

[Jeeppeepin]

If I can get 4wd by then, I'm game.

[xFallen]

If I can get 4wd by then, I'm game.

You "calling out" Brian then? :eek: :rolleyes: :D

[4 Wheelers Supply]

If I can get 4wd by then, I'm game.
???? What did you break???

[Jeeppeepin]

Still waiting to put the new front drive shaft in (friday) and I'm waiting for a replacement rear axle shaft. Then I should be back in business. It's just time that constrains me.
That and my apt complex won't let me work on my jeep here. Good thing too, cuz I'd probably make a big mess:D .

[1eagle]

Great pictures. Looks like you all had a great time. Make me wish that I would of waited to tear my heap down, But I guess I did not have a choise after the xxx run. Hopefully we can get her front drive shaft in on friday.:D

[Jeeppeepin]

You "calling out" Brian then? :eek: :rolleyes: :D

I'm calling out Brian.....
For curiosity sake, not that I think my hunk is better, just for the halibut.
;) However, his tires are much bigger than mine... would that make a difference?

[Hackle]

Bring it out to Girl Scout Car show Sat. It should make for a good show!
BTW I will have the video of the our Sunday run up soon.
Jim F.

[xFallen]

I'm calling out Brian.....
For curiosity sake, not that I think my hunk is better, just for the halibut.


Something's fishy here...


;) However, his tires are much bigger than mine... would that make a difference?

It's not the size of the tires it's the...hrm...it's the flex in the sidewall. :rolleyes:

Sheesh....yeah...just...nevermind.

[Wildcat455]

Whatever.
Let's talk about wheelin next sunday now!!

[Griswold]

I'm calling out Brian.....
For curiosity sake, not that I think my hunk is better, just for the halibut.
;) However, his tires are much bigger than mine... would that make a difference?

You would definately outramp me and you already did at the BBQ. My front end does not flex as much as yours. My secret is in my rear end.:D

[Griswold]

Thanks all. Myself and my virgin passenger had a good time. My inner voice rarely lies to me, so when I said I was going left there was nothing but good times on raw deal. And yes... I have yoga skills.:D

[SHNIPE]

LOL @ secret rear ends!

[xFallen]

Whatever.
Let's talk about wheelin next sunday now!!

Not that it wasn't fun on Predator, but I want to run something good. Anaconda then whatever. I need you to go in front, Bill, in case I can't make it up that second last fall. I need a winch point. :D

The goofy thing is, some people say the last fall is the tough one. That one was pretty easy last time -- just scooted right up without any drama.


Barry

[DsrtJeeper]

You would definately outramp me and you already did at the BBQ. My front end does not flex as much as yours. My secret is in my rear end.:D

Ahh; you give in to easily. Both of you need to disconnect the front completely, same tire pressure and same length shocks F&R. I say borrow Barry's shocks. ;) :D *Poke,poke*

[DsrtJeeper]

Not that it wasn't fun on Predator, but I want to run something good. Anaconda then whatever. I need you to go in front, Bill, in case I can't make it up that second last fall. I need a winch point. :D

The goofy thing is, some people say the last fall is the tough one. That one was pretty easy last time -- just scooted right up without any drama.


Barry

I think you're ready for Asylum. :eek:

[Griswold]

Not that it wasn't fun on Predator, but I want to run something good. Anaconda then whatever. I need you to go in front, Bill, in case I can't make it up that second last fall. I need a winch point. :D

The goofy thing is, some people say the last fall is the tough one. That one was pretty easy last time -- just scooted right up without any drama.


Barry

I'll run die hard with you but not starting at 2pm. I am always game for "good trails" . "Good trails" need to be done with good capable rigs. I could spend hours winching a rig with one locker and 33's thru a "good trail" but that is not very fun for me.
I had a great time Saturday but that is why I went left when most went right.

[xFallen]

Ahh; you give in to easily. Both of you need to disconnect the front completely, same tire pressure and same length shocks F&R. I say borrow Barry's shocks. ;) :D *Poke,poke*


My rear shocks are way too short compared to the RK ones. I wore them out in a handful of months then finally broken one. Giving someone my rear shocks would be crippling them.

Here are the RK 5.5" shock specs:

Front
compressed 19"
extended 31"

Rear
compressed 17.25"
extended 28"

At ride height after my springs settled a bit there was about 4" of compression available at the front and 4.5" at the rear. That means about 8" droop up front and 6.25" for the back.


Barry

[xFallen]

I think you're ready for an Asylum. :eek:


Fixed it for ya.

[xFallen]

I'll run die hard with you but not starting at 2pm. I am always game for "good trails" . "Good trails" need to be done with good capable rigs. I could spend hours winching a rig with one locker and 33's thru a "good trail" but that is not very fun for me.
I had a great time Saturday but that is why I went left when most went right.

Understood. If we go out to do proper 4.0-5.0 trail, it'll have to be 35" minimum and full lockers, plain and simple.

I might not want to start Die Hard at 2 pm either probably, but I dunno, I've yet to run it. I keep getting warned to have multiple sets of spares for the D30 if I do run it. Since going with the Alloy USA stuff I have yet to have any D30 issues and have run more and harder trails on these axles. No more Yukon parts for me.

We usually try and burn two or three trails in a day if we start at 9:00 am. Five or six capable rigs can easily do Anaconda plus Lower Terminator in the morning, CD in the afternoon, then hit Raw Deal on the way back for some play time and still be home before the dinner bell, Jeep lords willing of course, little or no breakage or at least quick repairs.

Anyway, presuming that my rig is ready, I want to do something next Sunday.


Barry

[jason]

well when you all figure out where your goin let me know. ill be in flagstaff snowboarding (fingers crossed for snow) on friday and saturday but id like to come back sunday morn to wheel with you fawkers if i can :D


keep me posted






damn it eric, you need to hurry up and get yer rig finished.


.

[Jeeppeepin]

You would definately outramp me and you already did at the BBQ. My front end does not flex as much as yours. My secret is in my rear end.:D


Well then, lets do it from behind..:eek: :D

[mingoglia]

Well then, lets do it from behind..:eek: :D

That can be taken in more ways than I'd care to admit so early in the morning so I'm going to go back to eating my breakfast and surfing.

[Wildcat455]

Well then, lets do it from behind..:eek: :D

Not every day you get an offer like that! :D

[Wildcat455]

That can be taken in more ways than I'd care to admit so early in the morning so I'm going to go back to eating my breakfast and surfing.

Got a Chubby? :eek: :eek: :D

[DsrtJeeper]

My rear shocks are way too short compared to the RK ones. I wore them out in a handful of months then finally broken one. Giving someone my rear shocks would be crippling them.

Here are the RK 5.5" shock specs:

Front
compressed 19"
extended 31"

Rear
compressed 17.25"
extended 28"

At ride height after my springs settled a bit there was about 4" of compression available at the front and 4.5" at the rear. That means about 8" droop up front and 6.25" for the back.


Barry

TBT uses the same in the rear and 10" up front if I remember correctly. I know it was a jump when I switched the fronts out to 11" of travel for more droop.

[DsrtJeeper]

Understood. If we go out to do proper 4.0-5.0 trail, it'll have to be 35" minimum and full lockers, plain and simple.

I might not want to start Die Hard at 2 pm either probably, but I dunno, I've yet to run it. I keep getting warned to have multiple sets of spares for the D30 if I do run it. Since going with the Alloy USA stuff I have yet to have any D30 issues and have run more and harder trails on these axles. No more Yukon parts for me.

We usually try and burn two or three trails in a day if we start at 9:00 am. Five or six capable rigs can easily do Anaconda plus Lower Terminator in the morning, CD in the afternoon, then hit Raw Deal on the way back for some play time and still be home before the dinner bell, Jeep lords willing of course, little or no breakage or at least quick repairs.

Anyway, presuming that my rig is ready, I want to do something next Sunday.


Barry

Brian and I both ran Diehard with no shaft breakage. I had Superiors in the 30 and Brian may have still had his stock 44 shafts. We were both running 37" tires. I think one guy broke a stock Dana 30 shaft. I cut a tire on the first damn obstacle! :rolleyes: "You can do it!" :D

[DsrtJeeper]

Fixed it for ya.

That was a given. :D Now go hit Asylum and take pics!!!

[DsrtJeeper]

well when you all figure out where your goin let me know. ill be in flagstaff snowboarding (fingers crossed for snow) on friday and saturday but id like to come back sunday morn to wheel with you fawkers if i can :D


keep me posted






damn it eric, you need to hurry up and get yer rig finished. .

I hear ya, buddy. I had a guy welding for me at the house and he got a full time job. The Heep is on jack stands and I'm having a hard time finding someone who will bring their welder here to work. Alot of people can weld, but I need a person who knows suspension and Jeeps. It would be easy if I could bring the Jeep to them. Poor planning on my part.

[xFallen]

Brian and I both ran Diehard with no shaft breakage. I had Superiors in the 30 and Brian may have still had his stock 44 shafts. We were both running 37" tires. I think one guy broke a stock Dana 30 shaft. I cut a tire on the first damn obstacle! :rolleyes: "You can do it!" :D

I have and carry spares and I am not really concerned. I know enough not to get bound up, it is just that sometimes things happen.

I am waiting for the right opportunity with a group of capable rigs and experienced drivers.


Barry

[xFallen]

That was a given. :D Now go hit Asylum and take pics!!!

Not just yet... :rolleyes: But I will in YOUR rig. Get it done so you can loan it to me. :D

[jason]

so you all decide on what yer running yet

[Jeeppeepin]

Oh, and who's got a seat available for camera biotch?
(Still riding on a twisted shaft :) )

I think you all should do Collateral Damage and what ever feels good after that depending on time and carnage.
Talk to me Goose, what do ya all think.......

[jason]

Oh, and who's got a seat available for camera biotch?
(Still riding on a twisted shaft :) )

I think you all should do Collateral Damage and what ever feels good after that depending on time and carnage.
Talk to me Goose, what do ya all think.......




ive got a place for ya to sit. . . err. . . . in my jeep that is:D

depending on what they decide to run

[DsrtJeeper]

ive got a place for ya to sit. . . err. . . . in my jeep that is:D

depending on what they decide to run

How did I know that was coming? :D

[Symon623]

How did I know that was coming? :D

Am surprised he's the only one??

[Symon623]

[QUOTE=Jeeppeepin]Oh, and who's got a seat available for camera biotch?
(Still riding on a twisted shaft :) )

Axle? or drive? front? or rear? When you get your new axle? have a seal and bearing put on it and keep it as a spare. I had the same problem and talked to the guy who cut and resplined it for me? He told me not to worry as long as I don't turn it the other way. Abused it that way for 6 years untill I went wider track, sold it and don't know where it's at today? Just an idea so you can ride in the left seat. Or put the new one in and keep twisty for the spare for 1 side only? Not sure if TJ rear 44's are different length?

[Symon623]

I'll be up there, followin my boys around on their quads. Won't get there untill about 11. Probably gonna cruise down to the lake and maybe come look for some of you??

[Griswold]

Well then, lets do it from behind..:eek: :D

I should have been paying closer attention to this thread!! Lets get it on...I already have my ramp out.:D

[DsrtJeeper]

I should have been paying closer attention to this thread!! Lets get it on...I already have my ramp out.:D

LMAO!!! I had to read that twice. :D

[Jeeppeepin]

I should have been paying closer attention to this thread!! Lets get it on...I already have my ramp out.:D

Sweet, sounds like a challenge.
As soon as I get my new shaft, I'm in!! Shouldn't be too long, or maybe it should...:p . We should make a big ordeal of it. Test em out, compare to different lift kits/self mods. Once a year at Christmas time isn't enough. Not with the way people change their heeps around here!:D

[Jeeppeepin]

[QUOTE=Jeeppeepin]Oh, and who's got a seat available for camera biotch?
(Still riding on a twisted shaft :) )

Axle? or drive? front? or rear? When you get your new axle? have a seal and bearing put on it and keep it as a spare. I had the same problem and talked to the guy who cut and resplined it for me? He told me not to worry as long as I don't turn it the other way. Abused it that way for 6 years untill I went wider track, sold it and don't know where it's at today? Just an idea so you can ride in the left seat. Or put the new one in and keep twisty for the spare for 1 side only? Not sure if TJ rear 44's are different length?

It is the D44 Rear Drivers side chromoly axle shaft that I twisted on XXX a few weeks ago. Along with the Ring and Pinion in the rear. No biggie, it'll get fixed. :cool:

[Jeeppeepin]

ive got a place for ya to sit. . . err. . . . in my jeep that is:D

depending on what they decide to run

Well, since you offered.... I'll sit in your jeep:p .
Now we all just need to decide what we're all doing and who's going......

Anyone....... Anyone.....

[DsrtJeeper]

Well, since you offered.... I'll sit in your jeep:p .
Now we all just need to decide what we're all doing and who's going......

Anyone....... Anyone.....

Better bring the Yager! :D

[Wind_Danzer]

Better bring the Yager! :D


Oh SNAP!!!! ;) :D :D :D

[Jeeppeepin]

Better bring the Yager! :D

I think I'll skip the Jager this time around. :D At least on the trail....
I don't want to wake up and not remember where my jeep went....:eek:

Common' peeps..... What do ya'll wanna do this Sunday????

[Huck]

I'm out for this weekend. Saturday is a Birthday party that we'll be taking the young ones to and Sunday is all about Bike Week and I'm playing with my other toys. I always make the 'PYO' party at Yaffe's shop and this year, its on Sunday.
For those that make it out, it looks to be an equally good day to be out in the rocks.
....a little birdie told me that I'll be out with a small group, running FJ, next weekend....
Have fun,
Huck

[SavageSun4x4]

What is the plan for Sunday??

[Symon623]

[QUOTE=Symon623]

It is the D44 Rear Drivers side chromoly axle shaft that I twisted on XXX a few weeks ago. Along with the Ring and Pinion in the rear. No biggie, it'll get fixed. :cool:

Twisted chromy? Any warranty? Replacement is good choice for Chromy. Are you on 35's or 37's? How did you get that much traction out of MTR's?

[xFallen]

[QUOTE=Jeeppeepin]

Twisted chromy? Any warranty? Replacement is good choice for Chromy. Are you on 35's or 37's? How did you get that much traction out of MTR's?


Hehe...now you went and done it. Bad mouthing the revered MTR! :cool: A religious holy war may ensue.

I agree though. My personal opinion is that I have never been impressed with them on a vehicle or watching one work. They have poor sidewalls for AZ rocks as witnessed repeatedly on the trail in the way of sidewall punctures. Some of that can be driver and just dumb luck I am sure. I am certain I now know more people who have switched from them than people that wheel them. There are lots on primarily road-going rigs. They seem to work well in that capacity. At least the DuraWall MT/R has three (3) plies unlike the old MTs which only had two.

But, whatever. People have different needs and expectations from a tire. Mine are that the thing will have traction over all else, well behaved at low or no pressure (stay on the rim) and be extremely tough to endure AZ's sharp rocks. I didn't mention road manners because I don't care, even though I drive my rig on the road. YMMV.


Barry

[SavageSun4x4]

So what is the when and where for Sunday??

[Symon623]

[QUOTE=Symon623]


Hehe...now you went and done it. Bad mouthing the revered MTR! :cool: A religious holy war may ensue.

I agree though. My personal opinion is that I have never been impressed with them on a vehicle or watching one work. They have poor sidewalls for AZ rocks as witnessed repeatedly on the trail in the way of sidewall punctures. Some of that can be driver and just dumb luck I am sure. I am certain I now know more people who have switched from them than people that wheel them. There are lots on primarily road-going rigs. They seem to work well in that capacity. At least the DuraWall MT/R has three (3) plies unlike the old MTs which only had two.

But, whatever. People have different needs and expectations from a tire. Mine are that the thing will have traction over all else, well behaved at low or no pressure (stay on the rim) and be extremely tough to endure AZ's sharp rocks. I didn't mention road manners because I don't care, even though I drive my rig on the road. YMMV.


Barry

Well it's funny Barry that you think I'm bashing MTR's. I have them in the 37" flavor. I love them. Not the best I know and everyone is allowed an opinion just like their allowed their certain body parts?:D
Had them for 3+ years, don't wheel as much as most and it's a trailer queen, but I'm in the midst of making it more streetable.
They've been through Die tryin (CO), Farmington NM, Most of the trails at TM and Skull Crusher. Only lost 1 sidewall, while drag racin on the fire road. Never on the trail?? Also put about 100 miles on them while toolin around Silverton/Ouray/Telluride CO as well.
I kinda like em. Losing traction beats breakin a axle. Or twisting one like in Jeeppeepin case??
Just my opinion to go with my certain body parts...:D
Price isn't bad either for a tire that size.

[xFallen]

Well it's funny Barry that you think I'm bashing MTR's. I have them in the 37" flavor. I love them. Not the best I know and everyone is allowed an opinion just like their allowed their certain body parts?:D


Sheesh. That thar is funny. :D :rolleyes:


Had them for 3+ years, don't wheel as much as most and it's a trailer queen, but I'm in the midst of making it more streetable.
They've been through Die tryin (CO), Farmington NM, Most of the trails at TM and Skull Crusher. Only lost 1 sidewall, while drag racin on the fire road. Never on the trail?? Also put about 100 miles on them while toolin around Silverton/Ouray/Telluride CO as well.
I kinda like em. Losing traction beats breakin a axle. Or twisting one like in Jeeppeepin case??
Just my opinion to go with my certain body parts...:D
Price isn't bad either for a tire that size.

Yeah, understood. They work well for many, not so much for others. It is nice to have choices.

Rachel's axle got bound up on one of the obstacles. It's an undercut plus sideall pressure thing that is the death of most any axle. Something has to give, and it usually isn't the rock. :D Too bad it twisted, but I am sure glad it didn't break because getting a rig off that trail at that point would not be fun... :eek:


Barry

[Jeeppeepin]

Ya, if I hadn't taken a winch at that point, I sure would have busted it.
I'm runnin' 35" MTR's, but it was a real tight spot I was in.
Thankfully it didn't break!
PS. I like MTR's, just not in the mud.

[Heinz57]

[QUOTE=xFallen]

Well it's funny Barry that you think I'm bashing MTR's. I have them in the 37" flavor. I love them. Not the best I know and everyone is allowed an opinion just like their allowed their certain body parts?:D
Had them for 3+ years, don't wheel as much as most and it's a trailer queen, but I'm in the midst of making it more streetable.
They've been through Die tryin (CO), Farmington NM, Most of the trails at TM and Skull Crusher. Only lost 1 sidewall, while drag racin on the fire road. Never on the trail?? Also put about 100 miles on them while toolin around Silverton/Ouray/Telluride CO as well.
I kinda like em. Losing traction beats breakin a axle. Or twisting one like in Jeeppeepin case??
Just my opinion to go with my certain body parts...:D
Price isn't bad either for a tire that size.

Sy, They Suck!:D

[DsrtJeeper]

The IROK's are closer to a true 37", seem to offer much better traction for many and can be had for cheaper than an equivalent MTR. If I had a trailer queen; it would be shodded with BFG Krawlers.

[mingoglia]

[QUOTE=Symon623]


Hehe...now you went and done it. Bad mouthing the revered MTR! :cool: A religious holy war may ensue.

I agree though. My personal opinion is that I have never been impressed with them on a vehicle or watching one work. They have poor sidewalls for AZ rocks as witnessed repeatedly on the trail in the way of sidewall punctures. Some of that can be driver and just dumb luck I am sure. I am certain I now know more people who have switched from them than people that wheel them. There are lots on primarily road-going rigs. They seem to work well in that capacity. At least the DuraWall MT/R has three (3) plies unlike the old MTs which only had two.

But, whatever. People have different needs and expectations from a tire. Mine are that the thing will have traction over all else, well behaved at low or no pressure (stay on the rim) and be extremely tough to endure AZ's sharp rocks. I didn't mention road manners because I don't care, even though I drive my rig on the road. YMMV.
Barry

You have just jinxed yourself Barry... I just saw Murphy pack his bag and vacate my couch and he said something about heading up your way... better make sure your bottle jack or high-lift is lubed in advance of your next trip...oh yeh, and make sure you don't forget your 4-way (and no this isn't a reference to Barry's extensive Girls Gone Wild video collection). :D :D :D

Mike

[Symon623]

[QUOTE=Symon623]

Sy, They Suck!:D

Easy for you to say Mr. 40" Comp Krawlers. You couldn't ever air yours down far enough to get them to work. Cos you didn't have your beadlocks yet. I'd love a set of your tires but then AI have to spend another $1400 on wheels and $1k on axles for the front 60 that isn't even in my hunk yet?? I'll take donations and sponsorships tho........:D

[Symon623]

Sheesh. That thar is funny. :D :rolleyes:



Yeah, understood. They work well for many, not so much for others. It is nice to have choices.

Rachel's axle got bound up on one of the obstacles. It's an undercut plus sideall pressure thing that is the death of most any axle. Something has to give, and it usually isn't the rock. :D Too bad it twisted, but I am sure glad it didn't break because getting a rig off that trail at that point would not be fun... :eek:


Barry

I know the feeling..Broke a rear 30 spline 44 on the last waterfall on Anaconda at last Jamboree.....Now I have D60 35 chromo from Moser. If I break one of these then I shouldn't have been there in the first place.
Might check into 39 irok bias once I get my 60 in the front?? Opinions?

[Simon]

SY, Simons got a violin for sale, want me to play it for ya!!!!:D

[xFallen]

I know the feeling..Broke a rear 30 spline 44 on the last waterfall on Anaconda at last Jamboree.....Now I have D60 35 chromo from Moser. If I break one of these then I shouldn't have been there in the first place.
Might check into 39 irok bias once I get my 60 in the front?? Opinions?

Naw...mine don't count. :D But since you asked...

Bias ply goes to Maxxis Creepy Crawlers. The biggest they seem to make is a 38"-ish jobbie. If they ride like my 37"s, they will ride just lovely for a 38 inch tire. I can tell you first hand that at 65 mph and about 5 psi they ride real comfy. :eek: :D

I still think the TSL/SX make a darn good rock crawling rubber and great all around trail tire. I had one set on full sized Blazer years ago and they outlasted the truck even though I really tried hard to destroy them.

I am impressed with how grippy the IROKs seem to be from watching them. I saw them on a buggy several weeks back and more recently Brian's (Griswold) rig a few weeks a go. They make these in a radial and bias ply as you know but I am not sure about sidewall or main tread block durability. Time will tell. Brian can probably give you a better review. He ran MT/Rs before these.

Those are about the only three tires I would consider this side of Comp Krawlers. With that sole exception, I think that for tires we mere mortals get to use (sorry Barry B., you don't qualify :D ) the Maxxis has them all beat hands down. Had I not bought them I probably would have TSL/SXs.


Barry

[Heinz57]

[QUOTE=Heinz57]

Easy for you to say Mr. 40" Comp Krawlers. You couldn't ever air yours down far enough to get them to work. Cos you didn't have your beadlocks yet. I'd love a set of your tires but then AI have to spend another $1400 on wheels and $1k on axles for the front 60 that isn't even in my hunk yet?? I'll take donations and sponsorships tho........:D

Dude, had bead locks ran them to 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10 lbs. you name it and they did not work. But for a good pavement and off road tire they are pretty darn good. But like Barry I would drive a biased swamper up to 70 mph before I owned another set. Wait I am Barry, oh hell you know what I mean:D And I don't recommend the Krawers in the comp compound to nobody. They are just like drugs, don't last long but you gotta have it.!

[Symon623]

[QUOTE=Symon623]

[QUOTE]Dude, had bead locks ran them to 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10 lbs. you name it and they did not work. But for a good pavement and off road tire they are pretty darn good. But like Barry I would drive a biased swamper up to 70 mph before I owned another set. Wait I am Barry, oh hell you know what I mean:D And I don't recommend the Krawers in the comp compound to nobody. They are just like drugs, don't last long but you gotta have it.!

Hmmmm Must just be the driver then??:D
I might do IROK's next?